Boycott Halal

[Farm Boy]

They probably are, but they often occupy, least round here, non substitutable inputs, on largely non-substitutable land. Which is something most people don't think about, because it's inconvenient to the message.

I'm sorry, I totally forgot a post ago what my actual point was. Yea, I find people who aren't usually interested in animal welfare suddenly getting interested in ritual slaughter is often a front for nothing more than base bigotry. Not always, but close enough. I only wind up stuck on that sort of thread, most of the time, because while the people that are suddenly finding animal welfare to be interesting are also getting it wrong. As all decent research I've found from sources I'm inclined to believe are pretty clear about the ethics of ritual slaughter being largely independent from the fact that they are ritual slaughter. It's isn't terribly complicated or hard to make common ritual slaughter at least as humane as commonly practiced secular processes.

 

[El_Machinae]

It is amazing how stupid some people are. God clearly states that there will be consequences when you do certain things and yet people complain when God does punish those who do those things, yet he is clear in what he said. People complain about the suffering in this world, yet God did say that if you disobey him, there will be punishment for said actions. The only reason it seems weird is that you refuse to listen to what it says.

You're getting caught up in the wrong part of the argument, and it's distracting from your original point. Your original point still requires you to explain this, because it's certainly not clear.

You're not answering the question, really. This is what's leading to people's confusion. You're answering questions we're not asking. You were talking about your money, and I am asking about your money. Is there a good reason to believe that the Halal 'fee' is being distributed to your non-Halal purchases, and not being fully placed on the Halal customers?

 

[Defiant47]

It is amazing how stupid some people are. God clearly states that there will be consequences when you do certain things and yet people complain when God does punish those who do those things, yet he is clear in what he said. People complain about the suffering in this world, yet God did say that if you disobey him, there will be punishment for said actions. The only reason it seems weird is that you refuse to listen to what it says.

God warned Adam that if he disobeyed God, then death will enter the world. Along with death came a whole host of other nasties. There is general suffering because of Adam's sin, since it brought judgement from God upon all of mankind. There is specific judgement on specific cases of sin. Before Adam sinned, the world was very good, now we are living in a cursed world and with that comes all these problems we see.

So then aren't people's complaints legitimate? A large part of suffering is occurring due to what Adam did in the Garden of Eden. There will be "consequences" when you do "those things", but a lot of punishment is occurring to people who have not done those things. Those things being eating from the fruit of knowledge in the Garden of Eden. Only Adam and Eve ate from that tree.

Thus, the general suffering because of original sin is not a consequence of any modern human's actions. God has bestowed punishment and "a cursed world" to people who have not committed the actions causing this punishment. First of all, that doesn't really seem fair or just. But most importantly, it goes against the general gist of what you were trying to say earlier. That we have only ourselves to blame for punishment, since that punishment is a consequence of our actions. No, it's not. It's a consequence of some other guy's actions.

As for specific instances of sinning, I'd only like to point out that even the holiest of men who try their hardest still end up sinning. As such, it is ludicrous to bestow punishment and judgement on humanity using a metric that is unattainable given our physiological and psychological dispositions and limitations. Why does God bestow punishment on a man who gives every shred of his strength and devotion to lift a boulder weighing 5 tonnes, but ultimately cannot?

If you also look closer to the happenings in the world, you'll notice that "consequences" and "punishment" are not typically correlated with actions. There have existed holy men who have followed the word of God, and who have suffered. There have also existed bad men who have sinned innumerably, but reveled in treasure and pleasure. Unless you wish to assert that the world of this Earth has no justice and the only justice (aforementioned "consequences") occurs in the afterlife, your point is not rooted in observable reality.

 

[Traitorfish]

Actually, God apologised about the whole "suffering" thing. Big misunderstanding. He was new to the software, got it stuck on the wrong setting, and hasn't been able to figure out how to unstick it without messing up everything else. He gave me a note explaining it all, seemed pretty apologetic. I mean, when I say "he gave me", I mean that I wrote it myself, but I wrote with divine inspiration, so it still counts. This is all explained in the note, y'see, so it's pretty legit. Except the bits which aren't explained in the note and I just made up afterwards, but they count too, probably.

 

[Defiant47]

Actually, God apologised about the whole "suffering" thing. Big misunderstanding. He was new to the software, got it stuck on the wrong setting, and hasn't been able to figure out how to unstick it without messing up everything else. He gave me a note explaining it all, seemed pretty apologetic. I mean, when I say "he gave me", I mean that I wrote it myself, but I wrote with divine inspiration, so it still counts. This is all explained in the note, y'see, so it's pretty legit. Except the bits which aren't explained in the note and I just made up afterwards, but they count too, probably.

