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Civ5 - shipping with Steamworks * plus Digital Deluxe Edition

Discussion in 'News Updates' started by V. Soma, May 6, 2010.

  1. cairnsy44

    cairnsy44 Gooner - first class

    Jan 23, 2006

    Amen to everything you said. I have gone from "Definitely buying as soon as it comes out" to "Hmm...if I ever DO get this, it will be later and see if they back off requiring Steam."
    Available from any digital distribution service without all the extra baggage.
  2. xenobiotic

    xenobiotic Chieftain

    Dec 6, 2007
    Wrong. Civ4 has over 3 million sales. This site (the largest) has a total of 180,000 members, most of which do not have civ4. How do you figure this Civ4 was a big success because of modders?

    Do you honestly believe that if civ5 is acclaimed as much as civ4 that all these people will not buy the game on principle? Please. Look at the preorder sales for civ5 on steam 4 months before release. Looks like it is going to do fine, just like all games on steam.
  3. tiberion02

    tiberion02 Chieftain

    Dec 30, 2007
    This reminds me of the L4D2 and MW2 boycotts. You know, lots of rage, and then the raging people go out and buy it anyway because the game is good and they dont want to miss it.
  4. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Retired Moderator Supporter

    Oct 22, 2008
    Quoting this, because i hope, that Elizabeth will be able to answer these questions, when she comes online again.

    And i have to say, that i appreciate this community management and the work, thanks :).

    What i do not appreciate is steam, but i've already said that.
    *sigh* i would even have thought about buying a new computer only for Civ5 *sigh*.
  5. Lord Xavius

    Lord Xavius Mostly Lurking

    Mar 13, 2010
    The Internet
    While I do not have a problem with Steam being required (gasp!), I am NOT fond of this whole Babylon business. I am a gamer who likes to have physical copies of games. Now you are forcing me, and those like me, to purchase a download in order to gain access to a civilization. If you would make a physical version of this Deluxe Edition, I might consider buying it. Just the civilization as downloadable content wouldn't be that bad, either.

    Also, while I have the opportunity: can you please reveal the "final two" civilizations? Inca? Persians? Spanish? Norse? Thai? Something else? It would be really helpful (if this has already been revealed, I'm counting on some friendly community member to direct me to the source).
  6. Eejit

    Eejit Chieftain

    Jun 4, 2002
    Northern Ireland
    Steam are providing a better service to developers and customers. It's hardly anti-competitive practice, the other digital retailers just need to step up their game to compete.
  7. Arakhor

    Arakhor Dremora Courtier Moderator

    Mar 27, 2009
    They are probably providing a better service to developers and to most customers. There are those of us who spent their 20s playing the classic single-player games when texting was still an Internet-only thing and Internet games were MUDs. It is sad that in just ten years that world has vanished altogether and those who wish for it are pilloried in the name of progress.
  8. RD-BH

    RD-BH Human

    Mar 5, 2009
    Formerly: Missouri, USA
    Case in point:
    I made about $1000.00 US purchases on iTunes
    ... (mixed bag, video and audio).
    You can burn the audio to playable CDs,
    ... so I burned my audio.
    You cannot burn playable DVDs,
    ... so I didn't bother.
    When I lost my 1TB harddrive,
    ... I lost all the videos.
    As if that wasn't bad enough,
    ... when I plugged my iPod in
    ... (after reinstalling software)
    ... the program "autosynced"
    ... wiping out my few remaining titles.

    Now, all this is my own fault;
    ... I should have backed up DVDs as data
    ... even if I couldn't burn playable copies.

    Steam (to its credit) lets you redownload,
    ... iTunes does not.

    My point:
    I have made absolutely ZERO purchases of DRM products since that loss.
    I will NOT purchase any new software with DRM or "Online Activation Required".
    I am still the same person,
    ... I will make poor judgements from time to time.
    ... I will lose data from time to time.
    Given that inevitable loss,
    ... I am weary and frustrated with
    ... ... companies protecting their own butt
    ... ... instead of their consumer's butt.
    They repeatedly make consumers jump through hoops
    ... for overpriced,
    ... ... unfinished,
    ... ... and just plain faulty crap.
    It is time they jumped through the hoops!
    After all, it's my hard earned cash.
    ... Especially in this economy.

    Do the companies care about me? Nope.
    Do I care about the companies? Nope.

    We have a workable agreement,
    ... They keep their products.
    ... I keep my money.

    I choose not to fund Corporate Fascism**.

    ... fascism == oppressive control
  9. Aravorn

    Aravorn Deity

    May 14, 2002
    Mos Eisley
    I am not overly happy about this. I have purchased all the new releases immediately because I am a CIV addict, but I am wondering if I might wait and see what happens with this version of CIV.

