New NESes, ideas, development, etc

[Dachs]

Achoura Maznta is Ahura Mazda in as close to the Greek of the period as I could get it.

Hekatompylos is the capital because it's the largest city, because it's the original capital of the satraps who revolted against the Seleukids, because it's the most vital trade center in the kingdom, and because it's a very useful staging point in campaigning against the Areians' main enemies.

 

[Northen Wolf]

I excuse my self with fact that I've been sick(in bed, "slight" temperature) since Thursday.

Short overview: Humans are pffth, Elves are pansies and you play orcish war lord who leads Great Horde. Horde, that is taking doom towards minor races, their settlements and ...

Spoiler :

You wish! You control small poor village and even joining other villages into your chiefdom requires diplomatic relations, cleverness, education, religion and WAAAAAAAR. Villages you Control are poor (at best) and have nothing.

There will be annoying NPCs who are stronger than your "one village crapChiefdom. Humans, elves and Mixed-breed kingdoms are quite a bit older, more developed and quite angry at you. Players have common goals:

• Survive
• Build up villages so you could run a "chiefdom"
• Conquer entire world

And getting new minions convincing other villages to join with you, is not simple task - how could a crappy village turn into a powerful chiefdom in just 20 years? Not possible without education, religion and investments!

Orc personality is influenced by WarCraft orcs (I don't play nor like WoW) but their birth story is quite a bit different (no dimensional gates and new home world!).

It is not meant to be Become Power and Conquer World in 3 Updates(tm) rather focus is on developing your village and keeping up relations.

Stats are in exel file, so I can easly modify them. I only have to keep stats updated for player (and player-connected) villages so that reduces workload.

Basic history:

Spoiler :

Many(numberical) Orcish families cross the uncrossable mountains.
They turn path to mountains into desert (magically)
They Attack Illorian Empire(human)
Empire routes attacking orcs but lacks forces to destroy scattered orcish settlers.
Orcish settle first villages
Illorians pull back
Time passes and orcs forget what they once where or why they come here
You enter into game

Magic, religion, events and history are not written yet.

Most things will be rated in this system

0 – 1 – 2 – 3 – 4 – 5 – 6 – 7 – 8 equal to:
none – very low – low – low-medium – medium – medium-high – high – very high – maximum/complete

Spoiler join blank :

To join, “fill” this “document” (no blood or other liquids, besides ink, please)

Name of your Clan: _Name_ Clan or Clan (of) _name_
Name of your first village: No “soft names” like CutieVille or Toyland.
World views:
(choose one in each category)
Peacefulness: Very peaceful / Peaceful / neutral / War-like / Warmonger
War mongers can still have peace with other clans, just warmongering clan inhabitants prefer to use force as solution to most problems.

Racial Tolerance: Very Accepting / Accepting / Choosing / Very choosing / Accepting others is only for the weak!
Very accepting clan would accept human/swamp duck survivors among themselves with no problems, choosing clan would test those survivors and compare them to themselves before accepting them. And you can, of course, have tolerance for other races.

Trade: Professional traders / Trading is good / We trade... sometimes / Only if we need something or have much to spare / Trade is for the weak!
Trading can bring wealth in - but constant trading attracts bandits of all sorts. Trade Caravans are rather weakly defended and loss of one is significant hit.

Education: We love new knowledge / New knowledge is good, but it's not most important / education is not very important to us / What knowledge? Books are for the weak !
Educating your minions can have both good and bad effects. (Example: Educated villagers will want better and easier life compared to their parents.)

Slavery: No-one deserves to be slave / Slave other races / Slave other races and (our race)war victims / Slave other races, war victims, criminals / Slave no one, kill everyone!
During attacks you'll usually capture few prisoners alive, should they be killed Or enslaved? (Selling slaves back to their owners; releasing victims of war in exchange of valuables is good source of income and the slaves can work on menial tasks meanwhile.)

Power: Everyone has right to decide / What the majority wants! / What the guild elder decide / Everyone does what chief says!
People will vs Will of (Single) Leader(s)

Misc: Stooooooooooooooooooriiieeeeees, misc info, intelligence, why,where, how, WTH, urh?!?!, rawr, roar, meow, beeb, stories of Po-Beep adventures and similar things, you wish to share, go here.

Spoiler Example :

Join application example:
Name of your Clan: Blue Ember Clan
Name of your first village: Yewel

Peacefulness: Very peaceful
Racial Tolerance: Very Accepting
Trade: Trading is good
Education: Education is not very important to us
Slavery: Slave other races and (our race)war victims (We treat them better than their ex-owners)
Power: Everyone does what chief says!
Misc: Story of our great clan, it's leaders and how we often trade for slaves, and treat them well, so they work better for us.

