The US political divisions and the role of lies in the media - one case

[Estebonrober]

Yea the sarcasm was what @Gorbles got at here. . .

That said, I wouldn't say that that's many sites, nor do I see much agreement with leftist ideals (at the moment). He mainly seems to be invited on in his role as political journalist, to speak on how it's covered at the moment (from his perspective). The problem with this is attending FOX News and doing bits with Tucker Carlson. It's hypocritical to try and expose "liberal" media if you're willing to platform literal FOX News on the topic of "this is why the Democrats are bloodthirsty". Greenwald isn't an idiot, so it's hard for me to rationalise away the impact that has on the political and ideological spectrums. He knows the base he's talking to. He knows what he's saying, and whose show he's saying it on.

I appreciate the Greenwald's out there, but pointing out the fallacies of the NYTs and WP is not the same as the intentional propaganda machines talk radio and Fox News MSM are, so in a sense the whole point is disingenuous. All media has biases. If they actually lied about this story then it is a big story, if they got the facts wrong and never found a proper correction to report and then went with it, then that is a different type of story. Unfortunately with the current atmosphere in geopolitics the latter is considered as sinister as the former because everyone is out for blood.

If someone murdered Sicknick to make Trump supporters look bad (like the boogeymen antifa along with their communist co-conspirators the MSM!!!!11@!) then that would be a huge story. Suffice to say the inferences on the internet are deeply lacking jsut like all other evidence of right wing "realities".

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

https://www.foxnews.com/media/glenn...hite-house-exit-negates-medias-false-hysteria

I got this while searching for the Trump quote he would leave peacefully

On Friday, Greenwald slammed the media's weekslong totalitarianism scare in a series of Twitter messages.

"It's astonishing that the media people who tried scaring the s--- out of everyone by saying there'd be coups & civil wars are now claiming this didn't happen only because they stopped it with their tweets & columns -- instead of admitting they -- again -- spread false hysteria," the journalist reacted to Trump's remarks.

"Same way they spent 3 years screeching Mueller was coming to expose and arrest the criminal Trump/Russia ring. Then -- after Mueller closed his investigation saying he found *no evidence* to prove it & charged *nobody* with conspiring with Russia -- insisted they were right."

It's astonishing Greenwald took Trump's word as gospel, when being branded a watchdog here.

Second, Greenwald and Fox lying about the aim of the Mueller investigation. He and Foxnews had been bleating all during the investigation nobody found any evidence of any collusion, when the report investigated Russian interference

Report On The Investigation Into
Russian Interference In The
2016 Presidential Election

So in the words of Greenwald:
"Foxnews and Greenwald spent 3 years screeching Mueller was investigating collusion and obviously found nothing because Mueller was not investigating collusion. Mueller was investigating Russian Interference and found evidence of Russian Interference"

But of course he used these lies to convince people Russiagate was a witch-hunt. And so did Fox:

Greenwald was referring to the Russia investigation headed by former Special Counsel Robert Mueller, who concluded there was no collusion between Russia and the Trump campaign despite media hype throughout the first three years of Trump's presidency.

As Barr put it:

According to Barr, the special counsel found two main Russian efforts to meddle in the 2016 election. The first was through the Internet Research Agency, a Russian organization that conducted “disinformation and social media operations in the United States designed to sow social discord, eventually with the aim of interfering with the election.” The second was the Russian government’s hacking operations “designed to gather and disseminate information to influence the election.” The counsel found that government actors in the Russian government successfully accessed emails of people affiliated with the Clinton campaign and Democratic Party organizations.

Barr said that Mueller’s team did not determine whether Trump illegally obstructed justice, writing: “while this report does not conclude that the president committed a crime, it also does not exonerate him.”

because that wasn't the focus of the investigation.

Mueller also found no evidence that 9/11 wasn't an inside job, so 9/11 was an inside job.

 

[innonimatu]

Your words, you mean. But can you then prove your claims?

"Foxnews and Greenwald spent 3 years screeching Mueller was investigating collusion and obviously found nothing because Mueller was not investigating collusion. Mueller was investigating Russian Interference and found evidence of Russian Interference"

He found evidence, did he? And his job title was prosecutor, wasn't it?

So who did he prosecute successfully for "russian interference"? The prosecutor never proves anything with an accusation. A successful prosecution proves something.

Name one person convicted in a court of law, one one ongoing case, for "russian interference" that you allege was proven by Mueller and his team.

 

[Gorbles]

Wow I didn't realise this thread had a poll. It's terribly-worded, too. That should've probably been a sign.

 

[Gori the Grey]

Only two people have taken the poll and the results are split 50-50. It's what they call a push poll. It's not asking you for an opinion; it's advancing an opinion and trapping you into the assumption in its question if you answer either way.

 

[Farm Boy]

Of course it is. There are still people who think that maga-hat kid did anything to provoke liars and people here who have argued about it. A post-truth era poll about regretting believing lies. It's pretty wearyingly meta, no?

 

[Gorbles]

Of course it is. There are still people who think that maga-hat kid did anything to provoke liars and people here who have argued about it. A post-truth era poll about regretting believing lies. It's pretty wearyingly meta, no?

Woah, that's an incredibly specific callback to a wildly different thread. Nice hook.

 

[Farm Boy]

We're leaving each other alone, remember? You sent me a PM right before you posted that you sent me a PM to reiterate publicly that you'd privately conveyed that message. Is that done? I want to be on the right page.

