You could try to enable logging (it's in the same file where you enable Python exceptions) and look into the files in My Games\Beyond the Sword\Logs. Especially the PythonErr and PythonDbg files are interesting here (cause I guess there's still something wrong with the Roman UP). You are running the latest revision aren't you?
Dawn of Civilization - an RFC modmod by Leoreth
- Thread starter Leoreth
- Start date
- Status
The American missionary gets whatever religion England has, not the world's dominant religion.
Other ways to play RFC: DoC
Is there any other way to feasibly win this mod with most civs other than attaining their respective UHV?
This mod is amazing, but I've played now more than few games with some of the civs I like and I'm starting to realize many of the games are getting quite repetitive. Religions and scripted wars often create the same sets of antagonism between certain civilizations.
As a more long-term goal, definitely after the Byzantines are worked out, could there be some more variety in ways to win?
UN victory, space race, and cultural victory are impossible for most civs simply due to their spawn date. Current changes to the mod make it even harder for ancient civs such as Rome, Greece and Pheonicia to survive to a point where they can have a good shot at attaining some other form of victory.
As the game stands right now, I'm not even sure if it possible to achieve a conquest or domination victory. Could those victory conditions be adjusted to look at slightly different criteria so that for some powerhouse civs, they could stand a chance at achieving one of those types of victory? (ie: Mongol could get conquest victory, Britain can get domination victory)
Also, I'd still be willing to see some civs start getting 4 UHVs (2 easy and 2 hard). To win, the player must achieve 3 of the 4.
Is there any other way to feasibly win this mod with most civs other than attaining their respective UHV?
This mod is amazing, but I've played now more than few games with some of the civs I like and I'm starting to realize many of the games are getting quite repetitive. Religions and scripted wars often create the same sets of antagonism between certain civilizations.
As a more long-term goal, definitely after the Byzantines are worked out, could there be some more variety in ways to win?
UN victory, space race, and cultural victory are impossible for most civs simply due to their spawn date. Current changes to the mod make it even harder for ancient civs such as Rome, Greece and Pheonicia to survive to a point where they can have a good shot at attaining some other form of victory.
As the game stands right now, I'm not even sure if it possible to achieve a conquest or domination victory. Could those victory conditions be adjusted to look at slightly different criteria so that for some powerhouse civs, they could stand a chance at achieving one of those types of victory? (ie: Mongol could get conquest victory, Britain can get domination victory)
Also, I'd still be willing to see some civs start getting 4 UHVs (2 easy and 2 hard). To win, the player must achieve 3 of the 4.
That's not true
I must admit that I play RFC mainly for the UHVs, not for Civ's traditional victories. It's difficult to make the others winnable for everyone while still ensuring historical accuracy. Maybe it's possible to make the domination requirements dynamic for each era so that for example it's sufficient to conquer the classical world (e.g. Trajan Rome + Sassanid Persia) to win domination in the classical era etc. But I don't know what's possible there yet.
That's not true
Well, if you say so. Although I did read that from one of the RFC threads.
Sandmonster1989
Knights Templar
Cultural victories shouldn't be too hard, neither should a Space Race victory (I mean, Russia already has to construct a space program as part of their UHV, while Japan and Germany have to complete the Tech Tree). Culture Victories because of civs like Rome, Greece, Byzantium, Egypt, Babylon, China, etc. Persia would be the easiest to achieve the UHV for owned land (Rome simply would collapse too early, on many cases).
This makes me want to TRY and complete such Victories!!
This makes me want to TRY and complete such Victories!!
Ambassador
Peacemonger
@Leoreth
Have you any ideas or plans to address the Japanese power problem in most games? They are always on of the major powers (mostly second - fourth place in rank), build too many wonders and are hard to beat. Maybe you could code in some challenges for them like stability problems, kind of civil war etc.? Historically they only did become a super power after 1900 and did never expand that much before that date as they do in DoC (mostly Philippines, Northern China,).
Have you any ideas or plans to address the Japanese power problem in most games? They are always on of the major powers (mostly second - fourth place in rank), build too many wonders and are hard to beat. Maybe you could code in some challenges for them like stability problems, kind of civil war etc.? Historically they only did become a super power after 1900 and did never expand that much before that date as they do in DoC (mostly Philippines, Northern China,).
I think giving Japan more enemies in the lands they're trying to conquer might help. China is currently their only big obstacle. Maybe there can be a few more:
-Korea being added sometime in the short or mid term future might help help add another obstacle for Japan prior to them taking Manchuria.
-I'd like to see the Japanese be more aggressive at fighting the Khmer and Europeans over Indonesia and South East Asian in general.