Map with village location marked on it would be good.

Spoiler Clan ("nation") stats :

Clan stats:


Relations

Spoiler :

Kingdom of Raghadarr – Elven: None
Empire of Illoria – Human: None
Republic of Glorand – Mixed races: None

Villages (1)

Spoiler :

Jewel (Main Village)

Leadership structure

Spoiler :

You cannot expect “chiefdom” to last past first village if it do not have “proper” structure.

Administration:

Spoiler :

Chief errr … I think … Winterfall, yeah thatss the village north no north-west of us, errr …. yes … it is! well, the village has to send us errrr 6 gold … I think... and we are supposed to send errr 10 no! 25!! traders … err, that'ss no right, …. 15! … I think I remember it right. Chief, what say you?

Military cooperation:

Spoiler :

Chief erm... winterwell err wall erm .. fell village wants us to send … sent? units wiping out those packs of errr wolves or apes or … heck. I don't remember … I already sent 30 soldiers errr north-south … no-.no-no. north-west! of us. So you know now that everything 'as been taken care of... and you 've notting to worry 'bout great chief!

Infrastructural/domestical coordination:

Spoiler :

Chief I think … Finterfall willage requires some food and we can marry 20 or was it 2? soldiers with the widowed women there. And they have tools ... I think err nails... yes .. nails ! .. To spare, while we have few extra hammers. Whad decide orders you ... chief?

Ways to increase leadership:

Spoiler :

• Hero (ask for how much sacrificing and hero gives)
• Invest gold into single thing (administration/military coordination/infrastructural and domestic coordination
• Educate orcs - education can be good and bad at the same time, good enough education increases chiefdom strength too!
• Religion – Faith can be good or a bad thing, “church” having high power in chiefdom means that chiefdom can use church (and its believers) for its own good. Highly religious men will gladly carry on tasks like book keeping, tax gathering and coordination of things. Just be careful that your chiefdom will not become a holy country run by church (and not by you)

Religions

Spoiler :

Does your chiefdom have state-religion? Do you permit many religions (all?) or allow certain, already-dominant, religions to grow? For little investment (and luck) religion can change your poor, one-village-rabble-leadership to world mighty chiefdom. Religious people are happy to take care of leadership issues for your chiefdom, in fact they may try to overrun and completely control your chiefdom.

Religion makes villagers happier, holy sights attract visitors(and their gold!) and those who are “shunned” for what they believe will gladly join you. Religious fighters are brave and are even less afraid to die! Calm and well kept villages provide benefits of growing and producing more gold, and spreading religion will give you large influence with villages that have same religion as you. You may run several religions or run them all, at once. Be a “holy land” owner? Be “A chiefdom of religious freedom”? Be a “goshdarned chiefdom of bloody dang atheists”?

YOU CANNOT PICK YOUR RELIGION AT THE BEGGING OF GAME, YOU CAN DESCRIBE WHAT RELIGION YOU WANT – IF YOU WANT TO HAVE CERTAIN TYPE OF RELIGION

There will be roughly 3, starting gods spreading among your villagers, which you can accept, refuse or ignore. More religions will start spreading later and you can even create your own! Gods are create through sincere prayers and belief not by some loonitic mumbling!

EDUCATION

Spoiler :

Educated orcs work better as chiefdom, investing into education increases Leadership Structure. While educated orcs are less likely to attack others, die for your cause and prefer changing villages domestic values from herding to agriculture.

Humans and elves like educated creatures more, while mixed breed kingdoms often like power and might not some fancy-book-reading-greenskin.

You can directly invest into education, you can specify for what you'd like to learn (farming, military, ores, trading, skills)

Education can be learned with brute-force method: capture some of the, more educated, enemy educated citizens (preferably government members, chiefs, elders, runners, scholars etc.) and 'convince' them to 'donate' their knowledge to you, in exchange … say … freedom or not-losing-your-both-arms-to-our-madmen-and-seeing-them-being-eaten-raw-by-our-children. This method does not win very many friends tho.

Educated orcs do not like slaves, war, ignorance of gods, low infrastructure, not using “scientific” events.

