Ask A Catholic II

[PeteAtoms]

Catholics pray for dead people right?

I was chastised for writing a prayer including a line "we pray for loved ones passed on," in a prayer back in my days in Sunday school in a Lutheran church.

 

[civ_king]

Romans 3:23

For ALL (Note, not "All except Mary") have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God.

To claim that Mary is perfect is in denial of Scripture. Now, what will you choose, the Pope or the Bible, you cannot have both!

I will take God's Words above the Word of Man.

It doesn't say except Jesus either, ergo Jesus save sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God, ergo Christianity is false. Do you see the derpy conclusions your logic gives?

Catholics pray for dead people right?

I was chastised for writing a prayer including a line "we pray for loved ones passed on," in a prayer back in my days in Sunday school in a Lutheran church.

Yes, you can pray for the souls of the dead

 

[GhostWriter16]

It doesn't say except Jesus either, ergo Jesus save sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God, ergo Christianity is false. Do you see the derpy conclusions your logic gives?

No, because Jesus is clearly stated as perfect, and besides, he is God. Mary isn't God, she is only human.

Also, Jesus was not born of a Father, Mary was.

Forgive me for using this site, but I think this article has some validity:

http://www.chick.com/reading/books/160/160_25.asp

 

[Arakhor]

Frankly, Domination, if you're taking seriously anything the Chickverse says about Catholicism, you're in need of a severe reality check. Then again, as you like to point out in your thread, you're not Catholic, so you shouldn't be pronouncing judgement here.

 

[civ_king]

Jack Chick is forever banned from these thread, I think I just got stupider from seeing the link.

I never saw you posting a link to a site that celebrates stupidity right?

 

[GhostWriter16]

Frankly, Domination, if you're taking seriously anything the Chickverse says about Catholicism, you're in need of a severe reality check. Then again, as you like to point out in your thread, you're not Catholic, so you shouldn't be pronouncing judgement here.

Jack Chick is forever banned from these thread, I think I just got stupider from seeing the link.

I never saw you posting a link to a site that celebrates stupidity right?

I definitely think Chick goes too far in many respects, such as claiming that Catholics are not Chrisitans. That said, that link in particular has some valid points about Scripture IMO.

 

[Arakhor]

I don't see a problem with it. If Catholics wish to pray for the dead, that is entirely their business. In fact, insisting that such does not help is rather stating that one knows what happens after death and on what basis God will pass judgement, which no man alive can ever know.

 

[GhostWriter16]

I thought you claimed to know EVERYONE would go to Heaven. That's knowing isn't it, in your view?

Praying for the dead is wrong according to the Bible. For Catholics, who CLAIM their message is inspired by God, and, at least in Civ_King's case, hold the ONLY inspired message from God.

In this case, in fact, I think posting Jack Chick's link was appropriate. Extremism combated with extremism

 

[Takhisis]

Wow, Protestants fighting among themselves in the Ask a Catholic thread. I'll get more firewood.

 

[Arakhor]

I thought you claimed to know EVERYONE would go to Heaven. That's knowing isn't it, in your view?

It my belief that everyone who wants to achieve union with God will do so after death, certainly, but I don't feel the need to bring it up constantly because this isn't a thread about my beliefs.

 

[shadowplay]

Catholics pray for dead people right?

Yes, it's a pretty major element of the faith. In every mass we pray for the deceased in the mass intentions.

 

[_random_]

We started reading The Power and the Glory in school this week. Have you ever read it? What did you think of it?

 

[civ_king]

I thought you claimed to know EVERYONE would go to Heaven. That's knowing isn't it, in your view?

Praying for the dead is wrong according to the Bible. For Catholics, who CLAIM their message is inspired by God, and, at least in Civ_King's case, hold the ONLY inspired message from God.

In this case, in fact, I think posting Jack Chick's link was appropriate. Extremism combated with extremism

I'm not reading a Jack Chick link, I'd probably die of an aneurism. Now if you could get it from a non-Jack Chick site that's okay and I'll read it.

