Symphony D.
Deity
Retroactive deletion.
New NESes, ideas, development, etc
- Thread starter das
- Start date
North King
blech
- Joined
- Jan 2, 2004
- Messages
- 18,165
Some rules I was typing up today:
Economy
Economy, in order to erase confusion, refers both to raw spending power and production of material goods.
This is based on a points systemthe more spending points you have, the more money or production you can devote to any effort you have. These points will come from a variety of sources:
Rough economy comes from the actual agricultural production of your nation, and the mineral wealth; it is an indicator of how much in the way of raw materials you are producing.
Fine economy comes from trade, manufacturing, or any other kind of processing. It is generally a hallmark of a more civilized, centralized economy.
There will be cities of special nature that give you greater economic power than otherwise (see below).
Size
Size represents your nation/factions population and area.
In general, the size stat shows how overstretched you are, and greatly influences how much you must pay to maintain various stats.
Military
Your military consists of a number of types of units. There are four broad categories that troops belong to:
The nobility make up the core of your elite troops in the early stages of the game; they are formed from the upper classes of your society. They will usually be the ones using the most expensive, and effective equipment, and owing to their greater time spent on leisure, they will also usually have superior training to the common levy. They are commonly arrogant, ignoring peasants except as carpets, and may treat war as a game if they are new to it.
Nobility are usually only mobilized in times of war; they do not form a standing army. They are typically limited by the size of your nations upper class.
Mercenaries are troops who are hired by your nation for a limited time. Their required wages are high, and their loyalty is suspect, but their morale, equipment, and training are usually far superior to the common levy. These are superb troops as a rule, but it varies from company to company. Mercenaries may be hired as individual soldiers or as entire mercenary companies, who might have a history as long as some nations.
Mercenaries are usually only in service as long as they are paid: it is wisest to use them only in times of war. They are only limited by the money you have.
Levies are often the cornerstone of many armies. They are the common citizen of your nation, pressed into service. As they are a reflection of your nation as a whole, their training and morale will vary widely from nation to nationnations with highly regarded common folk and which are often embroiled in war will fight better than serf soldiers pressed into service. All the same, these troops are universally characterized by being inferior to most other types of troops. However, in times of war, you can call up many of them.
Levies are usually only mobilized in times of war; they do not form a standing army. They are typically limited by the size of your nations population.
As opposed to all of these, professional armies are a standing army. They are paid consistent wages by your nation, and thus cost quite a bit; it also costs considerable amounts of money to raise more. They are armed with the equipment you provide them, and they are trained by a standardized method. They are thus, very consistent, reliable troops who are available without having to muster them, but they are, as was mentioned, very expensive.
While these are typically only limited by the amount of money you have, raising too many may lead to economic collapse as your nations population is mobilized entirely for war.
Note that use of strategy is encouraged in case of war; while your generals will employ basic strategies, they are not likely to pull a Hannibal.
The Tiered Stats
These stats are measured in levels. Simply put, the higher the level you have in a stat, the better that stat is. To increase it, you have to invest a certain number of eco points, depending on how large your nation is (see size). Invest 1 eco point if you are size 1 to get to the next level, 2 if you are size 2, etc.
The problem is, if these stats grow to a decent tier, at some point, it will cost money to maintain. How much money is determined by my own secret formula. The higher the level, and the higher your population, the more it will cost to maintain the level.
If you choose to undercut funding to any one area, that area will drop by one level a turn until it reaches a rank where your funding matches the required maintenance funding. Thus, you can cut any of these in a very desperate war, but your people will lose a lot. Beware.
All of these stats automatically decrease drastically when you advance into the next major set of ages (such as from the [late] Bronze Age into the [early] Iron Age).
Education
Education is a measure of how knowledgeable your people are. This depends on your schooling systems and your culture. A higher education greatly contributes to technological advancement.
Infrastructure
Infrastructure is a measure of the kind of facilities your people have access to. This depends on your road systems, your hospitals, sewage systems, port facilities, granaries, and many other things. A higher infrastructure greatly contributes to keeping your nation running smoothly.
Quality of Life
Quality of Life is a measure of how well off your people are. This depends on the overall standard of living in your nationhow evenly the wealth is distributed, how long the life expectancy is, et al. A higher quality of life greatly contributes to the happiness and well being of your people.