You can spend money on it, you can let religion build up some education or you can simply exchange slaves from more educated places to teach you necessary evil skills

Military Units
Total expenses on military units:
Alliances
Allied Clans:
Allied villages:


Word Views:
Peacefulness:
Racial Tolerance:
Trade:
Education:
Slavery:
Power:

Misc

Spoiler :

Everything else worth noting goes here

VILLAGE TEMPLATE

Spoiler :

Village name:

Spoiler :

Names of holy ant and his mate - the shemale kangaroo - go here !

Population:

Spoiler :

Low is standard (rating, time, slaves, infrastructure, medics, accepting wanderers, draft, plunders etc influence this.

Income:

Spoiler :

6 gold is “normal” income, population, infrastructure, events, properties influence this

Infrastructure:

Spoiler :

Roads, LOCAL government(influences clanial government), building planning, wells, hedges, police etc.

Clan Influence:

Spoiler :

More than 1 clan can have influence over village. To gain control (possession) of village, you need to have at least medium-high influence.

Military:

Spoiler :

Village-owned military goes under here, as go military units stationed in village.

Village properties:

Spoiler :

Barracks, major roads, castles, training grounds, great halls, gladiator stages etc.

Misc:

Spoiler :

misc info.

Military Units

Spoiler :

Unit name:

Spoiler :

Uhm … Shemale kangaroo and his/hers/its mate names go here … I think

Training fee:

Spoiler :

how much it costs to train one, for an example 2 -3 means 2 gold to get militia from no training to some training level and 3 gold to get it onto trained level, you cannot train unit any better with gold

Training costs:

Spoiler :

How much it costs to train it one level higher.
! Marks the last level unit can be trained on for gold

Number of men in unit:

Spoiler :

...

Weapons:

Spoiler :

weapons that come with are poor … at best, equipping units with better weapons makes it easier to kill enemies … and less enemies means more survivors!

Armor:

Spoiler :

Armor that fresh recruits come with leaves much to be desired, spending gold on better armor increases unit chances to survive hits, 'specially from poorly armed enemies.

Spoiler For units :

Spoiler Militia :

Unit name: Militia
Training fee: 6 gold
Training costs: 2 – 3
Number of men in unit: ~100
None – some – ! trained ! – experienced – veteran

Weapons: 2 - 4
Poor (Improvised weaponry) – standard quality weaponry – decent quality spears, axes, slings.

Armour: 2 – 4
None - Standard (improvised torso armour and caps) – well made leather armor and caps, small shield made of wood or leather.

Misc:
* One free militia per village.
* One militia unit always in one village (can embark for 1 turn raid)
Orcs equipped with random weaponry and their own courage – these units do not pose much threat and are not suitable for much else than gap-defence or cannon fodder and supply raiding, but they are better than no military. They will flee and panic fast.

Spoiler scouts :

Unit name: Scouts
Training fee: 5 gold
Training costs: 1 – 2 – 3
None – some – trained – ! experienced ! – veteran- elite
Number of men in unit: ~25

Weapons: 1 - 2
Some (poor quality spears, clubs ) – throwing and fighting spears, one hand axes, slings – good quality one hand axes, sling, spears,

Armour: 2 – 3
None - cloth armor and caps, small shield made of wood or leather – cloth and leather armor and caps, small shield made of strong wood.

Misc:
Intelligence means much in battle and these brave units are meant for gathering intelligence. Making sure they remain unseen they can even move around in opposing village. And knowing what you are attacking and where enemy guard posts are could win you a battle or two. You can attack with these units but they'd probably lose to militia (scouts have 25 units vs militia 100).

Spoiler Slingers :

]
Unit name: Slingers
Training fee: 8 gold
Training costs: 1 – 2
None – some – ! trained ! – experienced – veteran- elite
Number of men in unit: ~50

Weapons: 1 - 3
Bag full of rocks, sling, branch (from a tree)
Bag full of rocks, throwing jars(by hand) containing sticky “glue like” mud, can throw small burning pieces of wood against enemy buildings/fortifications/faces, small wooden-war club
Bag full of well picked rocks, Sling-able jars containing, spikes, Greece fire, sticky mud, one-handed rock hammers

Armour: 2 – 3
None
Cloth armor and caps
Good cloth armor, caps, small buckler

Misc:
These units are hopeless in melee combat, but behind friendly units, they can pick of many enemies, slow them (with sticky substance underneath). Well equipped units can even throw small jars that contain liquid – that burns behind or into enemy ranks or onto buildings/fortifications.

Unit placed on top of bare hill can take down ~30-60 units attacking below, before entering into melee combat (and getting defeated).

Ranged
Poor in melee combat
limited ammo
with equipment, have high chance to torch buildings/fortifications.

