The great DoC 1.8 UHV challenge
- Thread starter Leoreth
- Start date
strijder20
Wallowing in irony
I went for the Spanish UHV, and found it quite easy on Monarch (if you can get first to Optics, that is).
Some highlights:
Willem plotting for war?
And no, he wasn't in any war at that point.
Well, I guess this is one of the most unlikely master-vassal relations ever...
Amsterdam got conquered... again. This time, however, the Dutch lived happily forever after in their colonies
Just before victory.
I conquered France, which was a bit silly. You don't have to for the largest empire goal, just found some extra cities in the Americas. But it didn't completely destabilize me, so I feel content about doing it.
Some highlights:
Spoiler :
Willem plotting for war?
And no, he wasn't in any war at that point.Spoiler :
Well, I guess this is one of the most unlikely master-vassal relations ever...
Spoiler :
Amsterdam got conquered... again. This time, however, the Dutch lived happily forever after in their colonies
Spoiler :
Just before victory.
I conquered France, which was a bit silly. You don't have to for the largest empire goal, just found some extra cities in the Americas. But it didn't completely destabilize me, so I feel content about doing it.
Akbarthegreat
Angel of Junil
I went for the Spanish UHV, and found it quite easy on Monarch (if you can get first to Optics, that is).
Some highlights:
Spoiler :
Willem plotting for war?
Spoiler :
Well, I guess this is one of the most unlikely master-vassal relations ever...
Spoiler :
Amsterdam got conquered... again. This time, however, the Dutch lived happily forever after in their colonies
Spoiler :
Just before victory.
I conquered France, which was a bit silly. You don't have to for the largest empire goal, just found some extra cities in the Americas. But it didn't completely destabilize me, so I feel content about doing it.
Good for you, you didn't get a mega Mongolia. In one of my 1.73 games, I had to get the whole of NA and most of SA to get bigger than them.
Fresol
Angry Halfling in Green
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Turns out 10 culture is enough (15 in Epic speed).
Fresol
Angry Halfling in Green
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The thing is with resources on lone islands. You need to set a fort there as port, otherwise the resources are not connected. Also you need road to connect the spice to your city when they are on the same island, only this time you can build plantation instead of fort.
The same thing bothers me when I play Phoenicia, because if you want the copper then you lose the production bonus and vice versa.
Fresol
Angry Halfling in Green
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I still feel the Persian UHV is too hard. Even if I can get a good start I'm still not able to grab enough land in time, even if I'm lucky enough to have 2 Great Prophets which depend on luck. I know I lack certain skills but UHV isn't suppose to be that difficult on Monarch/Normal, is it?
The Indians tend to build quite a few spearmen+swordsmen, and its land is just far away and takes too much time to reach and conquer. Shock elephants move too slowly and you still need catapults to bring down city defense, in all there's just not enough time.
Oh and Egypt and Rome often declare wars just to add to the headache.
The Indians tend to build quite a few spearmen+swordsmen, and its land is just far away and takes too much time to reach and conquer. Shock elephants move too slowly and you still need catapults to bring down city defense, in all there's just not enough time.
Oh and Egypt and Rome often declare wars just to add to the headache.
iOnlySignIn
Prince$s
I settled the southwest-most tile on Iceland, worked the city up to 15 Culture, but the ships still won't pass through. Must be stupid AI pathing (a feature I hate most in Civ IV) again?
The Indians should have built at least 1 Shrine for you so you only need one. Once I conquered India to find no Shrine (lamers) but I just added in one with the WB.
I suggest spawning the Mahabodhi for AI India in say, 100 BCE, if neither Shrine had been built yet. They already get auto spawned Buddhism, so why not.
You need to build the Statue of Zeus asap. You alone of all the productive Pantheon civs have Ivory - it's yours. It really helps you come up with huge armies - It's even more important than the Coliseum since you'd likely have 4
cities at least - your capital, Babylon, Shush/one city north of Babylon on the Caspian, and one in Asia minor which spawned as an Indie.You can also try Parthenon Nationhood Drafting. That's a less Stable path - it's better for the Greeks due to their UU and food rich cities. I prefer SoZ for Persia since Persia is rich in production but poor in food.