-In games I've played, Japan's all too often settled way too many cities on the coast of Siberia. That being said, I'd have no problems with them occupying those lands, but only if they were taking them from Russians.
Would it be okay to make Vladivostok really, really high on the Russian settler map priority? If that doesn't work, maybe even hardcode the Russian AI player to found a city on that spot like in 30% of the games? I think Vladivostok is really important for defining the extent of Russia's Eastern border border, puts it into more interesting possible conflicts with Japan, and if done right, could be done in conjunction with giving Russia a bigger role in colonizing North America.
Also Japan conquering Manchuria is completely okay. It's just that sadly China doesn't get strong enough to take it back. The fact that the US AI never fights real wars with Japan doesn't help either.
The US AI would first have to learn how to properly build themselves up before we can throw them into wars with Japan
On Japan itself, I guess we have Rhye's japanophilia shine through here. Maybe it's best to wait until I've come to add Korea until we touch this area.
On Japan itself, I guess we have Rhye's japanophilia shine through here. Maybe it's best to wait until I've come to add Korea until we touch this area.
Ambassador
Peacemonger
Thanks for your always patient ears and replies!
I thought about a topic which we discussed recently - the re-spawns-ability of dead civ, especially in the Middle East. I know they are easily resurrected in the 3000 BC scenario, but what about the 600 AD scen? Are Persia, Egypt, Babylon able to (re)spawn even though they actually never did spawn in the first place? Persia could spawn in 990 as Ghaznawids (given them the objective to invade India) or in 1500 as Safavids; Egypt in 1250 as Mamluks?
What about a flag change for England/Great Britain with the name change in 1700?
What about a leaderhead change for Aztecs and Inkas (Benito Juarez, Simon Bolivar)?
I know, many proposals... Maybe for the not so distant future?
I thought about a topic which we discussed recently - the re-spawns-ability of dead civ, especially in the Middle East. I know they are easily resurrected in the 3000 BC scenario, but what about the 600 AD scen? Are Persia, Egypt, Babylon able to (re)spawn even though they actually never did spawn in the first place? Persia could spawn in 990 as Ghaznawids (given them the objective to invade India) or in 1500 as Safavids; Egypt in 1250 as Mamluks?
What about a flag change for England/Great Britain with the name change in 1700?
What about a leaderhead change for Aztecs and Inkas (Benito Juarez, Simon Bolivar)?
I know, many proposals... Maybe for the not so distant future?
Talking about the distant future is easy, so why not?
And to your question, Egypt, Babylon etc. can come back in 600 AD. I also plan to add some colonial civs (though they will be conditional spawns dependent on the absence of Aztecs and Inca rather than evolutions of them) and do some arrangements for Middle Eastern respawns, but know of no details in particular yet.
England becomes Great Britain under certain circumstances, although I'm not too partial to flag changes. That's mainly because I want to stick to Civ's philosphy of using coats of arms instead of proper flags.
And to your question, Egypt, Babylon etc. can come back in 600 AD. I also plan to add some colonial civs (though they will be conditional spawns dependent on the absence of Aztecs and Inca rather than evolutions of them) and do some arrangements for Middle Eastern respawns, but know of no details in particular yet.
England becomes Great Britain under certain circumstances, although I'm not too partial to flag changes. That's mainly because I want to stick to Civ's philosphy of using coats of arms instead of proper flags.
Orka
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 29, 2010
- Messages
- 106
Personally, I feel like Japan should spawn later in the 3000BC start. 660BC seems way too early, though there were some cultures back then. A later start would deny it access to powerful classical wonders and also mitigate its expansion problems. Besides, there's not too much excitement with regards to the civ early on, anyway.
jammerculture
Prince
On Japan: I have been thinking alot about this civ, partly due it's third UHV condition being included in your "things to work on section". I wasn't going to bring it up until your current goals
were finished but some one mentioned it so here goes.
I don't really feel that Japan as a civ in this game works at all, not just the lame first UHV condition. When I think Japan (in game terms), I think Samurai, Empire of the Rising Sun, and stereos. To reflect this i think a few changes should be made. first off, Japan should spawn later. As it stands you reach the feudal samuria period too early and then conquer china too early, etc etc. The Samurai were not used to conquer China, they were used to fight other Samurai.
At the time of the Japanese spawn, I think that the Island needs to be full of militarily strong independants or barbs. As well, I think Japan should have some kind of stability issues that go away in later times (not sure if this is possible) This could create a first UHV to unite your Island by X date, or before making contact with Europe. This would involve fighting civil wars against independants, and putting down revolts and remain stable, which would be a really unique challenge in this game, although I think this time frame should be very short to not make it get boring.