Spoiler Trained Grunts :

Unit name: Trained Grunts
Training fee: 14 gold
Training costs: 3 – 5 – 8
None – some – trained – ! experienced ! – veteran- elite – HEROES
Number of men in unit: ~100

Weapons: 3 - 5
Low quality one hand axes, spears and slings -
Good quality one hand axes, spears and slings –
Very good quality axes, swords, pack of throwing spears or crossbows with bolts.

Armour: 5 – 8
* Leather armor, shields made of wood
* Good quality Leather full armor, shields made out of wood, covered with leather and strengthened by iron
* Good quality leather armor with chain-mail and cloth torso, scary (horned) hats, strong wood shields covered with iron and strengthened by it.

Misc:

These are the main body of orcish army. Brutal and powerful, even if poorly equipped, these units live to fight. Unlike militia that's made up of “Workers”, who return to work after battle, these units are professional soldiers. What they lack in armor compared to human footmen division, they make up in bravery – heck, they can't be like militia and run if that “boogie-monster made growl towards me”, can they?

Good enslavers

Brave

Loyal

Spoiler Elite Bersekers :

not known

Special units

Spoiler :

Spoiler Ramble :

No training Militia equipped with Decent weapons (best!) and good quality leather (best!) beats no training, no equipped militia with ~30-50 losses.



Battle results (on open field, no manoeuvring, no scouts no Intel, no leader, no hero etc.):

Trained militia = Best training for money.

Trained militia vs untrained militia (no equipment)
Winner T Militia
Casualties:
~60 casualties for trained militia

Trained militia vs 2 untrained militia (no equipment)
Winner (50% chance) T militia
Casualties:
~80 casualties to trained militia.
Lose (50% chance)
Casualties:
100 soldiers (everyone)
1 untrained militia dead,
1 untrained militia ~80 casualties

Trained + fully equipped militia vs 2 untrained militia units (no equipment)
TFE militia wins,
CASUALTIES:
~60 casualties

Trained + Fully equipped militia vs 3 untrained militia (no equipment)
TFE Has low chance to win, total casualties inflicted: 2 militia units, 50 unit worth damage to surviving unit)

Trained + fully equipped militia + no training, no equipped slingers vs 3 untrained militia
WINNER TFA militia + slingers
CASUALTIES:
TFA militia – 60 units (40 survivors)
SLINGERS – 25 units (25 survivors)


etc.
Untrained-unarmed-unequipped Grunts can take on 2 untrained, unarmed, unequipped militia units, with ~40 casualties

Scouts and slingers can play major role in defence and attacks (slingers buy time for militia to organize on defence.

Military specific rules

Spoiler :

If you decide to train or upgrade unit several times in one turn it'll be 20% cheaper.
Example: Train militia to “Trained” status
2 + 3 = 5 *0.2 = 1,1 (round to nearest integer) = 1 gold
5 -1 = 4 gold to train militia from “no training” to “trained status”

THIS DOES NOT APPLY WHEN UPGRADING MILITIA FROM “SOME TRAINING” TO “TRAINED” ETC, this DOES APPLY WHEN YOU ARE MAKING AT LEAST 2 UPGRADES ON 1 TURN.

You can equip unit with better armor and/or weapons and train unit on same turn.
You CAN improve weapons and armor on same turn unit is drafted
You can not give orders to unit on turn it is equipped/trained/drafted on
Unit that is attack while undergoing improvement/training will fight with old weapons/training, should unit die – you get some (at least half) of the money back.

Example:
Turn 0 - you give orders to draft Militia unit in village X, you decide to equip unit with decent weapons and Standard armor
Turn 1 - you decide to train unit to trained status OR you can move/attack/defend/etc with unit.
Turn 2 - Unit is trained OR moved, You give order to plunder village Y
Turn 3 - Unit successfully plunders village Y, PROFIT!


Weapons = More casualties on enemy side
Armor = Less casualties on own side
Training = both of above.

FIRST MILITA IS FREE, THERE IS ALWAYS ONE MILITIA in ONE village THAT DOES NOT REQUIRE MAINTAINCE.

SINGLE VILLAGE CAN SUPPORT ONE ADDITIONAL UNIT(“standard free militia plus one unit)

ALL UNITS ABOVE VILLAGE SUPPORT LIMIT COST 50% of village ORIGINAL income.

MERCANERIES DO NOT COUNT AS UNITS (you did not build them) NOR WILL THEY REQUIRE “SUPPORT”.