Egypt is a none-factor. Just Fort on the isthmus of Suez and fortify 2 Immortals (what's left of your initial stack), 2 Axemen and 2 Archers. I'd say the Arabian barbs are more of a thread than Egypt.Oh and Egypt and Rome often declare wars just to add to the headache.
Rome depends on the AI bugs. Usually their Greek army gets lost in Crete or somewhere. In my game most of their Persian army got lost in Libya too. Only 2 Praets arrived in Syria with one Catapult.
Also, since you kill/collapse Carthage and Babylon early it means two fewer Roman armies for you to worry about. If you can kill/collapse Egypt too before the Romans declare on it it will really cripple the Romans since it voids their UP. As for Greece, keep them alive and happy and trade max number of techs to/with them. They are your bulwark against Rome and European barbs. If they Vassalize to you (they offered to me but I didn't take it) it helps your area UHV too.
Fresol
Angry Halfling in Green
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It should work. Because I waited until culture hit 100 but saw almost no change of culture ring (because water tiles don't spread culture much), then I realized 10 would've been enough already. There are ocean tiles you can enter because they are in your cultural border, and then just sail to the adjacent coast tile.
Spoiler :
Actually one can gain full entrance to the whole America using galleys only. Just build a fort adjacent to Vinland.
Spoiler :
A Great Scientist was born in Pataliputra when I was fighting in Indian land.
I don't have pagan temples in my cities, the first thing they build is granary. Then Zoroastrianism probably has spread into the city. I did build the Colosseum. But I wasn't fast enough in amassing and marching the army.You need to build the Statue of Zeus asap. You alone of all the productive Pantheon civs have Ivory - it's yours. It really helps you come up with huge armies - It's even more important than the Coliseum since you'd likely have 4
They declared on my pretty early in game and sent a army of 3 war chariots, 1 axeman to attack Jerusalem. I held with 3 immortals without loss. But the axeman still scared me, since I had no wall or culture bonus at that time.
Their paratroops landed between Sur and Angora and retreated after destroy some winery. One wandering legion attacked Tushpa and killed 1 immortal.
Glad to hear vassals count, but still vassalizing someone is not easy.
iOnlySignIn
Prince$s
Bad pathing it is. But again I don't think Galley settling is a better strategy - it will only drag your economy down. Same with Iceland really - you don't need it since you'll have 10 better cities out of conquering Germany, Russia, and England.
Perhaps the Indian AI needs to be tweaked with higher Religious flavor - but I think it's maxed already?
Pagan Temples are cheap and help your Culture. Your border cities (especially Samarkand) should emphasize Culture since it helps with the area UHV (and with securing 2 more Silks). You would also spend a very long time in Pantheon anyway, so it helps with Happiness. And you would only build it in your top production cities (e.g. Babylon) for the SoZ effect anyway. All in all I think it's worth it.
Anyways, try the Statue of Zeus. I think for Persia & China, or even for Rome, it is actually better than the Coliseum. It's cheaper than the Coliseum too IIRC, if you have Ivory.
Sounds like they didn't give you much trouble at all. I had way more trouble than that with barbs - there were groups of 3 Horse Archers from Arabia and Transoxiana every few turns, but the worst thing is Camel Archers out of the Sahara because War Elephants do not directly counter them.
Actually I think the best policy for Persia is to ignore Egypt altogether and focus on India. You don't need the Egyptian wonders - they seldom build the Pyramids - and they will collapse eventually.
As for trade, you don't need Egypt and Rome when you can keep Greece and China happy. China especially - I gifted them many techs in the hope that they will trade Silks to me, but they never had any Silk to trade the whole game.
Updated the list of achieved victories in the first post.
Sorry, forgot to respond to this when I first read your post: it's definitely possible to do this, even without manipulating the game as Rome before Ethiopia spawns. Bad luck can maybe have someone else found Catholicism before you can, but it's possible to beat its scripted founding. Actually one of the changes I've made to Ethiopia was explicitly to allow this.