 

[Tee Kay]

I'm just posting here to voice my annoyance as someone who likes voting on polls that I can't vote on this poll because neither option applied to me. I've never heard of the first lie, and the second lie did not change my opinion of the incident.

0/10 bad poll you don't even have a nerdy fox mascot

 

[Lemon Merchant]

Moderator Action: Let's not drag stuff in here from other threads please. Especially old, almost necroed stuff. Thank you.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Of course it is. There are still people who think that maga-hat kid did anything to provoke liars and people here who have argued about it. A post-truth era poll about regretting believing lies. It's pretty wearyingly meta, no?

Or that half a million Americans are dead and people refuse to wear mask, or take it seriously. no ?

 

[Farm Boy]

Yeah, doubting masks is pretty dumb at this point. Accurate example of the moron meta, nearly necroed as it may be or whatever.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Yeah, doubting masks is pretty dumb at this point. Accurate example of the moron meta, nearly necroed as it may be or whatever.

The polarization and discourse has been going downhill for a while now
As for the CDC advice, whats wrong with using tighter fitting mask, an additional layer of cloth or double masking to decrees your chances of getting corna ?

 

[Farm Boy]

Dunno. I've generally been following the CDC's advice best I can. Seems relatively sane. Teachers in my district are back with an in-school out-of-school hybrid. They didn't strike on their low-risk members getting shots before resuming. Non-******* point for them, I suppose.

 

[Estebonrober]

Dunno. I've generally been following the CDC's advice best I can. Seems relatively sane. Teachers in my district are back with an in-school out-of-school hybrid. They didn't strike on their low-risk members getting shots before resuming. Non-******* point for them, I suppose.

I think teachers and such should be next in line after the over 60 crowd, but yea a lot of these unions are just behaving badly imo at this point. a hybrid set up with protection for the vulnerable class seems like a good compromise for any school district. I've not heard a good argument otherwise.

 

[Farm Boy]

There isn't one. We aren't even close to through the 70s year-olds with high risk pre-existings, here. Credit to the bigger persons that are doing it doing it. The unions that are sucking have a history of sucking, so far that I've noticed, but I'm sure there are exceptions.

 

[innonimatu]

There isn't one. We aren't even close to through the 70s year-olds with high risk pre-existings, here. Credit to the bigger persons that are doing it doing it. The unions that are sucking have a history of sucking, so far that I've noticed, but I'm sure there are exceptions.

It's not only there that is happening, if it's any consolation...
I could say a few things about what I thing is moving unions in this, but better not. I'm sure I would be misinterpreted. One misinterpretation per thread

But to go back to the topic, we now get the sight of the Daily Mail (!!!) being able to public a denunciation of the lies of: The New York Times, Associated Press, the Democratic party in its articles of impeachment, etc.

The Daily Mail gets to truthfully denounce lies by the "press of record".

On the record of policemen there on that day who died since, it would be interesting perhaps to investigate why two have committed suicide. Not only those supporter of Trump who invaded the place but the scale of the subsequent media circus done around the "failure" of the police to be more brutal might have had something to do with it.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Only two people have taken the poll

Well .... it's actually only one. I clicked on it, but haven't actually taken the Greenwald like poll.

I'm still beating my wife you see.

 

[Ironsided]

Here is an interview with Greenwald explaining himself considering the direct accusations then and here about leaving The Intercept and going on Tucker Carlson.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Only fair and balanced to provide the story from both sides, right?

https://theintercept.com/2020/10/29/glenn-greenwald-resigns-the-intercept/

GLENN GREENWALD’S DECISION to resign from The Intercept stems from a fundamental disagreement over the role of editors in the production of journalism and the nature of censorship. Glenn demands the absolute right to determine what he will publish. He believes that anyone who disagrees with him is corrupt, and anyone who presumes to edit his words is a censor. Thus, the preposterous charge that The Intercept’s editors and reporters, with the lone, noble exception of Glenn Greenwald, have betrayed our mission to engage in fearless investigative journalism because we have been seduced by the lure of a Joe Biden presidency. A brief glance at the stories The Intercept has published on Biden will suffice to refute those claims.

The narrative Glenn presents about his departure is teeming with distortions and inaccuracies — all of them designed to make him appear as a victim, rather than a grown person throwing a tantrum. It would take too long to point them all out here, but we intend to correct the record in time. For now, it is important to make clear that our goal in editing his work was to ensure that it would be accurate and fair. While he accuses us of political bias, it was he who was attempting to recycle the dubious claims of a political campaign — the Trump campaign — and launder them as journalism.

We have the greatest respect for the journalist Glenn Greenwald used to be, and we remain proud of much of the work we did with him over the past six years. It is Glenn who has strayed from his original journalistic roots, not The Intercept.

The defining feature of The Intercept’s work in recent years has been the investigative journalism that came out of painstaking work by our staffers in Washington, D.C., New York, and across the rest of the country. It is the staff of The Intercept that has been carrying out our investigative mission — a mission that has involved a collaborative editing process.

We have no doubt that Glenn will go on to launch a new media venture where he will face no collaboration with editors — such is the era of Substack and Patreon. In that context, it makes good business sense for Glenn to position himself as the last true guardian of investigative journalism and to smear his longtime colleagues and friends as partisan hacks. We get it. But facts are facts, and The Intercept’s record of fearless, rigorous, independent journalism speaks for itself.