Unit can be drafted from one village but be supplied/supported by other.

Rebuilding damaged(units with casualties) units is called redrafting.
Redrafting is cheaper than buying new unit.
Redrafting prices are announced in the update, howerever only you know if you chose to redraft this unit or bought a new one.
Units that are fare large casualties may lose equipment or training.

Winning units may gain defeated units weapons/equipment, cheaper upgrades for themselves or for other units, they may also enslave enemy.

Weapons and equipment what is not used to upgrade own units immiditly, will be sold for money (soldiers will take it home as trophies, while chief gains his share).

If you defeat enemy hero you can sell it back to him, kill it or attempt to convince change sides.

HEROES

Spoiler :

Ahhh, what'd legends be without heroes ? You can have them, but you can't literally “buy” or train them.

To have a hero you require one of the following:

• Civilian winning an Event (event could be gladiators challenge or defeating bandits) (You can not expect to win event AND get hero without investing any money into event)
• Highly trained and/or equipped Military unit winning a battle (the more highly trained, the better)
• Causing an event yourself (slinging competition, hunting competition)
• Military winning an event (defeating mountain troll)
• Luck
• Good faith
• Good Education levels
• Good infrastructure (and/or income)
• War

Uses of heroes:

Spoiler :

Every hero can be used to respond to one event – hero that “spawns” while you are defending can be “sacrificed” to rally man under your banner and save more units for less money. (reduce redrafting fees and instantly draft units with certain amount of fresh recruits.)

Hero that spawns on Local hunting competition can be sacrificed to increase your influence in one village (and maybe gaining village under your control) or improving village income (by holding festivals yearly and giving chance for more heroes to spawn.

...or hero can become a hero a be tied to a unit.

Heroes can lead military units, they are “attached” to one unit (depending of hero type).

Spoiler In battle heroes :

Increase moral
Lower Casualties (by 10-25%)
Increase Enemy Casualties (by 10-25%)
Increase chance to succeed an objective
Add specific hero benefits (recover wounded soldiers; enslave more; Be more sneakier, kill more enemy units, panic enemy)

To attach hero to a unit, you need to pay 33% (round to nearest integer) of unit value. Unit value INCLUDES WEAPONS, ARMOR AND TRAINING VALUE IT ONLY INCLUDES last/Best training/weapon/armor values.

Attaching hero to fully trained and equipped grunts units:
14 + 8 + 5 + 8 * 0.33 = 11,55 = ~ 12 gold

Attached heroes that unit has been defeat have chance to escape, they might even return to service or rally up villages behind enemy.

If you defeat military unit hero is “attached” to, hero maybe captured alive – you can tell barter the hero, kill it or attempt to convince it to join the better side (YOU)!

Spoiler Notes :

Please note:

• Every village has “militia” military unit – this is villagers with improvised weapons who will defend their village or raid others. During the raids, villages are rather defenceless. Village militias can be trained and equipped with better weapons.
  
• Defending militia almost always has advantage compared to attacking militia.
  
• If attackers bring scouts and/or slingers with them, that advantage is lost.
  
• First page info about villages, their strengths and values might not be “accurate”, true values are only known to the village owner. First page info is made up by rumours and rumours can be wrong!
• However, empire structure (education, religion, administration etc) and military power + alliances are accurate.
  
• If you do not get any “events”, try to create them yourself! Nothing wrong with investing into wolf fighting competition or holding festivals in honour of mages (to attract them).
  
• Even if you decide to burn one village to the ground, there will be survivors – depending of how large force you send against village. Survivors will rebuild this village or settle elsewhere, they might even join you! Or your enemies.
  
• Successful raid can give slaves, It is up to you if you wish to sell or ransom these slaves, kill them (for food / for gladiator training) or to keep them as relatively free workforce.
  
• First militia can raid! Raid does not require you to defeat enemy defences completely, rather you can focus raid against livestock, raid/rob/kidnap children or women for your men (it will, eventually, increase relations).
  
• Perhaps you want to plunder human caravans that pass through your territories? Human do not forget things and they know nothing of battlefield honour. Caravans are usually well defended (1 unit of footmen, maybe more, maybe just militia), but contain many valuables!
  
• Village with no clanial administration, military cooperation and similar things is just a poorly organized village, what can't expect to hold more villages than 1 – raid yes, but control/conquer? No!
  
• Village < Clan < Chiefdom < W (NEED TO THINK MORE NAMES !!!1123445$&#8221;!)
  