Technology
Technology level represents how advanced your people are. E.g. the Bronze Age, or the Industrial Age.
It increases automatically, usually through a good education. The smarter your people are, really, the more accepting of innovation they will be. Quite simple.
If you want to make a specific advance, then you can invest eco points into getting it in your orders. Specific, important technological innovations (or lack thereof) will be noted in your stats.
Government
Government is, well, the type of ruling system you have. Feel free to be creative, so long as you are realistic.
Beware of doing something stupid, for either an elected body may disagree or depose you (as in a democracy), or a coup may result (as in a dictatorship or monarchy).
Religion
Religion. People have fought, died, and lived for it. Religion can be a powerful tool for the skilled, and even in the hands of the foolish, it can start a war, or stop one if it so chooses. But religions do not necessarily last forever, and your people may well fall under the sway of a different religion than the ruler. And should that happen, you would do well to convert... or burn the heretics.
Culture
This is really a description of your nations culture, and how your people think. This changes slowly over time. If you go against the mindset of your people, you may be hailed as a great reformer, or perhaps as an overly idealistic moron, and supported or deposed, respectively.
Confidence
This is how happy with the leadership (you) your nation is. If the people arent pleased with you, expect that a revolution may occur. If they love you, why, then they might well fight to the bitter end for you. This stat is not set levels, and cannot be grown with economic points.
Projects
Tell me something you want to get done, and Ill tell you how long they will take to get done. Pretty simple.
These can be anything from building the Suez Canal, to increasing the military efficiency of your nation. They are simply things you want your nation to accomplish. Quite nicely, they do not require eco points, rather less nicely, they cannot be hurried with eco points, either. The only thing that hurries a project is a story, and Ill determine how that works.
Special Cities
I will not be using the three cities system, nor the two cities system, nor the one city system that I originated. Instead, Ill be using what I call the pan-city system.
Cities are not locked into the typical systems of giving one economy point, or one culture level (even if there were such a thing in this NES). Instead, cities give variable benefits depending on what, exactly, they are. An important trade center might give you 2 bonus spend points. A religion center might give you a spend point from pilgrimage and a bonus in spreading your religion. And so on; cities will have their own miniature stats inside of your own stats, which details exactly what kind of benefits holding them provides you.
When you capture an opponents city in times of war, you may or may not receive the benefits of that city, depending on what the benefits are: trade usually shuts down during war, but you can certainly use factories if you have an adequate supply of material to that city. Regardless, you will deny your enemy the benefits of that city.
**********
Economy
Economy, in order to erase confusion, refers both to raw spending power and production of material goods.
This is based on a points systemthe more spending points you have, the more money or production you can devote to any effort you have. These points will come from a variety of sources:
Rough economy comes from the actual agricultural production of your nation, and the mineral wealth; it is an indicator of how much in the way of raw materials you are producing.
Fine economy comes from trade, manufacturing, or any other kind of processing. It is generally a hallmark of a more civilized, centralized economy.
There will be cities of special nature that give you greater economic power than otherwise (see below).
**********
Size
Size represents your nation/factions population and area.
In general, the size stat shows how overstretched you are, and greatly influences how much you must pay to maintain various stats.
**********
Military
Your military consists of a number of types of units. There are four broad categories that troops belong to:
The nobility make up the core of your elite troops in the early stages of the game; they are formed from the upper classes of your society. They will usually be the ones using the most expensive, and effective equipment, and owing to their greater time spent on leisure, they will also usually have superior training to the common levy. They are commonly arrogant, ignoring peasants except as carpets, and may treat war as a game if they are new to it.
Nobility are usually only mobilized in times of war; they do not form a standing army. They are typically limited by the size of your nations upper class.
Mercenaries are troops who are hired by your nation for a limited time. Their required wages are high, and their loyalty is suspect, but their morale, equipment, and training are usually far superior to the common levy. These are superb troops as a rule, but it varies from company to company. Mercenaries may be hired as individual soldiers or as entire mercenary companies, who might have a history as long as some nations.
Mercenaries are usually only in service as long as they are paid: it is wisest to use them only in times of war. They are only limited by the money you have.