Tomorrow's Dawn
Heroes Never Die
I almost forgot; my virtual UHV for China was 1660.
But I plan on tackling them again post-patch anyway.
Anyways, here is a short Egypt AAR.
I actually decided to play a peaceful builder civ for once!
Played on Monarch + Normal per Leoreth's baseline.
Tech Path: Mining --> Masonry --> Bronze Working --> Mysticism --> Fishing --> Sailing --> Pottery --> Writing --> Aesthetics --> Polytheism --> Literature --> whatever.
Build Order (in capital): Worker --> Worker --> Warrior (3 turns before switch) --> Hanging Gardens --> Pyramids --> Warrior/Great Sphynx (can't remember) --> Obelisk --> Library --> whatever (switch to Great Library ASAP so that Greece doesn't steal it).
GPs:
-Great Engineer (used on Great Lighthouse in Xou)
-Great Engineer (used on Great Library in capital)
-Great Artist (culture bomb)
Won virtual UHV on Turn 137 with a Great Artist Culture Bomb.
Here are the virtual UHV and physical UHV saves:
But I plan on tackling them again post-patch anyway.
Anyways, here is a short Egypt AAR.
I actually decided to play a peaceful builder civ for once!
Played on Monarch + Normal per Leoreth's baseline.
Tech Path: Mining --> Masonry --> Bronze Working --> Mysticism --> Fishing --> Sailing --> Pottery --> Writing --> Aesthetics --> Polytheism --> Literature --> whatever.
Build Order (in capital): Worker --> Worker --> Warrior (3 turns before switch) --> Hanging Gardens --> Pyramids --> Warrior/Great Sphynx (can't remember) --> Obelisk --> Library --> whatever (switch to Great Library ASAP so that Greece doesn't steal it).
GPs:
-Great Engineer (used on Great Lighthouse in Xou)
-Great Engineer (used on Great Library in capital)
-Great Artist (culture bomb)
Won virtual UHV on Turn 137 with a Great Artist Culture Bomb.
Here are the virtual UHV and physical UHV saves:
Updated.
Out of interest, do you think Egypt would be possible even without culture bombs? Because I'm already contemplating merging in K-Mod, which reduces its effect to 800*era. That's reasonable imo, but I have to make sure it doesn't screw up culture related UHVs.
Out of interest, do you think Egypt would be possible even without culture bombs? Because I'm already contemplating merging in K-Mod, which reduces its effect to 800*era. That's reasonable imo, but I have to make sure it doesn't screw up culture related UHVs.
iOnlySignIn
Prince$s
Definitely. I've done it. It's on Epic though, so it's actually a lot easier.
(1) After Pyramids, with food rich Egypt, you can whip pretty much any Wonder you want.
(2) Settled Great Artists are very effective. Perhaps even more effective than Culture Bombs on Epic/Marathon, since there are many more turns. I suggest you use this as a standard to balance your new Culture Bomb values. The math:
Settled Great Artist = +3 Gold, +12 Culture.
Egypt players should win in turn 152 (on Normal).
Suppose an Artist is settled at turn 2 (vast overestimation): = 1800 Culture.
Suppose it's settled at turn 52 (still an overestimation): = 1200 Culture.
Suppose it's settled at turn 102 (about right): = 600 Culture.
But settled Artist also provides Gold. So for balance, perhaps you should let Ancient era Culture Bombs give 1000~1200 Culture. The idea is if you get an Artist early (say before turn 75), Settle it. if you get it late, Bomb.
Edit: Perhaps if you settle the first Artist you can tech to Music before end game by floating on that +3 Gold. That would be hilarious.
Tomorrow's Dawn
Heroes Never Die
I won virtual UHV on Turn 137, not Turn 127 (I wish).
I think Egypt would not be possible without the Great Sphynx.
At the time I culture bombed, I had about 3000 Culture, and 152-137=15;
taken into account, 2000 culture in 15 turns is not possible.
Okay, on speeds slower than Normal, it is most definitely possible,
but since you're asking for balancing on Normal, it's a little hard, if not impossible.
