New Beta Version - August 16th (8/16)

[Gazebo]

@HixBozo, Yeah I think this game is toast but I'd still like to understand why, to see if there's anything I can tweak (sorry for modding such a fantastic mod, it's just my passion I guess) to prevent it from happening the next time too.

One thing I did mod heavily before this game is the (almost absolutely) removal/conversion of instant yields from policies and standards buildings (haven't touched wonders and beliefs), so I'm guessing the tech outputs I see in info addict should be closer to actual yields than in the base mod.

\Skodkim

Removing instant yields is a surefire way to imbalance CBO, as it is built around them. Also really taints your results to the point that there isn't a lot of usable data. I'm fine with modmods, but you should clarify that and/or post in the modmods subforum with your information.
G

 

[skodkim]

@Gazebo
@Gazebo
Removing instant yields is a surefire way to imbalance CBO, as it is built around them. Also really taints your results to the point that there isn't a lot of usable data. I'm fine with modmods, but you should clarify that and/or post in the modmods subforum with your information.
G

Yeah, I know its a sure way to imbalance CBO but to be frank I hate the instant yields and have always done so ever since they were introduced. I respect that you decided to do introduce them - it's your decission to make - but I've begun removing them and balacing from scratch. CBO contains so many other super-fantastic stuff so playing without is not an option...

But, It's a private modmod that I don't share with anyone and it's the primary reason I don't comment on balance issues.

Is there anywhere I can read aout the parameters I asked about (ABC bonusses and pereramodifiers)?

\Skodkim

Edit: Found it: https://civ-5-cbp.fandom.com/wiki/Customizing_Difficulty_Levels

 

[HixBozo]

Is this a bug ?

I built Slater Mill and it comes with a free Factory. So I had a free factory in the capitol from this wonder. Later I chose an ideology called Workers Faculties (from Order) which gives 5 free factories per the description.

Well it gave me only 4 free factories. Apparently it counts the one from the wonder as a duplicate or something. I should have had 6 free factories in total, not just 5.

 

[chicorbeef]

Is this a bug ?

I built Slater Mill and it comes with a free Factory. So I had a free factory in the capitol from this wonder. Later I chose an ideology called Workers Faculties (from Order) which gives 5 free factories per the description.

Well it gave me only 4 free factories. Apparently it counts the one from the wonder as a duplicate or something. I should have had 6 free factories in total, not just 5.

Right now, I believe the policy should technically say "free factories in your first 5 cities". I think it would make more sense for it to work the way you think it does, and I think someone brought this up before, but it's not a bug.

 

[Deljade]

Right now, I believe the policy should technically say "free factories in your first 5 cities". I think it would make more sense for it to work the way you think it does, and I think someone brought this up before, but it's not a bug.

Which is weird, I was wondering about how this works precisely, and to be safe in my game, I just did not build any Factories in my first 5 cities until I picked that tenet only built Factories in the other cities. If it is not changed to work differently, the tooltip should at least be more precise.

 

[pineappledan]

Slater mill help text also still says it gives a large sum of production on completion, but it doesn’t do that.

that text line has been there for >2 years now. Why hasn’t that been changed yet, or made correct by adding a bonus production on completion?

 

[Stalker0]

that text line has been there for >2 years now. Why hasn’t that been changed yet, or made correct by adding a bonus production on completion?

Did you post the bug on Github?

 

[Amask]

Someone else did a long time ago and it was ignored. The reason was that a factory supposedly counts as a big boost to production.

 

[Deljade]

The big boost to production is the +5 on the building itself

 

[Stalker0]

The big boost to production is the +5 on the building itself

Perhaps, but we don't normally use text to describe that for other wonders. We simply show the yields in the stats without comment, so by using the text this way it implies we are getting something more.

 

[Recursive]

what does this mean?

and why do i get such a diplo bonus?

Woah, what

What version are you using, and are you using modmods? Post a bug report on Github, please, that's highly unusual.

 

[Recursive]

Slater mill help text also still says it gives a large sum of production on completion, but it doesn’t do that.

that text line has been there for >2 years now. Why hasn’t that been changed yet, or made correct by adding a bonus production on completion?

