I assume that Moors will eventually respawn as the Barbary coast?
Poland can haz curbstomp Russia?
Cholas will be great
Tibet needs to be Yellow so China can stomp Tibet properly
Dawn of Civilization - an RFC modmod by Leoreth
- Thread starter Leoreth
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I assume that Moors will eventually respawn as the Barbary coast?
Poland can haz curbstomp Russia?
Cholas will be great
Tibet needs to be Yellow so China can stomp Tibet properly
Hippo8085
Shaken, not stirred
Or perhaps when they are meant to collapse, that might weaken Tibet sufficiently to be an easy target for China.
This is exactly why I was reluctant to release incomplete early on. Of course the Tamils will have a conquest goal (but I don't think pillaging suits them). But that hardly fills all three goals. And no, it will not be the massive artistmongering of the Japanese or Mughal goals.
Yes, 300 BC was the plan, also to keep Southern India occupied before India can settle it. I had the dates mixed up with Thailand.
Everything will be rebalanced according to its performance in the game anyway.
I think that AI Tibet will be eventually absorbed by China regardless.
On the subject of the Moors and Iberia...
In the picture, I moved the sheep 1N and the wine 1E, and I edited the river to make it more geographically accurate and allow Madrid to still be next to it.
Currently, Spain spawns in 720 AD one tile south of the Madrid labeled in the picture. However, the most important Islamic city in Spain was Cordoba, which can't exist at the same time as the current spawn city for Spain. Instead, Spain should either:
A.) Start in 720 AD at Ovideo or Leon, to represent the Kingdom of Asturias/Kingdom of Leon. This would require a small or non-existent flip zone, the 1N Madrid being an Independent city at the start of the 600 AD scenario, and the capital to be programmed to flip to Madrid on capture.
B.) Start in 1080 AD at the Madrid labeled, to represent Madrid and Toledo being retaken by the Kingdom of Castile. The flip zone would be everything north of Cordoba (On the Iberian peninsula, of course.)
Also, at the start of the 600 AD scenario, Corduba should be an independent city, and we need to figure out a way to have Islam spread to the Spanish cities controled by the Moors. Maybe they could start with Islamic missionaries?
In the picture, I moved the sheep 1N and the wine 1E, and I edited the river to make it more geographically accurate and allow Madrid to still be next to it.
Currently, Spain spawns in 720 AD one tile south of the Madrid labeled in the picture. However, the most important Islamic city in Spain was Cordoba, which can't exist at the same time as the current spawn city for Spain. Instead, Spain should either:
A.) Start in 720 AD at Ovideo or Leon, to represent the Kingdom of Asturias/Kingdom of Leon. This would require a small or non-existent flip zone, the 1N Madrid being an Independent city at the start of the 600 AD scenario, and the capital to be programmed to flip to Madrid on capture.
B.) Start in 1080 AD at the Madrid labeled, to represent Madrid and Toledo being retaken by the Kingdom of Castile. The flip zone would be everything north of Cordoba (On the Iberian peninsula, of course.)
Also, at the start of the 600 AD scenario, Corduba should be an independent city, and we need to figure out a way to have Islam spread to the Spanish cities controled by the Moors. Maybe they could start with Islamic missionaries?
In my opinion, the current Sevilla spot would be better as Cordoba (geographically more accurate and because of the starting position of Spain)
But I like the idea of letting the Spanish spawn at Leon and have Madrid as an Indie city. But I would n't move Madrid.
But I like the idea of letting the Spanish spawn at Leon and have Madrid as an Indie city. But I would n't move Madrid.
Hippo8085
Shaken, not stirred
Because a human player is so going to settle Leon and not move the capital 1W to Santiago. Also Qurtuba must be coastal so they can expand into the Barbary coast.
The map I think should stay the same, and the coastal Qurtuba, when taken by Spain, turns into Sevilla. You just don't see Cordoba being that major a Spanish city compared to Sevilla, and my guess is most players would burn it to build Cadiz. Keep Madrid where it is, as the capital, otherwise Iberia will be some ugly combination of non-coastal cities except for Lisbon, which would essentially make Spain humans having to expand into France and AI being stuck in the Iberian penninsula.
The map I think should stay the same, and the coastal Qurtuba, when taken by Spain, turns into Sevilla. You just don't see Cordoba being that major a Spanish city compared to Sevilla, and my guess is most players would burn it to build Cadiz. Keep Madrid where it is, as the capital, otherwise Iberia will be some ugly combination of non-coastal cities except for Lisbon, which would essentially make Spain humans having to expand into France and AI being stuck in the Iberian penninsula.
strijder20
Wallowing in irony
Leoreth, just wanted to say that I love what you have done to the classical Mediterranean. I'm playing Egypt, and the Greeks just declared on me - I didn't expect an army to pop-up next to my city! Now they actually have a chance of reaching their historical empire.
But are the Koreans supposed to have Crossbowmen in 50 AD? I opened WB to see how well Rome was doing and noticed that the Koreans were slaughtering the Chinese, using a unit which has no counter yet.
But are the Koreans supposed to have Crossbowmen in 50 AD? I opened WB to see how well Rome was doing and noticed that the Koreans were slaughtering the Chinese, using a unit which has no counter yet.
Then what's the point of having the Moors at all? Can't the Moors spawn in North Africa, but have their capital moved to Qurtuba once they capture it, like Phonecia to Carthage? Spain could spawn at 1N Madrid in 1080 and raze Cordoba, letting them found Cadiz and Santiago. That way, it would be just like how it is now, except that they get a few extra workable tiles in the north that they previously couldn't get.