• Educated orcs get along better with humans and elves, while relations weaken with mixed-breed kingdoms. Educated orcs also prefer building agricultural improvements and shun ancient way of domestic herding. Educated orcs increase values in Chiefdom structure.
  
• Orcs are no elves, they do not eat their own-race dead, but humans are often tasty and what'd better than eating away your opponent remains, as a final insult. Deceased or poorly working human slaves may be made into snacks during famine periods.
  
• Food, religion, happiness, events, infrastructure, friends and marriages attract new villagers, aswell as winning battles. Losing battles, having lousy infrastructure, ignoring faith scares them.

*Equips anti-flaming suit and shield.*

 

[Abaddon]

Waoh, overload of spoilers.

Interested!

 

[Kentharu]

I'm fairly impressed with how the stats turned out Dachs. You did not disappoint.

North, those rules seem a bit scetchy, I assume they are a rough draft right? In any case an interesting concept.

 

[Anonymoose]

Northern Wolf is ill. I don't think those are the final drafts, considering the spoilers concerning the shemale kangaroos and what not. Yea, some of you skimmed and missed the shemale kangaroos. Your loss!

 

[Karalysia]

Hekatompylos is the capital because it's the largest city, because it's the original capital of the satraps who revolted against the Seleukids, because it's the most vital trade center in the kingdom, and because it's a very useful staging point in campaigning against the Areians' main enemies.

Their main enemies are the northern tribes? And most vital trade center? More vital than the cities in southern Persia like I dunno Bandar Abbas or Shiraz or Khorasan or something?

 

[Dachs]

Their main enemies are the northern tribes? And most vital trade center? More vital than the cities in southern Persia like I dunno Bandar Abbas or Shiraz or Khorasan or something?

Their main enemies are the Mazsakata, Sogdiane, and the Baktrians, yeah. I'd hardly call the Baktrians 'northern tribes', and Sogdiane only kind of qualifies.

Shiraz doesn't exist, and Persis is a backwater. Khorasan is a region, not a trade center, and Hekatompylos is in the middle of it. Bandar Abbas - or rather, Harmozeia - is of significant importance, yes, but a lot of its thunder is stolen by other ports in the area like Charax. I suppose nearly as much trade passes through Harmozeia as Hekatompylos, if not more, but it's rather poorly sited for a capital considering the Areian focus.

 

[Karalysia]

You said they were like Tibet man. Tibet sure as hell didn't bollock around fighting a bunch of tribals, and a bunch of Greeks who think they're Afghans. No man. Tibet smashed civilized nations. Big populous, wealthy, numerous nations. Smashed them into little pieces with overwhelming brutality. One after another. I miss Tibet

Also Central Asia is a barren wasteland. For the most part. Except maybe the southernish bits. Why do they focus their energies there when the plump riches of the Orient are there to sink their throbbing swords into?

This just isn't getting me off.

 

[Dachs]

You said they were like Tibet man. Tibet sure as hell didn't bollock around fighting a bunch of tribals, and a bunch of Greeks who think they're Afghans. No man. Tibet smashed civilized nations. Big populous, wealthy, numerous nations. Smashed them into little pieces with overwhelming brutality. One after another. I miss Tibet

Those "tribals" and "Greeks who think they're Afghans" are wealthy and dangerous. I know you play up the "lol I dunno crap I just kill it" angle a lot but it's wearing a little thin.

Also Central Asia is a barren wasteland. For the most part. Except maybe the southernish bits. Why do they focus their energies there when the plump riches of the Orient are there to sink their throbbing swords into?

Because western Iran just isn't all that well developed compared to southern Central Asia. (Weird? Kind of, but not really. The Seleukids spent a **** ton of time in Greek Central Asia, a **** ton of time in Babylonia, but not really all that much in between - even in OTL, when their domains were a lot...compacter than they were in TTL. Western Iran was first a backwater, then a war zone up to a few decades ago. You conquer Babylonia, there's some cities with some history and a lot of money there to plunder and make your capital. Charax is one of the biggest ports in the oikoumene, Seleukeia is this world's version of friggin' Rome. You conquer Persis or Media...not so much. There are a few minor cities like Ekbatana and Gabai, some nice agricultural property, a few mines, a few ruins and towns who thrive on the tourist trade from 'old glories' like Persepolis, but nothing like Hekatompylos or Antiocheia-Margiane. Anyway, this isn't OTL.)