Does the note say it's the word of God? Because if it does, then we know it's true, because it says it's the word of God. If it doesn't, then how can we be sure it isn't false or fraudulent?

 

[Arakhor]

Nah, TF just scribbled in the note's equivalent of II Timothy 3:16 and that's all that matters, right?

Actually, you are the first one I've encountered to suggest Tengriism is primarily a polytheistic as opposed to monotheistic religion.

Well, I suppose that Catholicism with its extensive group of saints, the Virgin Mary and the great angels could almost be described as polytheistic, if you weren't aware of the Church's teachings regarding intercession. I really know very little about Tengri/iism, but Wikipedia suggests that it is akin to Nestorian Christianity as well.

 

[timtofly]

Actually, God apologised about the whole "suffering" thing. Big misunderstanding. He was new to the software, got it stuck on the wrong setting, and hasn't been able to figure out how to unstick it without messing up everything else. He gave me a note explaining it all, seemed pretty apologetic. I mean, when I say "he gave me", I mean that I wrote it myself, but I wrote with divine inspiration, so it still counts. This is all explained in the note, y'see, so it's pretty legit. Except the bits which aren't explained in the note and I just made up afterwards, but they count too, probably.

It has worked out well for the Mormons.

This is an interesting notion though. Is God bound by the physics of the universe? Or did he make a universe that does not need that much attention? Even from archeology and written mythology there was a time before the curse took full effect. We have some concrete evidence and some written notions to that end. Of course humans can believe whatever they want to, and even dismiss the evidence. If the Flood did happen and humans started out from scratch, they had a choice to create a human utopia even then. Even without God or the notion that humans even need a god to lean on. What evidence other than methodology do we have today that is any different than what they had back then? God had forsaken them then, the same as he does now.

 

[Shaihulud]

The conditions of halal are to export food to Muslim countries, why would anyone who loves profit oppose that? You do not like that it will help provide infrastructure to Muslim institutions in Australia?

 

[Tycho Brahe]

I don't care if the food is halal or kosher or not.

It makes no difference to me. The butcher might as well sing "white cristmas" og "born to run" when he/she kills the beast.

And yes, there is a market for halal meat. Why not go for a share of that business?

 

[caketastydelish]

This thread has put me in the mood for a nice bit of kebab.

Kebab is not necessarily Halal, that said, CH should definitely try some.

 

[druidravi]

You all heathens, go to hell and get reborn as a radioactive monkeys for killing holy cows. Let slaughterhouses slaughter horses instead instead of cows for beef you uncivilized barbaric lot . ( I used to be a hindu before I left religion.)

 

[Borachio]

It is amazing how stupid some people are.

It is! And I proudly count myself amongst them. (Actually, it's not with pride at all. I've really no choice in the matter.)

I'm also very often amazed at how clever some people are.

 

[classical_hero]

@El_Mach. Did you not read that the money is used to spread Islam? Why should I be forced to do that, or anyone who isn't a Muslim. Do you think Christians should force others to pay for their religious activities?

 

[Farm Boy]

I've always found that particular comeback more than a shade lacking.

 

[El_Machinae]

@El_Mach. Did you not read that the money is used to spread Islam?

I'll say again: I still don't understand how it's your money being used to do so. I'm not disagreeing with not wanting to support Islamic education. Just not seeing the link to 'your' money.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I've always found that particular comeback more than a shade lacking.

Many times I'd agree. In this case I think it's a perfect comeback given the statement it's replying to.

 

[Farm Boy]

Did I miss the facetiousness? I'm good at missing that.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Nope. My point is, if you follow the logic of the original post, and I use the word logic quite wrongly, the comeback fits.

On it's own I agree with you assesment of that comeback.

 

[JollyRoger]

@El_Mach. Did you not read that the money is used to spread Islam? Why should I be forced to do that, or anyone who isn't a Muslim. Do you think Christians should force others to pay for their religious activities?

You still haven't explained how you are forced to do anything.

 

[classical_hero]

You still haven't explained how you are forced to do anything.

Are you willing to pay for Christians to spread their message? This is exactly what is happening with the profits from an Halal certification going to Islamic Mosques and schools. Just re-read the article in the OP.