Someone else did a long time ago and it was ignored. The reason was that a factory supposedly counts as a big boost to production.

The big boost to production is the +5 on the building itself

Perhaps, but we don't normally use text to describe that for other wonders. We simply show the yields in the stats without comment, so by using the text this way it implies we are getting something more.

Okay, I've updated the text key to say "+5 Production" for next version.

 

[ChefBRD]

About happiness.
Walls and the likes give 10% needs reduction, so having all four of them is a 40% reduction. Raising it to 15% per building will give a chance for those who want to expand further at the cost of having a complete defense set in every city.

I think this is an excellent idea. This and/or Dong's idea for bonus happiness for colonist-founded cities would add depth and options beyond a more-or-less hard city cap without otherwise changing existing dynamics.

 

[Stalker0]

I think this is an excellent idea. This and/or Dong's idea for bonus happiness for colonist-founded cities would add depth and options beyond a more-or-less hard city cap without otherwise changing existing dynamics.

So ultimately this would push the goalpost but would not change the final verdict. It would extend the viable number of supportable cities before "incredible unhappiness" kicks in. However, after adding X cities, you would be in the same boat you are now.

Of course the key question is...is the new X large enough that it doesn't matter? In other words are we supporting enough cities that even an aggressive expander really wouldn't have cause for any more?

 

[usadefcon1]

About happiness.
Walls and the likes give 10% needs reduction, so having all four of them is a 40% reduction. Raising it to 15% per building will give a chance for those who want to expand further at the cost of having a complete defense set in every city.

I think this is an excellent idea. This and/or Dong's idea for bonus happiness for colonist-founded cities would add depth and options beyond a more-or-less hard city cap without otherwise changing existing dynamics.

'How happy are those whose walls already rise!'

 

[InkAxis]

I was thinking, should this be made the new official version? The current one has a lot of bugs and this version has fixed all of them. And the changes in this version are not too controversial either. Obviously there are still complaints about stuff like tech/happiness but it's not any worse than the current official version and at least then the bugs will be fixed.

 

[JamesNinelives]

I kinda like that unhappiness stays relevant in the end-game. Especially because there are other late-game buildings and stuff that give happiness. And late-game buildings get build little enough already. Also, I tend to invest a lot in keeping my empire happy - e.g. pagodas are really good for combatting unhappiness, even though they tend not to be as strong in other areas. There are also late-game tenets that reduce unhappiness. It would feel a bit cheesy if that stuff became irrelevant.

I was thinking, should this be made the new official version? The current one has a lot of bugs and this version has fixed all of them. And the changes in this version are not too controversial either. Obviously there are still complaints about stuff like tech/happiness but it's not any worse than the current official version and at least then the bugs will be fixed.

I agree. There is another new version coming out soon so I understand if that's the intended 'new official version'. This one seems good though, at least it's largely stable.

 

[HixBozo]

Noticed the other day one ideology tenet from Freedom I think. Forgot its name but what strikes me was how useless it is. Almost looks like typo mistake or something. It says it gives +10 influence with all CS upon expending a Great Person. I said wait a minute, so late game stuff giving 10 tiny influence ?!? That is really nothing. At that point influence levels run in the hundreds. And the requirement is a whole Great Person. The other effect mentioned was gaining 40 influence upon gifting a unit, that's more okay. But the +10 is rather insignificant really, could they have ment +100 instead, just a typo ?

 

[HixBozo]

Even + 100 influence does not look like worth it. You know ideology tenets give lasting powerful effects. This one is unoptimized, kind of slipped away (maybe from old versions) and is very underwhelming as it is. Stay away from it. A single diplomat only gives + 130 influence for comparison. + 10 influence, not enough for anything meaningful.

 

[CrazyG]

Even + 100 influence does not look like worth it. You know ideology tenets give lasting powerful effects. This one is unoptimized, kind of slipped away (maybe from old versions) and is very underwhelming as it is. Stay away from it. A single diplomat only gives + 130 influence for comparison. + 10 influence, not enough for anything meaningful.

This tenet is very good. If there are 16 CS it's worth 160 influence per great person.

It makes a big difference for strategies with lots of great people and low gold/production, who can struggle to build lots of diplomats. Worst case it gets you allied status with everyone.