 

[Kraznaya]

Spoiler Kingdom of Areia :

Kingdom of Areia
Capital: Hekatompylos
Ruler/Player: Basileus ?/NPC
Government: Centralized Aristocratic Theocratic Monarchy
Factions (Confidence/Strength): Army Assembly (4/5), Medioi (4/3), Zoroastrian clergy (4/3), Sousiane (2/3), Parthyaia (3/4), Merchantry (3/3)
Culture: Iranohellenic syncretism; chiefly Greek-speaking, though Iranian languages are more widespread in Media and Hyrkania; mostly Zoroastrian, with significant pockets of Sophists in the west and southeast, Jews in most major poleis, and worshippers of the Seleukid dynastic cult in Persis.
Army: 45,000 infantry, 14,000 cavalry
Army Quality: 7
Army Description: Primarily reliant on heavy spear infantry (thorakitai), Iranian native archer-spearmen, cataphract heavy cavalry, and Median medium cavalry. Light cavalry, sword infantry, and skirmishers are all scarce.
Navy: 75 ships
Navy Quality: 3
Income (Raw &#8211;Upkeep): 35,100 - 34,500 = 600
Treasury: 5,000
Infrastructure: Good
Prestige:
Description: Religion destroyed the Seleukid Empire after the great civil war. In Areia, the cult of the deified Seleukid emperors went too far, and both Greek colonists and Median natives rose against the oppressive hand of Seleukos VI in the second century. Straton II, the third Greek king of Areia, mandated instead the worship of Achoura Maznta, a step which has symbolized the syncretic nature of the Areian Iranohellenic culture. Having made great gains at the expense of the near-dead Seleukid Empire and the recently extinct Karmanian state, Areia stands in a position to dominate the oikoumene.

Younger. The first Yang ruler was a distant relative of the last Qi Emperor, and attempted to run the Empire "business-as-usual" upon seizing the throne after the latter's death. He couldn't hold everything together, though, lacking an appropriate mixture of popularity and ability, and the provinces revolted one by one until the Yang were left with comparatively little. They've regained a great deal since then to become the second-ranking land power in China.

Can I please have the Wu ruling family have the personal family name Yang for the lols? Backstory being that they were awarded the name for services to the Yang crown (I dunno, as governors or generals of the Jiangsu province or whatever) but when the king died and the revolts spread against the particularly succeeding weak ruler the Wu broke away claiming themselves legitimate successors to the king/emperor who had awarded them the title.

OTL historical precedent: Awarding of the "Song" name to particularly successful magistrates during a certain dynasty.

 

[Thlayli]

Mm. So did the West Saxons and such just peter out, or do they have a Danelaw-type area in Britain, or have they not yet begun to migrate yet? Ethno-linguistic differences in this NES will be snexy.

Also, are Aristotle's Poetics non-lost in this world?

Also also, I hope Panormus uses the Lex Hieronica or has some other sensible form of provincial governance that isn't an idiotic confederacy.

 

[Dachs]

Can I please have the Wu ruling family have the personal family name Yang for the lols? Backstory being that they were awarded the name for services to the Yang crown (I dunno, as governors or generals of the Jiangsu province or whatever) but when the king died and the revolts spread against the particularly succeeding weak ruler the Wu broke away claiming themselves legitimate successors to the king/emperor who had awarded them the title.

If you end up being in charge of the Wu, sure.

Mm. So did the West Saxons and such just peter out, or do they have a Danelaw-type area in Britain, or have they not yet begun to migrate yet?

There are plenty of Saxons still in Old Saxony, but the ones who did migrate, along with the Cimbri and Rondings, are part of the Rugian kingdom - the 'Eotenas' to the Brythonic peoples - in western Britain, still quite independent and very much alive.

Ethno-linguistic differences in this NES will be snexy.

If by that you mean "a gigantic headache for both me and poor Bill3000" then yes.

Also, are Aristotle's Poetics non-lost in this world?

Possibly. Depends on who writes a story about it first, really.

Also also, I hope Panormus uses the Lex Hieronica or has some other sensible form of provincial governance that isn't an idiotic confederacy.

Sicily isn't provincial, it's the heartland. Sicily itself is under the same sort of government that the Achaian League ran under, a sort of federal republic for the propertied classes, with fairly hands-off relations to the Italian and Aphrikan poleis it governs except in terms of trade-related rents.

 

[Dachs]

Oh, and here's some Chinese stats for comparison. Again, I want constructive criticism - are the factions a good idea? Military numbers need adjustment/explanation? Finance? And so on and so forth...

