LK159 - CCM 2.4, Egypt

[ThERat]

Pre-Turn

MM a little to prevent a riot etc.
get IW from Scandinavia for wines and 218gold (all we have)
get mathematics for IW and 5gpt from Aztecs
get CoL for maths and wines from Persia...there are lots of techs there but we can't afford anything now

start min research on literature as nobody has that

IT

Turn 1 - 425BC
zzz

IT one of our enslavers wins on defense against an invisible unit

Turn 2 - 400BC
Nubia must have traded something as they are suddenly very rich with 2200gold

Turn 3 - 375BC
we get another worker

Turn 4 - 350BC
zzz

Turn 5 - 325BC
Pi-Rameses is founded at the coast, boosting our income to 15 gpt

attack a Persian worker pair and end up gaining two slaves

Turn 6 - 300BC
Memphis finishes the siege workshop to gain a barracks too
manage to snatch another slave from Persia

IT Russia and Maghreb sign peace. The entire world starts TGL, so much about our literature minimum run

Turn 7 - 275BC
Nubia is clearly attacking us with invisible units, I cover our enslavers with spears

Turn 8 - 250BC
The capital has finished the admin center and starts Islamic community

IT we lose another spear to an invisible attack...

Turn 9 - 225BC
lose an enslaver to the invisible unit, what monster is this? Bring in more stuff.
we get a vital shipment for 25 gold and have 138 gold now


IT this time we barely defend with an enslaver...

Turn 10 -200BC
I tried chasing the captured worker but its gone...hope our enslaver is safe

We are behind in the tech game of course. We might need to strike Nubia sooner or later. We still have our GA to kick in
That might be a good idea to prepare for war. There is no iron anywhere is sight.
We can almost get literature for some trade value maybe.

 

[ThERat]

We should attempt to get more happy buildings to bring the luxury rate down even further. We now make 24gpt and could actually get literature for a potential multiple tech trade.

 

[Elephantium]

Thebes can work some coastal tiles to get 4 extra commerce and 1 extra happy face.
Memphis can make 1-turn Spears with some MM (halting growth or boosting lux slider 1 tick).
Should Alexandria build Slavery before Temple?
I see we went for the yellow circle for Pi-Ramesses. Bummer.

Nubia will sell us Trade for Horses + 25gpt + 150 gold (the most expensive tech), or Naval Warfare for Horses + 67 gold (better trade bait). We can turn around and hopefully trade NW with France, Persia, and the Aztecs.

Looks like Russia is in the MA already!

 

[LKendter]

I see we at least made some tech process. Looks like tech will continue to be the big challenge. For me the main goal for now is to get to Monarchy, revolt, and start our GA.


ROSTER:

LKendter (up)
Jersey Joe (on deck)
Elephantium
Greebley (waiting to confirm CCM 2.4 working)
TheRat

 

[Elephantium]

We're sticking with min research, right? Couldn't we turn up the slider and get techs every 15-20 turns to improve our trading situation? Or is it critical to build up gold for trading?

 

[LKendter]

200 BC (0)
I go with Elephantium idea, and have Thebes work some coastal tiles.
Memphis is MM to make one turn spears / archers. I slip in an admin center first, as it does give some happy.
Alexandria is far enough from happy issues that I switch to slavery.
Pi-Ramesses switch to building walls. It is at the edge of our empire, and I don't want an enslaver surprise.

Naval warfare has the most civs needing it.
I give Nubia horses and $67 for naval warfare.
We need city-state the most, but the Aztecs and France are insulted by an offer of naval warfare for it. All our GPT and gold once gets up to doubtful.
I give France naval warfare, $78, and $5/turn for philosophy.
I give Aztecs naval warfare and $1/T for literature.
France needs literature, but it is an insult for trade.
It is a bit of a rip, but I give Persia naval warfare and literature for riding and $6.
I give Persia iron working for the optional tech elephant training.
We got 5 techs out of the deal.
France still needs literature, and Persia philosophy. We may get another tech.
Our next 50-turn run is seafaring. Hopefully that one will have trade value.


