Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Perfection, Jun 19, 2011.
What about doing activity that harms and they will it?
God gave us free will so we can make our choices, for good or ill.
So, if you want someone to shoot you, by all means, that's within your rights legally, morally, and cosmically.
God shan't hold against you something you did with that person's explicit, consensual permission.
So the determinism is not on the harm, but on the will of the individual? All we have to do is make a poll, and all those who vote yes, allows us to treat them like dirt, cause they willed it?
Umm... yeah. If you want to be treated like dirt, it'd be rude not to.
God only punishes coercion, not behavior associated with coercion.
Then you have a gray area, such as a mercy killing. It may not be 100% consensual, but if they're suffering...
I am trying to come to an understanding and you just pushed it out of reach again. So as long as you are not coercing those who freely will evil done to them, then one is free to do all the harm they can to them and still go to heaven?
Sounds like a charismatic leader could take advantage of people all the time and still go to heaven. They would never really have to be coercive, just magnanimous. I am sure they would be able to ride the "wave" for quite some time. I apologize if this has hijacked the thread, but I was curious from the wording. It is not sin to take advantage of gullible people?
I would make everyone go to the same world to where they are popped into existence with their memories in tact. The cosmology would be different than our world, but be similar enough not to seem totally alien. And you can die in that world too, whereupon they go to yet another world, also different.
It would be a sin to be manipulative I'd imagine, but if consent was 100% not forced due to trickery or some such, then it is genuine, and God logically won't care what the consent is towards. Sex. Drugs. Violence. Whichever.
I'd sub-contract Skynet to do it. I'm obviously incapable of that much book-keeping.
1. Everyone gets the same afterlife.
2. Everyone's afterlife is freaking awesome. All your dreams will come true, assuming they're not sick and evil dreams.
3. Everyone is forgiven for their ignorance and mistakes, because now they are enlightened and they know what they've done wrong and experienced pain and death and seen what happened to the people they've wronged, and they no longer suffer from mental illness or psychological disorders or just plain rampant ignorance that made them evil. There's also no religious conflict because the "true" religion is known to all, and ideological conflicts have all ended because through enlightenment comes a lack of dispute over ideology, especially in an afterlife realm that is freaking awesome.
4. People will be too busy experiencing all the things they've ever wanted to experience to worry about not letting go of revenge fantasies involving Hitler and a pitchfork inserted into his body. Revenge and hell do not exist in my afterlife.
5. God put me in charge because I am the best person for the job. Therefore, you can question my decisions, but you'll also know they're the right ones. Tough dooky if it's not revenge-y enough for you. I weep for you while you achieve everything nice that you ever thought possible, and how that's not good enough an afterlife for you, mister impossible to please.
I was going to say something like this, too. Mean people and evil people can't help being that way, God made them that way, or the Devil, or maybe neither of them, but still, they can't control how they were made, so why should they be judged based on something outside their control? They shouldn't. Heaven for all.
To give the OP the answer that it deserves, I'd have to write a ten page essay, or perhaps even write a book. But I don't want to do that so I'll sum up what everyone gets in a few words:
Peace, Pleasure, Love, Respect
Of course to say that there is peace and respect is sort of a paradox. Peace is the absence of conflict. Respect is the absence of disrespect. Since in my "heaven" conflict and disrespect wouldn't exist, I doubt there would be a word for them, or a word for the absence of them.
I would make it so everyone and everything is guaranteed an afterlife.
Why not just grant everyone eternal happiness if god is truly benevolent? Damning anyone to eternal suffering seems wholeheartedly evil and malicious. Nothing done in a 100 years on earth is worth suffering for eternity.
It doesn't make sense to me. Not to mention hundreds of other things in religious scripture. This is one of the many many reasons I am non-religious.
This is simply untrue, God doesn't make people evil, they choose to be evil.
I'll dig deeper into the OP at a later date.
@The OP- Honestly I'd be scared to be in charge of such a thing, I know I'd fail at it, God is an impartial judge, I'm not.
I guess this would be my answer as well. How would god choose me? God is obviously the superior judge.
What about nature? Flash flood, tornados, hurricanes, and such. Is nature evil?
Way to say disagree without offering any evidence to the contrary. If people choose to change their personality, it's because their original personality was the type that allowed that change in the first place, evil people can't change because their personality won't allow it. People can say you just need willpower to change, but if you don't have willpower in the first place what can you do? You can't do anything. The temptation to do bad is just too great sometimes.
I would make Hell where all the Christians/religious folk go and Heaven where all the atheists lament where they were wrong for eternity.
This is a good question.
We'd all be reincarnated as a tiny human like creature that lives in god's ears.
I believe in Free Will. I don't believe God creates anyone with an inability to choose good.
Even if we do not have control over whether we sin or not (I say that, occasionally, we do, and life is judged on those moments), we can chose whether or not we'll pray for forgiveness.
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