Why I think ABORTION is o.k.

[Elrohir]

No, I won't. Instead, I give you a challenge to find me a statistic that disproves what I said. Otherwise, use your common sense.

You are being infantile. You made a claim, and I asked you to back it up. You must either back up your claim or withdraw it. It is impossible to prove a negative. ("Prove to me that you've never eaten a slice of anchovie pizza" - you may get plenty of people to say they've never seen you eat anchovie pizza, but they haven't watched you your whole life) Either do a simple Google search and find it for me, or admit you don't know what you are talking about.

Stem Cell Research, are you aware of its medical potential? Any "lack of evidence" is because it is so severely restricted right now as far as funding and access to quality stem cells.

Adult Stem Cell research has yielded plenty of positive results. Fetal Stem Cell research has yet to cure a single disease.

Did you read the rest of my post? I don't care if you can use babies' brains to innoculate me against every disease and virus known to mankind, it's still immoral to kill innocents to raise your quality of life.

 

[Atlas14]

Did you read the rest of my post? I don't care if you can use babies' brains to innoculate me against every disease and virus known to mankind, it's still immoral to kill innocents to raise your quality of life.

I don't care if you are the President, if you aren't going to care properly for your child I DON'T want to have to deal with it!!!!!!!

1. I Don't want to pay for your child's medical and life support.
2. I Don't want my neck of the woods being torn down for your disturbed, drug-dealing child to live next to me

I support meaningful life, not merelely existant life.

 

[Elrohir]

I don't care if you are the President, if you aren't going to care properly for your child I DON'T want to have to deal with it!!!!!!!

1. I Don't want to pay for your child's medical and life support.
2. I Don't want my neck of the woods being torn down for your disturbed, drug-dealing child to live next to me

I support meaningful life, not merelely existant life.

Well, your using lots of exclamation points sure convinced me!!!!!!!

So since you don't want to deal with it, we should just kill the child? That's sick. And yet so completely 21st century Earth. "Whatever it is, I don't care, just leave me alone."

1. Good. I don't want you to.
2. While my hypothetical children may be disturbed, they certainly do not deal drugs. I would hit them with a bag of fresh Florida Oranges if they did. After all, they "Won't leave a bruise and'll show 'em whose boss!"

 

[Own]

it's still immoral to kill innocents to raise your quality of life.

So the people dying from AID's aren't innocent?

 

[FearlessLeader2]

So people dying from AID's, slow painful death's from alzheimers, and people having to get their finger pricked and a shot at 5:00 AM every day is fine as long as an unwanted child is born.

Murdering for profit is no less wrong than murdering at random.

 

[Own]

I disagree. Sounds like a powerful statement, but is just silly.

 

[FearlessLeader2]

Let us ban executions of criminals for fear that they may be innocent.

Yes, absolutely.

Let us ban war for fear that we may hit civilians.

Hey! I think you're beginning to get the point of Christianity!!

Let us ban sending troops to protect the defenseless for fear we may kill the men murdering them (Sudan, Rwanda, etc.)

Well, now you're just being petulant.

 

[FearlessLeader2]

Stem Cell Research, are you aware of its medical potential? Any "lack of evidence" is because it is so severely restricted right now as far as funding and access to quality stem cells.

Profiting from the deliberate termination of human life is WRONG, no matter how the proceeds are divided up.

Why should you or I care about their humane decision? Does it affect you, or anyone else in any negative way? Not really. It will, in the long-run, potentially give your children and their children more living space on earth, less taxes being paid to support children of parents too stupid to wear a condom, potentially less starvation on earth because less people to feed, and less people blaming their mass-murders on their disruptive childhood and mentally instable parents.

You left out a bunch of stuff.

Abortion also devalues human life even further, and leads us to all sorts of societal 'benefits'. See, with human life devalued, violence is taken for granted. The de-consequencing of sex also encourages promiscuity, which in turn aggravates the transmission of STDs, increases the number of teenage and unwanted pregnancies, (some of which will not get aborted) thereby increasing Welfare rolls (and yes, EXACERBATING the very problems you claim abortion will alleviate). Violent crime increases, sex crimes increase, sexual deviations increase as sex is seen more and more as recreation and genitalia as toys.

 

[FearlessLeader2]

Murdering for profit is no less wrong than murdering at random.

I disagree. Sounds like a powerful statement, but is just silly.

So, you'd feel good about pulling the trigger as long as you profited somehow.

You know, I'm curious as to how well you think that defense will stand up in court. Here's what I envision...

YOU: "Not Guilty by reason of Profit, Your Honor."
JUDGE: "Excuse me?"
YOU: "I profited from his death, Your Honor. That makes it all right, right?"
JUDGE: "Court recorder is instructed to enter a plea of guilty."

 

[toh6wy]

Profiting from the deliberate termination of human life is WRONG, no matter how the proceeds are divided up.

If you truly think sacrificing a few human stem cells (which wouldn't have become a human anyway) to help make great medical advancements isn't worth it at all, then I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.

 

[FearlessLeader2]

And why wouldn't they become a human?

Stem-cell research is yet another straw-man argument used by pro-choicers to justify the unjustifiable. Adult stem-cell research is just as useful, and has been ongoing for some time now and yielding results. Your argument is not only immaterial, it is a lie and a smokescreen, and it's based on the despicable notion that murder for profit is better than murder at random.

 

[Dr Alimentado]

no fetus in the history of the world has ever been aborted for stem cell research...

its a strawman whoever uses it, there is (and never will be) an abortion quota.