175 BC (1)
We start working on school of navigator's small wonder to get free exploring ships.
The road on the forest by Memphis lets us drop the luxury rate 10%.


150 BC (2)
France no longer wants literature.


125 BC (3)
We can't get a break on tech. Sea faring is known to Nubia. I swap to city-state for the next tech. We really need that one, as it opens up monarchy.

Our exploring ship near Japan is at risk. Japan won't sign peace at reasonable terms yet.
(IT) We lost the ship by Japan.


100 BC (4)



75 BC (5)



50 BC (6)
We get to attack a pair of Persian archers. 1 dead, and an enslaver retreated from the other. No new workers.
Our exploring ship has found an Aztec city.

Self-research this early isn't great. However, city-state is torture to trade for. I up the science slider to 20% to speed it up. I should have done this the first turn of CS. I hire a couple of scientist, and drop the luxury rate to 10%. That lets me up slider to 30%. CS is due in 11 turns.


25 BC (7)

(IT) Aztecs demand, and get $25 gold. They are too close to risk war with.


1 AD (8)
We spot an enemy enslaver. Our war chariot promptly kills it.


25 AD (9)
We now have 2 Japan ships floating in our seas. They still won't talk peace.
(IT) Japan lands an enslaver by Pi-Ramses.


50 AD (10)
We promptly kill the enslaver.

I sell one of our spare wines to Russia for $54, and $4/T.
Wines as a starting point for a trade with for city-states are an insult to France and Scandinavia. We need to keep checking every turn as self-research gets closer.

 

[LKendter]

Summary:

JJ can figure out if self-research is worth it after city states. We really want Monarch ASAP, and to revolt to our long-term government. Once we have monarchy, we can start our GA.

Our next settler is heading here. It already has escorts, and on the way.
Elephants for trading material should help with the tech problem, at least some.

 

[LKendter]

ROSTER:

LKendter (up)
Jersey Joe (on deck)
Elephantium
Greebley (waiting to confirm CCM 2.4 properly working)
TheRat

 

[Jersey Joe]

Based on the posts, it appears that I am up. I got it. A few questions/comments.

Nubia (when trade agreements run out) is my candidate for our first conquest.
I think we should consider waiting on the GA till around when we get railroads like we did it last game.

What about getting Religion instead of Monarchy and changing to Theocracy. 2 differences:
1. Maximum research: 70% for Monarchy, and 60% for Theocracy.
2. The cost of barracks. Monarchy has Castles (obsolete when learn Jurisprudence) that cost 100 shields. Theocracy has Monasteries (obsolete when learn Napoleonic Age) that cost 60 shields.

 

[LKendter]

Our special GB that gives a easy GA is only good in the first age. If we skip it now, then we have to hope to build the right combo of GB in the future.

IIRC we tried theocracy before, and hated it. I can't recall why. What is the rush method for theocracy? What are the penalties?

First war is really tough to call. We have no iron, no clue where the iron is, and just gave Nubia horses to get stronger. I have no clue if Nubia as burned there initial troops yet.

 

[Elephantium]

We talked about Theocracy 1-2 games ago and decided against it. I tried it in a solo game to check out "the path not taken".

It didn't go too well -- 50% slider max at the time -- I couldn't self-research effectively, but I couldn't save up piles of gold for trade fodder, either. The benefit of Monasteries in more cities didn't help as much as I expected (combined Temple/Granary/Barracks).

I'd be interested in trying it again as France. Napoleonic Age sets them up to build Barracks lasting until Nationalism.

Theocracy has 1 extra MP but is otherwise comparable to Monarchy, according to my notes.

 

[ThERat]

I advise against theocracy.

By the way, Greebley, could it be that you did not use the steam label file? I had the same mess up when not using that. You need to get into the CCM2 folder and rename the 'label - for steam file' to 'label'

 

[LKendter]

If we still are thinking theocracy, then please give me time to review the old games and find the negative comments.

I know fascism is a permanent reject due to the lack of border expansions. I still can't recall the theocracy issue.