If you're planning on merging K-Mod, I would recommend swapping out the last UHV condition to something else, because to build up all that culture via specialists, you tend to get unstable. Jusos's Egypt story (Pharaohs: Lords of the Sun) aside; I could not replicate that Egypt for the life of me.
Will be tackling China again as a barbarian uprising event ruined my current game.
After playing Egypt though, I think I might look into Babylon;
the time puzzle civs are looking a little bit more interesting to me now.
Yes, I can do it, even without drama (culture slider). With drama that'll be easy.
Fresol
Angry Halfling in Green
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Indian UHV:
Monarch difficulty, Normal speed, 3000 BC start. Finished at 1200 AD.
The three historical goals for India are:
1) Control the shrines of Hinduism and Buddhism in 100 BC;
You'll need to build the two shrines yourself, of course.
2) Build 20 temples by 700 AD;
Which means you'll probably need >=10 cities.
3)Have the world's highest population in 1200 AD;
Not a problem if you have finished 1) and 2) and survive till 1200 AD. (Right after that the Mughals will just pop right out of some northern city of yours though.)
The tech path I took was Priesthood->Masonry->Mathematics->Calendar, which is quite an obvious choice.
A few things to mention:
With my initial settler, I settled Takshashila 1N of marble. Dilli became my capital and Hinduism was founded in Varanasi. I chose Takshashila because it could provide much better production. Then build workers in all cities to improve tiles ASAP and build temples in Varanasi to work priest specialists. I recommend having 7-8 workers at the beginning.
Here's my city placement:
Pitikapuram is my 4th city because it is food-rich even before discovering Calendar. Madura was a barb city that I captured. (Wait until it grows to 2 pop or you'll be forced to raze it.) I intended to settle Hanoi but a early Kunming with Confucianism denied me of it, so I settled Angkor which later flipped.
About growing cities and building temples: One does have time to build granaries in all cities as the first building (except Varanasi, which will build temples first). With enough food and granary, temples can be whipped in time (even for culture pressed Yangon/Pagan).
About spreading religions: Varanasi alone may do the job well, which means you probably won't need to build monasteries in other cities.
The score is 10879. Finished at 1200 AD (of course).
Just mentioning: strijder20 previously gave a walkthrough of India and my play follows in a similar fashion.
Monarch difficulty, Normal speed, 3000 BC start. Finished at 1200 AD.
The three historical goals for India are:
1) Control the shrines of Hinduism and Buddhism in 100 BC;
You'll need to build the two shrines yourself, of course.
2) Build 20 temples by 700 AD;
Which means you'll probably need >=10 cities.
3)Have the world's highest population in 1200 AD;
Not a problem if you have finished 1) and 2) and survive till 1200 AD. (Right after that the Mughals will just pop right out of some northern city of yours though.)
The tech path I took was Priesthood->Masonry->Mathematics->Calendar, which is quite an obvious choice.
A few things to mention:
With my initial settler, I settled Takshashila 1N of marble. Dilli became my capital and Hinduism was founded in Varanasi. I chose Takshashila because it could provide much better production. Then build workers in all cities to improve tiles ASAP and build temples in Varanasi to work priest specialists. I recommend having 7-8 workers at the beginning.
Here's my city placement:
Spoiler :
Pitikapuram is my 4th city because it is food-rich even before discovering Calendar. Madura was a barb city that I captured. (Wait until it grows to 2 pop or you'll be forced to raze it.) I intended to settle Hanoi but a early Kunming with Confucianism denied me of it, so I settled Angkor which later flipped.
About growing cities and building temples: One does have time to build granaries in all cities as the first building (except Varanasi, which will build temples first). With enough food and granary, temples can be whipped in time (even for culture pressed Yangon/Pagan).
About spreading religions: Varanasi alone may do the job well, which means you probably won't need to build monasteries in other cities.
The score is 10879. Finished at 1200 AD (of course).
Just mentioning: strijder20 previously gave a walkthrough of India and my play follows in a similar fashion.
