Foreign Policy: UniversCiv

[Bowsling]

Looks good!

 

[2metraninja]

I am afraid they will tell: "But it is only 2 tiles away from our city, blah-blah" as they asked where it is going to be to avoid too much overlap. Should we tell them then to settle at the U3 spot? As we really have no other option for our Marble city if they settle U1 I think.

 

[cav scout]

Send it as is.

If they want to quibble it just means they are trying to drag things out (either for their own amusement/profit since they know we are desperate or because they plan to attack us).

 

[YossarianLives]

That message looks good enough to me. Let's send it already! We need to know this NAP is in place

 

[YossarianLives]

We have lots of options to consider in our current war with the Spanish team. The course we choose will have a big impact on our relations with UCiv. Some on the team have stated a desire to work with UCiv over the Spaniards. I just wanted to point out we've had problems with UCiv for a long time now.

There was that misunderstanding about the conditions of our first NAP (why can they come up to our borders when they insisted we weren't allowed to? Why haven't they informed us of any of our contacts when they told us that "of course" they would?). And now, their refusal to just confirm that we have a NAP extension in place. We initially contacted them about an extension way back on January 4!

I'm not necessarily saying that I think we should agree to the Spaniards' "alliance" against UCiv, but I do want to point out that they haven't been ideal neighbors themselves. Recently, we have told them that we consider the NAP to be in place, and have asked them to confirm this understanding. They have refused over and over to confirm, instead nit-picking every little thing (we want a border agreement with the nap, that agreement keeps our borders too close too each other, that new agreement denies us our ivory, now the nap is too short, what next?!?!). I think it would be completely reasonable to send them a message verifying that a NAP has not been confirmed, our situation has changed, and if they do want to confirm the NAP, they need to get back to us with exactly what they want our agreement to be. Then we can decide what is best for our team.

In spoilers is the history of our NAP negotiations.

Spoiler :

Hi, UniversCiv,

We wanted to reconnect, and to restart conversation. To that end, we've prepared handy conversation starters:

Firstly, our NAP expires in roughly 15 turns, but the exact end date is a little vague - as is the renewal process. Could you shed some light on the matter?

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Hi Talonschild,

Sorry for the late response. We just agreed on a working process for our diplomacy.
We are still willing to develop fair relations with CFC and to extend the NAP as well as find a settling agreement. How does all that look like on your side?

Bye
Yuufo

We'd like to extend our Non-Aggression Pact to turn 140, and would like to formalize our mutual border with a No-Settling Zone:

Hi,
I think I understand your proposal. Maybe we could work on a more precise city planning, so that our border cities are not too close one from another?

Hi, Yuufo/UniversCiv,

We would like to renew our Non-Aggression Pact (no one will declare war to the other side) until turn 140 including and we would like to finalize the border agreement that goes with it. Taking in consideration your doubts that 2 tiles No-Settling-Zone might not be enough, we are proposing extending the No-Settling-Zone one tile north for Uciv and one tile south for CFC. This will ensure our city crosses wouldn't overlap in any case.

If you agree with the NAP and the border agreement that goes with it, please confirm.

Hi Talonschild,

Just a few words to tell you we are still processing your message. We don't forget you

Bye

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We want to remind you we have a diplomatic agreement to finalize.
Talonschild

Bonjour, Team Uciv,

We would be very glad to finalize our NAP with you. Is there anything that is preventing you from signing our NAP?

Hi Talonschild,

First of all, sorry for answering once again late

We have no hostile intentions towards your nation and are willing to accept a NAP. The only thing that bothers us is the Ivory resource that lies between the mountains.

Bonjour Team UCiv,

We will send you a more detailed message soon, but we just want to confirm that we agree that we will not have any objections to your team connecting the Ivory by settling in the previously suggested non-settling area.

Hi, Yuufo/UniversCiv,

As promised, here is our Non-Aggression Pact and Settling agreement:

Neither of us will declare war on the other until After turn 140. UCiv gets to settle to claim the Elephant and CFC gets to settle to claim the Marble.

Hi,

I think our city would be fine... but where would you found yours so that they don't interfere too much?
By the way we find a NAP till turn 140 is a bit short. Would you mind extending to, say, turn 170?