Levies are often the cornerstone of many armies. They are the common citizen of your nation, pressed into service. As they are a reflection of your nation as a whole, their training and morale will vary widely from nation to nationnations with highly regarded common folk and which are often embroiled in war will fight better than serf soldiers pressed into service. All the same, these troops are universally characterized by being inferior to most other types of troops. However, in times of war, you can call up many of them.
Levies are usually only mobilized in times of war; they do not form a standing army. They are typically limited by the size of your nations population.
As opposed to all of these, professional armies are a standing army. They are paid consistent wages by your nation, and thus cost quite a bit; it also costs considerable amounts of money to raise more. They are armed with the equipment you provide them, and they are trained by a standardized method. They are thus, very consistent, reliable troops who are available without having to muster them, but they are, as was mentioned, very expensive.
While these are typically only limited by the amount of money you have, raising too many may lead to economic collapse as your nations population is mobilized entirely for war.
Note that use of strategy is encouraged in case of war; while your generals will employ basic strategies, they are not likely to pull a Hannibal.
**********
The Tiered Stats
These stats are measured in levels. Simply put, the higher the level you have in a stat, the better that stat is. To increase it, you have to invest a certain number of eco points, depending on how large your nation is (see size). Invest 1 eco point if you are size 1 to get to the next level, 2 if you are size 2, etc.
The problem is, if these stats grow to a decent tier, at some point, it will cost money to maintain. How much money is determined by my own secret formula. The higher the level, and the higher your population, the more it will cost to maintain the level.
If you choose to undercut funding to any one area, that area will drop by one level a turn until it reaches a rank where your funding matches the required maintenance funding. Thus, you can cut any of these in a very desperate war, but your people will lose a lot. Beware.
All of these stats automatically decrease drastically when you advance into the next major set of ages (such as from the [late] Bronze Age into the [early] Iron Age).
Education
Education is a measure of how knowledgeable your people are. This depends on your schooling systems and your culture. A higher education greatly contributes to technological advancement.
Infrastructure
Infrastructure is a measure of the kind of facilities your people have access to. This depends on your road systems, your hospitals, sewage systems, port facilities, granaries, and many other things. A higher infrastructure greatly contributes to keeping your nation running smoothly.
Quality of Life
Quality of Life is a measure of how well off your people are. This depends on the overall standard of living in your nationhow evenly the wealth is distributed, how long the life expectancy is, et al. A higher quality of life greatly contributes to the happiness and well being of your people.
**********
Technology
Technology level represents how advanced your people are. E.g. the Bronze Age, or the Industrial Age.
It increases automatically, usually through a good education. The smarter your people are, really, the more accepting of innovation they will be. Quite simple.
If you want to make a specific advance, then you can invest eco points into getting it in your orders. Specific, important technological innovations (or lack thereof) will be noted in your stats.
Government
Government is, well, the type of ruling system you have. Feel free to be creative, so long as you are realistic.
Beware of doing something stupid, for either an elected body may disagree or depose you (as in a democracy), or a coup may result (as in a dictatorship or monarchy).
Religion
Religion. People have fought, died, and lived for it. Religion can be a powerful tool for the skilled, and even in the hands of the foolish, it can start a war, or stop one if it so chooses. But religions do not necessarily last forever, and your people may well fall under the sway of a different religion than the ruler. And should that happen, you would do well to convert... or burn the heretics.
Culture
This is really a description of your nations culture, and how your people think. This changes slowly over time. If you go against the mindset of your people, you may be hailed as a great reformer, or perhaps as an overly idealistic moron, and supported or deposed, respectively.
Confidence
This is how happy with the leadership (you) your nation is. If the people arent pleased with you, expect that a revolution may occur. If they love you, why, then they might well fight to the bitter end for you. This stat is not set levels, and cannot be grown with economic points.
**********
Projects
Tell me something you want to get done, and Ill tell you how long they will take to get done. Pretty simple.
These can be anything from building the Suez Canal, to increasing the military efficiency of your nation. They are simply things you want your nation to accomplish. Quite nicely, they do not require eco points, rather less nicely, they cannot be hurried with eco points, either. The only thing that hurries a project is a story, and Ill determine how that works.