 

[Jehoshua]

Romans 3:23

For ALL (Note, not "All except Mary") have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God.

Mary was cleansed of original sin at the moment of conception, thus she still had original sin to begin with before (thus she had sin), but by a singular grace of God it was removed. Now this does not mean Mary could not have commited personal sin she had the free will to do it but she did not.

However you also forget that the quote in question does not just refer to sin, for in the second part (and fall short of the glory of God) it refers also to positive action to serve the lord, in otherwords the manifestation of true faith in action. Perhaps Mary considering this could have done more in service to the Lord.

Your equating the doctrines on Mary in regards to sin with a quote which is not solely regarding this and also refers to positive action, there within lies your error.

PS: Jack Chick is an imbecile with no understanding of the Truth, enough said.

 

[Jehoshua]

Catholics pray for dead people right?

I was chastised for writing a prayer including a line "we pray for loved ones passed on," in a prayer back in my days in Sunday school in a Lutheran church.

Yes we pray for the departed. I would give you a direct biblical quote but unfortunately Martin Luther excised the book in question from the protestant canon (Maccabees 2: 12:40-46 ) precisely because it disagreed with his personal opinion on this very matter (same reason why the Epistle of James was almost excised from the New Testament [contradicts sola fide]).

 

[Jehoshua]

For Catholics, who CLAIM their message is inspired by God, and, at least in Civ_King's case, hold the ONLY inspired message from God.

The Catholic Church is the One True Faith and any truth in other faiths is only true so far as the Catholic Church agrees with it. Likewise only the Catholic Church is guided by the Holy Spirit to be preserved from error in accordance with the promises of Christ as it is the Church founded by Christ. Even the name appears within 70 years of the death and ressurection of Christ (incidentally around the same time some of the Gospels were written).

" Wherever the bishop appears, there let the people be; as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church" (St Ignatius of Antioch: Epistle to the Smyrnaeans c. 100 A.D.)

Protestantism on the flip side is merely a coglomeration of around 40000 sects each with their own differing versions of the truth (there is one God and thus can only be one truth) schismed off from the Church and eachover over a plethora of individuals of varying intelligences personal opinions on scripture or doctrine. (thus incidentally disproving sola scriptura [in addition to logical fallaciousness of it] as if the scripture alone was neccesaryas an infallible source of authority there would be only be one interpretation, (one God, one truth) which we don't see {not to mention Christ would of simply written a book})

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

Moderator Action: A reminder that this thread is "Ask a CATHOLIC", not "Ask someone who isn't Catholic what Catholics think". Please don't answer questions if you don't know what you are talking about.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[GhostWriter16]

@Jehoshua- First of all, what Ignatius says is NOT infallible. Second of all, at the time, the Catholic Church was true. It later fell away from Biblical Teachings.

 

[Jehoshua]

Since when did I say Ignatius was infalible, I just brought up his quote as evidence for the direct historical connection (unlike protestantism) to the church (the Catholic Church) during time of the apostles and the time when the gospels were under divine inspiration written (and later implicitly selected by the Church needless to say)

As to your assertion (fallacious) that the Catholic Church went astray that would imply you don;t trust Christ when he promised that the gates of hell will not prevail against his Church, and that you disagree regarding his promises when he said he would not leave us orphans and would be with us till the end of days.

Needless to say I thank you for tacitly admitting that protestantism is a relatively modern human invention of the 15th century with no historical continuity whatsoever to the Church founded by christ (other than the fact that it split off from it [with it being the Catholic Church])

 

[GhostWriter16]

I don't claim that the Protestant Church has been around as long as the Catholic Church. That would be incorrect and missing the point.

I do believe that Catholicism was the first Christian Church, but I don't think that it was ever intended when Jesus used the word "The Church." I think the Church in the NT refers to all believers, Catholic or not.

I also doubt that Ignatius' referring to the Catholic Church was the same Catholic Church, though that's probably a question for Plotinus. Remember, Catholic originally meant "Universal."