Yuufo

We accept your offer of a NAP until turn 170. We also suggest a NAP extension until after turn 200. Please confirm the NAP until after turn 170 and let us know whether you agree to extend it to after turn 200.

 

[2metraninja]

It is true they were not the ideal partner and I can tell I think I know why is that - they are just not very well used to the international MP scene and they dont know how to react/conduct politically correct. Anyone ever played with any of them? I can name many of other players in the other teams we had successful diplomacy with which I played at some point and I know they know how things happen normally. But what turned me on thinking Uciv are some plotting evil hidden guys is them telling us they dont have hostile intentions towards our team and not taking the goods we were offering them in desperate attempt to get security.

I dont see them either as long-term strategic partner, but maybe they are not bad to have around.

 

[Sommerswerd]

With SpAp defeated and asking for a NAP, I dont know if getting the NAP with UCiv confirmed is so urgent anymore.

We still have plenty of land to develop so TBH getting NAPs with all our neighbors, including SpAp so we can switch back to a Wonder building Economy building, land grabbing posture is what we want right?

Butif UCiv wants to keep stalling on confirming the NAP... Let them. SpAp attacks them, and then we can say to them "Hey guys, you never confirmed the NAP, situation changed blah blah blah" Then we can get whatever kind of terms we want from them because the shoe will be on the other foot, and UCiv will be the ones desperate for a NAP. Then we can decide if we want to join SpAp in attacking them, or if we just want to sit back and build economy while they fight each other.

 

[RegentMan]

As with my previous posts about UCiv, I am not in favor of having any favorable dealings with this team. They have shown they aren't willing to be friendly nor easy with us. And if they don't get back to us with this current NAP discussion, well... we can wash our hands of them and let the cobwebs grow on our embassy.

 

[Maga_R]

I am not sure it was bad will on UCiv's part, it took us sometimes ages to respond without any bad intent

 

[RegentMan]

Yeah, but we did eventually respond with concrete proposals and ideas. We didn't make vague "maybe" promises and deals.

 

[2metraninja]

We need to tell them that we might want to change our Marble city location a bit while still keep it 2 tiles away from their Elephant city.

 

[2metraninja]

We must send something like:

Just quick reminder that we are still waiting for your acceptance about the duration of our NAP.

We would also like to tell you that we might be forced to change our Marble city location due to continuing war with Spaniards and their cultural borders expanding recently. Our new location will still be 2 tiles away from your Elephant city location, so you can settle it without problems

And we need to decide do we, when and how we tell them about Spaniash alliance against them proposal.

 

[Bowsling]

We should at least wait until the Spanish are about to go to war before we tell them.

 

[2metraninja]

Why? I think we are already facing "war to death" with Spaniards. They won't just turn us their back and go to attack Uciv.

 

[2metraninja]

Now our best play would be to try to convince Uciv to prepare for war with Spaniards and we hit them in some 10-20 turns when we will have the technological advantage. Also this will give time to Uciv to actually prepare for war. Uciv's war elephants will be great against the AGG Spanish axes. And time will make Uciv think and actually commit to war vs Spaniards. If we propose/insist that Uciv just stop their development to go and attack Spaniards, they just refuse. If we give them some 20 turns to prepare normally for war, they might accept.

 

[Bowsling]

Oh, I posted that before I read the war thread. I suppose it is worth it to pass that along to UCiv then.

 

[SilentConfusion]

I would tell them exactly how it happened: They approached our cities, saw we were ready for them, turned back, and later that turn sent us a message asking if we wanted to attack UCiv with them. This will emphasize how changeable and dangerous Zulu can be.

 

[2metraninja]

I would tell them exactly how it happened: They approached our cities, saw we were ready for them, turned back, and later that turn sent us a message asking if we wanted to attack UCiv with them. This will emphasize how changeable and dangerous Zulu can be.

I like the idea.

 

[Caledorn]

I like the idea.

I like this idea too. Simple, neat and honest.

 

[Sommerswerd]

Honesty is best, especially when dealing with allies and potential allies. Let's do it.