Special Cities
I will not be using the three cities system, nor the two cities system, nor the one city system that I originated. Instead, Ill be using what I call the pan-city system.
Cities are not locked into the typical systems of giving one economy point, or one culture level (even if there were such a thing in this NES). Instead, cities give variable benefits depending on what, exactly, they are. An important trade center might give you 2 bonus spend points. A religion center might give you a spend point from pilgrimage and a bonus in spreading your religion. And so on; cities will have their own miniature stats inside of your own stats, which details exactly what kind of benefits holding them provides you.
When you capture an opponents city in times of war, you may or may not receive the benefits of that city, depending on what the benefits are: trade usually shuts down during war, but you can certainly use factories if you have an adequate supply of material to that city. Regardless, you will deny your enemy the benefits of that city.
**********
Thlayli
Le Pétit Prince
I like your rules, NK. They seem like a natural evolution of the traditional NES2 set.
Symphony D.
Deity
Retroactive deletion.
Symphony D.
Deity
Retroactive deletion.
Israelite9191
You should be reading
Very interesting rules NK. I personally love the flexibility you get from them. However, in the military, some more specifics would be nice. The nobility thing is interesting, but I don't know if it would work. Quality of Life seems like something of a worthless stat that will cause more pain to you the mod than good to us the players. At most, I would leave it to the histography. Your city system is my favorite part. Then again, that is already pretty much what I am implementing in my current NES, although with the three-city labels attached to aid players and to act for myself as a memory aid. Finally, I would advise some sort of efficiency ranking for government and quality for troops (at least the standing army, as that is the most likely to vary it would seem), although the latter seems to be taken care of pretty well by the different types of troops.
North King
blech
- Joined
- Jan 2, 2004
- Messages
- 18,165
Quality of life is not a worthless stat! Well, it is, actually... But it could enhance rebellions. Or something...
An efficiency ranking for the government... I will consider it, but it seems like when that stat is added it usually ends up ignored anyway, sadly. And, as you said, quality is somewhat defined by the type of troops most prevalent, but it is also to an extent an unwritten thing that will vary from nation to nation.
An efficiency ranking for the government... I will consider it, but it seems like when that stat is added it usually ends up ignored anyway, sadly. And, as you said, quality is somewhat defined by the type of troops most prevalent, but it is also to an extent an unwritten thing that will vary from nation to nation.
Symphony D.
Deity
Retroactive deletion.
Gelion
Retired Captain
So if you had a population like China you could only get about 1 million soldiers? I'd go with 1% of population in the military as "normal".
Symphony D.
Deity
Retroactive deletion.
Gelion
Retired Captain
I still can't see how the size of the country affects quantity of trainig of troops. Shouldn't it depend on economy, tech levels and other such factors?
For that example think of Chinese again. China ca't have more special ops for the same economy investment just because they got more population....
For that example think of Chinese again. China ca't have more special ops for the same economy investment just because they got more population....
That would depend on how the general economy is interpreted. If the income is also size dependent, then it would make a lot of sense to do it this way. But then that begs the question whether it would make any sense to have income size dependent...
Symphony D.
Deity
Retroactive deletion.
Symphony D.
Deity
Retroactive deletion.
Gelion
Retired Captain
Can I assume that 20,000 US Elite are not equal to 25,000+ Chinese Elite?
Symphony D.
Deity
Retroactive deletion.
Symphony D.
Deity
Retroactive deletion.
Cool.
I'm working on a simplification of LINESII rules.
Some things: Doing Rural economy like das does his economy. So I could use thin black lines to show administrative differences, instead of economic regions.
Also increasing the sizes of army that economy will buy you, something I plan to implement when I finally get the time to update.
I'm working on a simplification of LINESII rules.
Some things: Doing Rural economy like das does his economy. So I could use thin black lines to show administrative differences, instead of economic regions.
Also increasing the sizes of army that economy will buy you, something I plan to implement when I finally get the time to update.
Swissempire
Poet Jester
#2 is good
#1 is bad and will warrant leperchaun intervention. The regions system is perfect and amazing. DON'T CHANGE IT. Its not even that hard, it makes your job simplier!
#1 is bad and will warrant leperchaun intervention. The regions system is perfect and amazing. DON'T CHANGE IT. Its not even that hard, it makes your job simplier!
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