 

[Elephantium]

Well, they lose Barracks with Napoleonic Age. I think that was the deal-breaker for you, LK. That leaves us with either a) revolting to Monarchy anyway or b) running things without Barracks until we learn Communism. With a, why not go Monarchy right away when we learn it? With b, 60% research makes that transition take a long time.

My vote is for Monarchy for this game.

 

[Jersey Joe]

We are on the path to get Monarchy.
(For Theocracy to have been a viable choice, we needed 2 things, (1) research Religion right after we learned Philosophy, and (2) the real deal-breaker (because we cannot do it), was needing to be able to use the Sphinx for a GA after we learned rails.)

Nubia declared war on us when I asked them to leave our territory.

Here is the report:

Before Ending 50AD:
MM to get a little more gpt.
Between Turns:
3 Japanese Galleys and 4 Triremes sail near Pi-Ramesses
75 AD:
Move some troops towards Thebes and Pi-Ramesses in case of Japanese troop landing.
Between Turns:
Japanese land Horseman and 2 Crossbow near Pi-Ramesses.
100 AD:
Archer killed by Horseman (0, 1). Archer forces Horseman to retreat. Chariot kills Crossbow (1, 1). Enslaver turns Horseman into worker (2, 1). Enslaver kills Crossbow (3, 1)

Our exploring ship finds an Arabian city. Looks like they are the tech leader.
Between Turns:

125 AD, and 150 AD:

175 AD:
We learn City-State start on Monarchy (due in 24 turns). City-State has a tile penalty so I do not see any good reason to revolt into it for at most 24 turns.
Send Philosophy and City-State to Persia for Trade and 12 gold.

200 AD:
Our exploring ship finds and Aussie city. They are ahead of us in Tech.
225 AD

250 AD:
I suspected that Nubia, running out of room to expand, might attack us after their trade agreement ran out.
Between turns:
5 Nubian Donkey Carts enter out territory by Alexandria. Archer killed by Invisible Unit (3, 2) on Nubian border.
275 AD:
Enslaver makes that dastardly Invisible Unit into a worker (4, 2); Enslaver kills Donkey Cart (5, 2).

I very nicely ask the Nubians to remove their forces from our territory. They break their trade agreement with us and declare war (wish I had traded them lots of gpt for tech before this).
War Chariot kills Donkey Cart (6, 2); War Chariot kills Donkey Cart (7, 2); Catapult kills Donkey Cart (8, 2); Ballista kills Donkey Cart (9,2).

Our territory is visible enemy free.

We are 18 turns away from learning Monarchy.

Memphis was building a Market, but I switched it to a War Elephant (only needs 2 shields to complete so wasting 20 shields).

 

[LKendter]

I do agree with JJ that it looked like an attack coming up.
OUCH - I really didn't feel with were ready for war without iron, and horse units. At least we do have some elephants.
I don't think Nubia has used up there bonus starting units yet. Don't rush across there borders for at least a few turns.

ROSTER:
LKendter
Jersey Joe
Elephantium (up)
Greebley (on deck) (waiting to confirm CCM 2.4 properly working)
TheRat

 

[LKendter]

Our people are to happy right now. Please drop the slider some.
Can we use our spare wine to get any techs?
Can we get peace with Japan to not have a two-front diversion?

 

[Jersey Joe]

The luxury tax is at 10% and research is at 40% next turn some of trades end. Not sure exactly how that will impact our gpt.
Japan is asking for 120 gold for a peace treaty (could probably be negotiated down). The only action from them since I killed the 3 troop landing part have been triremes moving through our waters.

I was holding off on trading hoping that a package including Elephants, Wine, gold, and gpt might be able to get Monarchy.

Nubia has lots of gold. Capturing their cities could fund our getting some techs. Maybe after we beat them up a bit they would be willing to give use tech for peace.

 

[Elephantium]

Just got a Leader. Most expensive thing I can spend it on is a Market. Any other ideas?

 

[Jersey Joe]

Market is not bad, we can use more cash flow.

Trade for Seafaring and build a Port in Thebes or Pi-Ramesses?