The second UHV would be to control or vassalize China, Mongolia, Kmer and allow no European settlements in southeast asia in 1950 ish. The third UHV should focus on technology. not really sure how.
On the Middle East and respawns:
I think that care must be taken when playing RFC on the world map to distinguish between civilizations and states. The chinese civilization, for example, has had many different states throughout it's existence but has been the chinese civilization in all of them. The same with the Persians. In terms of the game, every time you change civics, or even research certain techs, it must be assumed that your state has changed as your civ has evolved.
In the case of Persia, I absolutely think it should be respawned, and be a factor in the game throughout history. However, I would not like to see a repsawn of a different Persian state, rather a repsawn of the Persian civ using dynamic naming to differentiate between the states. If I want to play as the Sassanids as opposed to the Samanids, I play SoI. To me the SoI, RFCE, RFC asia and RFC ancient world (this one is in my dreams!) are like playing this game through a microscope. This mod is the big picture, and I really hope it remains that way.
An earlier poster mentioned 3 out of 4 UHV conditions. I think that this is an inevitable extension of the work you are doing lately, which basically deals with respawns and continuity of civs. Adopting a 3/4 or even 3/5 UHV condition victory will enable you to deal with a respawn of a civ like Persia who has no late game UHV conditions.
were finished but some one mentioned it so here goes.
I don't really feel that Japan as a civ in this game works at all, not just the lame first UHV condition. When I think Japan (in game terms), I think Samurai, Empire of the Rising Sun, and stereos. To reflect this i think a few changes should be made. first off, Japan should spawn later. As it stands you reach the feudal samuria period too early and then conquer china too early, etc etc. The Samurai were not used to conquer China, they were used to fight other Samurai.
At the time of the Japanese spawn, I think that the Island needs to be full of militarily strong independants or barbs. As well, I think Japan should have some kind of stability issues that go away in later times (not sure if this is possible) This could create a first UHV to unite your Island by X date, or before making contact with Europe. This would involve fighting civil wars against independants, and putting down revolts and remain stable, which would be a really unique challenge in this game, although I think this time frame should be very short to not make it get boring.
The second UHV would be to control or vassalize China, Mongolia, Kmer and allow no European settlements in southeast asia in 1950 ish. The third UHV should focus on technology. not really sure how.
On the Middle East and respawns:
I think that care must be taken when playing RFC on the world map to distinguish between civilizations and states. The chinese civilization, for example, has had many different states throughout it's existence but has been the chinese civilization in all of them. The same with the Persians. In terms of the game, every time you change civics, or even research certain techs, it must be assumed that your state has changed as your civ has evolved.
In the case of Persia, I absolutely think it should be respawned, and be a factor in the game throughout history. However, I would not like to see a repsawn of a different Persian state, rather a repsawn of the Persian civ using dynamic naming to differentiate between the states. If I want to play as the Sassanids as opposed to the Samanids, I play SoI. To me the SoI, RFCE, RFC asia and RFC ancient world (this one is in my dreams!) are like playing this game through a microscope. This mod is the big picture, and I really hope it remains that way.
An earlier poster mentioned 3 out of 4 UHV conditions. I think that this is an inevitable extension of the work you are doing lately, which basically deals with respawns and continuity of civs. Adopting a 3/4 or even 3/5 UHV condition victory will enable you to deal with a respawn of a civ like Persia who has no late game UHV conditions.
KMRblue1027
Deity
Here's a much farther along Byzantine save then the last one. Still no gold production (So I cheated hard-core sue me.) but I'm having quite a good time with this save.
PS: It's Rev 33 just to clarify
PS: It's Rev 33 just to clarify
Interesting ideas. I don't know if it'd be possible to make uniting Japan a challenge by using only Independents/Barbarians - but I like the deadline of having no contact to Europeans very much.
On the Japanese empire thing, I guess the "highest score" goal tries to encapsulate that ...
I think the "complete the tech tree" goal is fine to represent their technology.
@Leoreth
Can you get the Arabs to respawn in Egypt if they collapse, because that would be pretty cool
And I completely agree with jammerculture, I would say that Japan SHOULD have 2-3 independent cities in its vincity that they need to conquer. Also when you add Korea, you NEED to add some independent cities, to make it hard for them, to reunite the peninsula. But I don't think that Japan needs to have "reunite the island" as a UHV though.
Can you get the Arabs to respawn in Egypt if they collapse, because that would be pretty cool
And I completely agree with jammerculture, I would say that Japan SHOULD have 2-3 independent cities in its vincity that they need to conquer. Also when you add Korea, you NEED to add some independent cities, to make it hard for them, to reunite the peninsula. But I don't think that Japan needs to have "reunite the island" as a UHV though.
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