    I am still enjoying CIV IV.
  10. madviking

    madviking north american scum

    May 22, 2005
    To repeat what has been said <insert large number here> times: DLC SUUUUUUUCKS

    And I'm wondering about how multi (I've just starting playing Civ4BTS online with a buncha my friends) and modding are gonna work if a) the files are there but you can't touch them, b) separate versions. Cuz if it's gonna be b, things will get fun when peeps start putting up the DLC on the dl page for free. Anarchy would ensue I presume?

    If all else fails, Civ3 Conquests is still getting me by. :D
  11. visithwy61

    visithwy61 Chieftain

    Nov 1, 2007
    i rarely post, but ill add my voice to those that say they are probably not going to buy this game. i was pumped when i heard the game announced. in anticipation of this game, when buying my new computer, i spent the extra money to buy a laptop that would be able to more than handle civ 5. now this computer probably wont have the joy of playing the latest civ game. oh well there are other games out there to play. if firaxis and 2k want to go down this route, i wont follow. its absolute bs that i have to install this kind of software from a third party to play a game that i bought and have a physical copy of. i know 2k could give a :):):):) about what a few hundred people on a message board have to say, so i hold no hope they will change their mind. i also know that as a company they could give a :):):):) about their most loyal customers (such as myself), as long as they make their money; so :):):):) them.

    two things i hope for:

    1. that the product they put out is :):):):)

    2. the hacking community puts a non-steam version out within a day or two to completely put 2k's decision to shame
  12. TCMIV

    TCMIV Barış Manço

    Jan 31, 2010
    You're definitely not a loyal customer if you hope for these two things, so yes, they absolutely don't care about you.

    The misconceptions about how steam works are hilarious in this thread, like the person who didn't know if steam would censor his mods if they added nude leaderheads and Hitler :lol: Steam has no control over what you mod in to your game, it doesn't look through your game files and say "omg hitler mod, ban."
  13. Sciguy001

    Sciguy001 CiV Great Scientist (duh)

    Oct 25, 2008
    the CFC Forums
    Is there an official internet petition against this yet? There should, you'd already have a few hundred signers from this thread alone.
    There certainly is a lot of smiley faces in this thread :)
  14. visithwy61

    visithwy61 Chieftain

    Nov 1, 2007
    ok i guess i should just take it in the ass. i was too young for civ 1, but from civ 2 on ive bought at least one copy of the stand alone game, and practically all the expansions when released. yea i dont know the ins and outs of how steam works, and i dont want to know. dont worry though, i have a pretty good general idea.

    i buy game, i activate game via a code or a website; end of transaction. i dont like adding all kinds of bs software on my computer. and if id have to deal with the program after activation, which sounds likely, then all the worse.

    saying i hope the game is :):):):) may be harsh because i always like a good civ game, but seeing them go down this route elicits strong emotion from me.

    i wont remotely back down from hoping it gets hacked quickly. id like to see these companies learn that all this bs they are doing isnt working.
  15. Sheershaw

    Sheershaw Chieftain

    May 6, 2010
    You support buying single civilizations for $10?
  16. Rub'Rum

    Rub'Rum Hates acronyms

    Nov 25, 2007
    Sad truth: The raving, raging and boycott threats online prior to so many games being released these days has no impact on the decisions of the developers, after years of this issue being brought up. If it actually affected their sales they would know somehow and change strategy. Conclusion: 90% people who say they won't buy it WILL buy it. And that's 90% of the like what, 20% of people who are actually aware of these issues and actually notices they require Steam or DRM is being installed on their PC.

    You will fail like these people :

    Spoiler :

    The DLC and 10$ civ is the issue.
  17. 2K Elizabeth

    2K Elizabeth <span style="font-weight:bold; text-decoration: un

    Nov 5, 2007
    Novato, CA
    I can answer some of these questions - others I'm going to have to test personally.

    1. While Steam offers an offline mode, it appears to only function if I explicitly enter offline mode while I have an active internet connection. Given that I also have Valve games that I play online, it isn't likely that I'll enter offline mode frequently; will I be able to play CiV if I do not explicitly enter offline mode but lack an active internet connection? Currently, I cannot even start Steam without active internet, as it attempts to update when I start it and simply hangs there until it can contact the official servers (Steam is fully updated as well).

    Yes, I believe you should be able to without an internet connection. The game will function like other games that use Steam - you will have to be in offline mode, but you will be able to play. I'm not sure exactly why your Steam account is doing what it's doing, though, so tonight I'm going to test a variety of games on my account and see how exactly offline mode works without internet connection. But while you need Steam for the game, you can play offline.

