[NFP] Civilization VI: Possible New Civilizations Thread

[Duke William of Normandy]

It seems like an unlikely misdirection.

I would say there is a low but non-zero chance that the Kublai Khan/Vietnam datamining was an unintentional red herring resulting from a path they ultimately didn't follow.

That would be a shame. And if they did put Kublai Khan in as a leader of Mongolia and China, we could have Charlemagne leading France and Germany in a Civ 7 game.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

That would be a shame. And if they did put Kublai Khan in as a leader of Mongolia and China, we could have Charlemagne leading France and Germany in a Civ 7 game.

- Or in a Post NFP Alternative Leader emphasis Civ VI DLC. Faint Hope, but they have to keep the designers busy util Civ VII goes into full gear . . .

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

After skimming through the list of Vietnamese leaders from wikipedia, and its lackluster selection of not-Trung Trac Empresses and Queens, I have some possible conclusions:

1) The Vietnamese leader is a mythical female character
2) The Vietnamese leader is a female regent, like Catherine de Medici
3) Because this is a DLC pack and not an expansion, the practice of including 3 female leaders is null and the Vietnamese leader is a man
4) Vietnam is not a civ; the datamining was a false lead

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

After skimming through the list of Vietnamese leaders from wikipedia, and its lackluster selection of not-Trung Trac Empresses and Queens, I have some possible conclusions:

1) The Vietnamese leader is a mythical female character
2) The Vietnamese leader is a female regent, like Catherine de Medici
3) Because this is a DLC pack and not an expansion, the practice of including 3 female leaders is null and the Vietnamese leader is a man
4) Vietnam is not a civ; the datamining was a false lead

Interesting theories. I do hope for either Le Loi or the Trung Sisters. And as a side note, I never really do understand the dislike for Catherine de Medici by some people. She was by no means the best choice for France, but damn me if she wasn't a good one. She was able to take control of France during the Religious Civil War in France and was, by all means, a genius diplomat and domestic politician.

 

[Guandao]

Vietnam's leader could be Lady Trieu instead.........

 

[IvoryPavane]

Oh, that's what I tried to say in the previous post. I think they will; and if Trung Sisters don't show up, the leader choice will be very likely from the Emperors of Vietnam dynasties.

Given the new model of NFP, I wouldn’t be surprised if the 3 females per expansion was removed in favour of more “obvious” leader choices.

As a lady myself however, I would be disappointed. Particularly when the pass so far has brought us one lady leader with an interesting but complex play style and five absurdly powerful males.

One of the greatest joys of discovering Civ for me was reading about all the adventures of Gorgo, Gitarja, Catherine etc etc etc

 

[SirMediocrity]

Interesting theories. I do hope for either Le Loi or the Trung Sisters. And as a side note, I never really do understand the dislikes for Catherine de Medici. She was by no means the best choice for France, but damn me if she wasn't a good one. She was able to take control of France during the Religious Civil War in France and was, by all means, a genius diplomat and domestic politician.

I actually like Catherine a lot. She was pretty influential and has a unique personality as well.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

I actually like Catherine a lot. She was pretty influential and has a unique personality as well.

Well, then I wasn't referring to you or me. No bad faith intended.

 

[sukritact]

City-States in the DLC:

• Anshan
• Ayutthaya
• Johannesburg
• Nalanda
• Samarkand
• Chinguetti
• Wolin

Which definitively rules out Siam (Ayutthaya), South Africa (Johannesburg), the Timurids (Samarkand), probably the Almoravids (Chinguetti). Though I don't think any of them were on the table anyways except maybe Siam and South Africa.

Nice to see Siam in the same game as the Khmer regardless. Maybe one day we'll get both in the same game as full civs. If Early Modern Sweden can live alongside Medieval Norway, Early Modern Siam really shouldn't conflict with the Medieval Khmer Empire.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Vietnam's leader could be Lady Trieu instead.........

She seems more like a Hero or Great General than a civ leader.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

City-States in the DLC:

• Anshan
• Ayutthaya
• Johannesburg
• Nalanda
• Samarkand
• Chinguetti
• Wolin
  
  Which definitively rules out Siam (Ayutthaya), South Africa (Johannesburg), the Timurids (Samarkand), probably the Almoravids (Chinguetti)
  
  Though I don't think any of them were on the table anyways except maybe Siam and South Africa.

Well then. You've got some work to do, eh? But in all seriousness, it's a bit sad that we won't see Siam or the Timurids.

 

[Guandao]

How about Ly Chieu Hoang?

Here's an apparent reconstruction of her clothing.

 

[8housesofelixir]

3) Because this is a DLC pack and not an expansion, the practice of including 3 female leaders is null and the Vietnamese leader is a man

Random inference:

Currently we have Hojo Tokimune in the game, who fought with Kublai during the Mongol invasions of Japan.
Kublai is very likely to come into the game in January.
Kublai will come with Vietnam, a country that also fought with Kublai during his reign.

During Kublai's Mongol invasions of Vietnam (1282-1288), the Vietnam leaders were Trần Khâm (Trần Nhân Tông, then emperor) and Trần Hoảng (Trần Thánh Tông, then Emperor Emeritus and also a general, had experienced the 1st Mongol invasion when he was emperor).

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

How about Ly Chieu Hoang?

Here's an apparent reconstruction of her clothing.

The wikipedia article doesn't exactly inspire with any sparkling anecdotes.

 

[Guandao]

Looks like Firaxis ditched the 3 female leaders approach for the New Frontier, then. For better or worst. At least we don't get Maria the Mad for Portugal again.

 

[SirMediocrity]

Well, then I wasn't referring to you or me. No bad faith intended.

I didn't mean to sound accusatory when I said "actually." My bad.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Looks like Firaxis ditched the 3 female leaders approach for the New Frontier, then. For better or worst. At least we don't get Maria the Mad for Portugal again.

There are still the other possibilities I suggested, such as a mythical female leader or Vietnam just not being in the game. Plus, there could be much better female regent leaders that just don't appear in wikipedia articles.

 

[notNamed]

During Kublai's Mongol invasions of Vietnam (1282-1288), the Vietnam leaders were Trần Khâm (then Emperor) and Trần Hoảng (then Emperor Emeritus and also a general, experienced the 1st Mongol invasion during his reign).

Don't forget the Vietnamese royal who was ousted in the Trần coup and so helped defend Korea against the Mongols. Involving these folks with the theme of Mongol expansions in the east is downright cheating.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

What about Nam Phuong? She was the last Empress Consort, and while she didn't hold nominal power, seemed to have been popular as a civil leader. She did charity work with the Red Cross and was on the post-WW2 reconstruction committee for Vietnam. Unfortunately, her husband was complicit with the Japanese during WW2, and they were ousted by the Communist takeover in the 50s. She lived the remainder of her life in exile in France.

 

[8housesofelixir]

Don't forget the Vietnamese royal who was ousted in the Trần coup and so helped defend Korea against the Mongols. Involving these folks with the theme of Mongol expansions in the east is downright cheating.

Ah, Lý Long Tường. He will be an interesting Great General choice.