 

[Own]

So, you'd feel good about pulling the trigger as long as you profited somehow.

You know, I'm curious as to how well you think that defense will stand up in court. Here's what I envision...

YOU: "Not Guilty by reason of Profit, Your Honor."
JUDGE: "Excuse me?"
YOU: "I profited from his death, Your Honor. That makes it all right, right?"
JUDGE: "Court recorder is instructed to enter a plea of guilty."

IIRC (sarcastic way of saying it) you said that murder for profit is no less wrong than murder, which is not true. If it was for money, that'd be one thing, but it's for curing LIFE threatening diseases. And no woman is gonna abort her baby just for stem cell research.

 

[cgannon64]

no fetus in the history of the world has ever been aborted for stem cell research...

Are you playing semantics?

As far as I'm aware, all stem cells have to come from living embryos.

 

[Dr Alimentado]

Are you playing semantics?

As far as I'm aware, all stem cells have to come from living embryos.

sure, but that is not the reason they are aborted! no woman has ever thought "yes, I'll have an abortion so scientists can do stem cell research".

It's like suggesting people die because (parts of) dead bodies are sometimes used in medical research/teaching. It's silly.

 

[Own]

Couldn't have said it better myself doctor.

 

[cgannon64]

sure, but that is not the reason they are aborted! no woman has ever thought "yes, I'll have an abortion so scientists can do stem cell research".

Stem cells come from extra embryos put into storage lockers during the in vitro fertilization process. They are stored indefinitely, unless the woman assents to their being aborted.

So, yes, they are aborted with the intent of being used for their stem cells.

It's like suggesting people die because (parts of) dead bodies are sometimes used in medical research/teaching. It's silly.

Actually, I think an apt comparison is killing old people for their organs. They're not doing anything any longer, and no one wants them, so why not kill them for their parts?

 

[blackheart]

You are being infantile. You made a claim, and I asked you to back it up. You must either back up your claim or withdraw it. It is impossible to prove a negative. ("Prove to me that you've never eaten a slice of anchovie pizza" - you may get plenty of people to say they've never seen you eat anchovie pizza, but they haven't watched you your whole life) Either do a simple Google search and find it for me, or admit you don't know what you are talking about.

How hard is it to use common sense in this scenario? Would you want to have drug dealers, murderers, crack heads, etc. living next to you? Yes or no?

Hey! I think you're beginning to get the point of Christianity!!

Well, now you're just being petulant.

What point? That religion preaches many things that aren't followed? Pacifism is pacifism, whether its noninterventionist or nonactive.

 

[blackheart]

Actually, I think an apt comparison is killing old people for their organs. They're not doing anything any longer, and no one wants them, so why not kill them for their parts?

Well first off, why would you want an 80 yr old heart that will fail in 3 years ?
Secondly, there is a difference. The old folk are still alive and kicking and using them.

 

[Atlas14]

Well, your using lots of exclamation points sure convinced me!!!!!!!

Im glad it did.

So since you don't want to deal with it, we should just kill the child? That's sick. And yet so completely 21st century Earth. "Whatever it is, I don't care, just leave me alone."

Preferable to having your (Not yours) disturbed child grow up and become a drug addict, then kill my properly raised kid, and possibly even more kids. And even better, me and everyone else paying for the support of this kid who will only grow up to be a danger to society.

1. Good. I don't want you to.

Doesn't matter. The govt. would make everyone pay extra to support your child.

2. While my hypothetical children may be disturbed, they certainly do not deal drugs. I would hit them with a bag of fresh Florida Oranges if they did. After all, they "Won't leave a bruise and'll show 'em whose boss!"

Im glad to see you would be such a good parent, but can you account for all the others who would be forced to raise a kid that they are not prepared to raise?

Profiting from the deliberate termination of human life is WRONG, no matter how the proceeds are divided up.

It might just be me, but I desperately hope America does not turn into the next China: Overcrowded as hell, millions upon millions starving because the country can't support all the people, and almost complete natural resource depletion in many areas to support the huge population increases of the 21st Century.

Before the 6th week of pregnancy, the embryo has not even developed a nervous system or a complex brain, or much at all. Abortion during the first 5-6 weeks would mean no pain for the embryo. It would not even know it existed. Is this termination of human life- yes, it is. Would I wish my girlfriend/wife to have an abortion? No. But I would also be a good parent and financially and emotionally prepared to care for my child. Many parents are not prepared to do this. Should they have worn a condom or something? Yes, but it is difficult to *force* people to wear condoms if they don't want to. Maybe the burden of the nation having to support your kid, along with millions of others isn't so great at this current time in America, but our population isn't so high yet either right now. Wait till we reach China's population. Try supporting over a billion children who would require a lot of money. In a perfect world, we could tell the parents to suck it up, support your child yourself and the kid would turn out decent. But this isn't a perfect world. Murder and crime rates are increasing, and selfishly or not, I don't want to have to support any more drug addict, murdering children. I don't want any more forests where I live being cut down to relieve our country's greedy craving for luxury houses. Population increases are downright unfavorable to put it nicely.

Abortion also devalues human life even further

No it does not. It increases our standard of living, (which is not the reason abortion should be legal- its just a side-benefit) which increases the value of human life.

Violent crime increases, sex crimes increase, sexual deviations increase as sex is seen more and more as recreation and genitalia as toys.

Violent crimes decrease because more properly raised children represent the populatoin of America. As for increase in sex as "recreation"- sex has always been viewed as recreation ever since the first contraceptive.