    2. Will CiV follow the standard Steam policy of requiring complete updates in most scenarios? In particular, will a fully updated game be required to play the game in offline mode, and will I be able to play multi-player games without having updated to the latest version? This is primarily a concern with updates breaking any mods I have installed and breaking compatibility with existing saves. In a similar vein, will there be any support for rolling back to a previous version, should I need to reinstall the game at a later date (so I may continue using any mods or saves I have backed up)?

    One of the things I know we are striving for is a cohesive and better experience with mods - so this is something again I have to ask more about, but I know we're aiming to have the game be up-to-date AND the mods still work. Again, this is something I'll have to test personally - I believe I've played offline without updating, but until I check it out myself right now, I don't want to vouch for my memory.

    I'll also have more info on how patching will work (and the modding scene in general) in the coming weeks and months. But as I said before, we are very dedicated to the community. It's a priority for me to make sure those elements work well.

    3. Will CiV use Steam to manage the installation of mods? I'm thinking primarily of something like the VPK system used for Left4Dead here, though there is a DLC tab for L4D2 as well (as far as I know however, it's only used for the pre-order baseball bat). I am mostly curious to know if a more formalized module installation system is in effect or being developed.

    Again, I think that over the coming weeks and months as we explain exactly how the ins and outs of the system works for you, this will become clear. I have some big features planned. These questions are already en route to being answered for you!

    4. Not a Steam question, but I'll ask anyways: Are Babylon assets included in non-deluxe installations? Obviously I wouldn't be able to play as Babylon without purchasing the deluxe version, but will I see Babylon in multi-player games? Will I see Babylon in single-player games? If Babylon assets are included in the non-deluxe version, will there be steps taken to prevent their usage in mods?

    I'll get back to you on this one. I don't know!
  18. Aravorn

    Aravorn Deity

    May 14, 2002
    Mos Eisley
    Steam doesn't bug me that much.

    DLC does though.
  19. MetHimPikeHoses

    MetHimPikeHoses Unarmed Insurgent

    Nov 10, 2005
    Oregon, USA
    woo hoo, bring it on
  20. Quintillus

    Quintillus Archiving Civ3 Content Supporter

    Mar 17, 2007
    I believe this is mostly a problem when Steam downloads an update while it's online, and has to restart to apply the update. If you choose not to apply the update as soon as it's downloaded (i.e. if you started Steam because you want to jump into a game), and are not connected to the Internet the next time you start Steam, then the next time Steam will apply the update, and (I think) then require logon information and an Internet connection. If Steam isn't partway through an update cycle when you log off, I don't think there should be any issue. But Steam does have updates fairly often. Nevermind, conveniently, there was an update tonight, so I tested it myself, and I was still able to start Steam properly even in the scenario I thought would trip it up.

    I'm glad I did happen across this thread at the right time to find your answers on the last page, though. Didn't really feel like digging through 18 pages to find nonspeculative information.

    I don't like the Steam-only policy, though. Better to go the Empire: Total War route than the Assassin's Creed 2 one, for sure, but all else equal I'd rather have a native install than Steam. Not that I don't use Steam - often the sale prices make up for it not being a physical copy, being a college student without a year-round job, but I'd rather have a physical copy and know that even if Steam goes haywire or Valve goes bankrupt or shuts down Steam, I can still play Civ. I suppose my overall preference is what Stardock has done with its products on Impulse, where you can buy a physical copy and ignore Impulse completely, but you can also register your games on Impulse and download them if you do happen to lose the CDs (and Stardock/Impulse is still running). Steam also just generally leads to slower startup times, and gives me less confidence in support for modded scenarios.

    DLC is at least as big of a disappointment, though. If there are worthwhile additions, I'd like to have them, but the prices for DLC are in general not worth the money. Expansion packs (which we'll probably see as well?) tend to be a better value, and more of a jump in the game's abilities (which I find enjoyable). I've yet to buy any DLC, and don't expect Civ would change anything (especially if it's anywhere near as moddable as III/IV). To me it just provides more reason to wait for the Complete package, whenever that eventually comes out.

    The one definitely good outcome of this is the sale on Civ3 and Civ4 on Steam right now (75% off). If I hadn't already bought Civ4BTS on Steam on a previous sale, bought Civ4Vanilla at launch (and since lost one of the CDs), bought Civ3 on Impulse, and bought both Civ3 Vanilla and Conquests at retail (I use the retail version instead of Impulse 99% of the time), I'd buy them now - prices are a factor, so long as DRM isn't Assassin's Creed 2 or Spore-style oppressive.

    It's also probably worth noting that 2K probably decided this for business reasons, rather than Firaxis deciding on this. Unfortunately the business-oriented publishers often have all too much say in these matters rather than the developers who actually make the game.

    My question, though, is, will the boxed edition contain a good manual? That would be worth a whole lot more than a free map pack to me.

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