Lone Wolf
Deity
- Joined
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Personally, I think that with all these new civs, we really will need a new, larger map 
This mod is starting to have too much MOAR, imho. Anyway, nobody forces me to download new versions (or click these promised checkboxes with new civs) and I can learn to compile and modify the SDK myself if I so choose.
Tamils probably demand enlarging India a bit. RFC India isn't that large, and having many civs doing a 2CC is not the optimal idea.
This mod is starting to have too much MOAR, imho. Anyway, nobody forces me to download new versions (or click these promised checkboxes with new civs) and I can learn to compile and modify the SDK myself if I so choose.Tamils probably demand enlarging India a bit. RFC India isn't that large, and having many civs doing a 2CC is not the optimal idea.
Hippo8085
Shaken, not stirred
Oh, because those civilizations didn't press against each other in real life.
Anyways, that is what fall and conquer is for, isn't it?
Also, on the Spain spawn: Madrid is better because:
1) The AI won't move their capital unless forced, and where would a reasonable capital be before that?
2) Spain is meant to eventually wipe out the Moors anyway, so no leftover Moor culture in Spain.
However, I do have fear that the Spain and Moors will coexist in Iberia forever. If there must be a respawn of the Moors, make an equivalent with Barbarian cities along the Barbary coast or just spawn a bunch of Privateers or Barbarian Frigates (Dare I say it).
Anyways, that is what fall and conquer is for, isn't it?
Also, on the Spain spawn: Madrid is better because:
1) The AI won't move their capital unless forced, and where would a reasonable capital be before that?
2) Spain is meant to eventually wipe out the Moors anyway, so no leftover Moor culture in Spain.
However, I do have fear that the Spain and Moors will coexist in Iberia forever. If there must be a respawn of the Moors, make an equivalent with Barbarian cities along the Barbary coast or just spawn a bunch of Privateers or Barbarian Frigates (Dare I say it).
Moshe Dayan
Da General
This was my chief concern with keeping the Indian civ the way it is now. However, I had the same worries in regards to SE Asia with the Khmer/Thai situation, and in the recent Japan test run I did of 1.9 it worked surprisingly well. At the very least, it was preferable to just watching China steamroll/vassalize Khmer like the AI has a tendency to do in normal RFC.
I think the problem could probably be solved by adding few more coastal resources in Southern India. Production would suck, but then again this is RFC India we're talking about.
I'm not sure atm whether I'll move Madrid north. I think Spain needs a slightly later spawn (~ Kingdom of Leon), probably in Oviedo. Then the Moors could build Tulaytula/Toledo which could later be renamed to Madrid. There'll be at least one city in the Maghreb they'll flip to make access to Africa easier. And of course they'll have Islamic missionaries on spawn.
Yep, they're not as successful as I'd like them to be though (and the downside is if they collapse everyone Rome has nobody to use their UP against). I hope you could handle the Greeks by the way.
Yes, AI Korea gets them to defend against China. Did they use them to invade China proper?
Tomorrow's Dawn
Heroes Never Die
Honestly, the Crossbowmen are a bad idea. Please get rid of them. It's anachronistic.
Longbow archers would be more accurate, appropriate, and better for balance.
Japan didn't even have Crossbows during the period of that spawn, as well as the Samurai.
You do realize that the historical Samurai during this time, a Horse Archer, is the perfect counter to the CKN, right?
That solves the anarchronism issue and the balance issue. Not to mention the fact that AI China only very, very rarely launches naval invasions against Japan.
That sounds great (especially the idea of really implementing toledo and then a name switch to madrid at ~1560)!
Tomorrow's Dawn
Heroes Never Die
Personally, I think that with all these new civs, we really will need a new, larger map
Tamils probably demand enlarging India a bit. RFC India isn't that large, and having many civs doing a 2CC is not the optimal idea.
I actually agree a bit. I think 1.81 is the penultimate version of DoC,
but I feel like I would like to see my input and historical correctness in future versions,
so I will likely tend to play 1.9 and beyond as well.
Hippo8085
Shaken, not stirred
I don't know about other players, but I would never settle Oviedo, but go 1SW to Santiago, and produce a bunch of settlers. I would burn Qurtuba, Tulaytula, and resettle them Catholic (Much easier way to get rid of Islam rather than persecution, even with the Spanish). I might go burn Marseilles if I am feeling in a Barcelona mood (a city I think ought to be indie at the start because of importance).
iOnlySignIn
Prince$s
I'm relieved.
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I say we get rid of Madrid altogether. Paris and Berlin are already enough crap for European city sites.
Moors spawn in Cordoba (on Coast). Cordoba is renamed Seville if Spain takes it over.
Spain spawns in Oviedo/Santiago.
Barcelona/Valencia spawn as an Indie (on the Silver - perhaps move the Silver around a bit).
There, now Iberia looks efficient.
Hippo8085
Shaken, not stirred
Could still have Moors settle Toledo, their choice, then ~1150 have Spain spawn at Madrid, which then can be moved if desired (I'm weird and actually like the current Madrid spot). Barcelona spawns as is indie (it is at the historical border). The Spain player starts with guilds and a few knights and has to take over Iberia, otherwise fail UHV of no non Catholic civs in Europe. Make Portugal spawn at 1300 and be more powerful (able to take African coast), allowing Spain to settle Santiago.
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