Dayang Dynasty
Capital: Linxiang
Ruler/Player: ?/NPC
Government: Semi-Feudal Centralized Aristocratic Monarchy
Factions (Confidence/Strength): Royal bureaucracy (4/4), Zhu faction (3/2), Gu faction (2/3), Lu faction (2/2), Buqu (4/4)
Culture: Han Chinese, with significant numbers of Wu Chinese in the east and various Turkic, Xianbei, and Mongolic groups settled in the north; usual syncretistic Chinese religious mixture is most popular here, save for small numbers of Buddhists; Middle Gan Chinese is most often used in the core territories, with Turkic dialects spoken in the north and Xiang Chinese in the east.
Army: 70,000 infantry, 25,000 cavalry
Army Quality: 6
Army Description: Military colony-based supply of heavy and medium infantry and midrange missile units predominates, along with medium cavalry chiefly raised from settled pastoralist groups.
Income (Raw &#8211;Upkeep): 68,300 - 67,500 = 800
Treasury: 7,500
Infrastructure: Good
Prestige:
Description: Originally, the Yang were claimed to be a &#8216;continuation&#8217; of the dead Qi Dynasty, but their hold on the provinces began to crumble within decades, weakened further by serious blows from the Liang. Yet in the fifth and sixth centuries the Yang, especially under the reign of Jianwen (471-509), recovered many of their provinces, and rebuilt a military that, if not as powerful as that of the Liang to the north, at least had a chance of standing toe-to-toe with them. But any ruler of the Yang must be careful, for enemies lurk to every side, and concentrating too intensely on one may leave him open to attack from another.

 

[Abaddon]

How do your stats handle technological advance?

Perhaps Factions should have a loyalty stat?

 

[Kraznaya]

Capital: Linxiang

Why Linxiang/Changsha?

Factions (Confidence/Strength): Royal bureaucracy (4/4), Zhu faction (3/2), Gu faction (2/3), Lu faction (2/2), Buqu (4/4)

I think you need to explain the factions of nobility more. Royal bureaucracy and Buqu seem a bit over-encompassing to show the real cracks in loyalty should they occur.

Culture: Han Chinese, with significant numbers of Wu Chinese in the east and various Turkic, Xianbei, and Mongolic groups settled in the north; usual syncretistic Chinese religious mixture is most popular here, save for small numbers of Buddhists; Middle Gan Chinese is most often used in the core territories, with Turkic dialects spoken in the north and Xiang Chinese in the east.

Han Chinese is basically an ethnic classification, not a cultural one. The original inhabitants of the Yangtze river region, the Yue, were long driven south before the PoD and thus a "Wu Chinese" classification would not make sense. It would make more sense, not to mention be more clear, if you said Yang, as a relatively conservative polity which derives a direct line of legitimacy from the previous dynasty, based inland and freer of outside influences than any other Chinese polity, had a Confucian-Legalist outlook as opposed to the more outward looking Wu and Nanyue (which would have less strict Confucianism and perhaps greater tendency toward Buddhism.)

 

[Dachs]

How do your stats handle technological advance?

They don't. Purposefully. Very, very purposefully. The state has essentially zero role in technological innovation at this time.

Perhaps Factions should have a loyalty stat?

"Confidence" isn't good enough?

Why Linxiang/Changsha?

Mostly circumstance. I'm open to suggestions, though.

I think you need to explain the factions of nobility more. Royal bureaucracy and Buqu seem a bit over-encompassing to show the real cracks in loyalty should they occur.

That's the problem, isn't it? I don't want to make the "Factions" part of the stats too large because these are, after all, stats. But I need to have them be detailed enough to describe stuff. So I'm trying to strike the right balance between "what you need to be able to find out from a quick glance at stats" and "what you need to ask the mod about". Specifically, how would you alter them?

Han Chinese is basically an ethnic classification, not a cultural one. The original inhabitants of the Yangtze river region, the Yue, were long driven south before the PoD and thus a "Wu Chinese" classification would not make sense. It would make more sense, not to mention be more clear, if you said Yang, as a relatively conservative polity which derives a direct line of legitimacy from the previous dynasty, based inland and freer of outside influences than any other Chinese polity, had a Confucian-Legalist outlook as opposed to the more outward looking Wu and Nanyue (which would have less strict Confucianism and perhaps greater tendency toward Buddhism.)

Good point.

 

[Kentharu]

In respect to the Factions stat I assume you will add and take away Factions as they come and go. In this way you can reduce the amount of stat work, yet keep it as a relatively realistic representation.

Perhaps Factions should have a loyalty stat?

I assume the "Confidence" is basically the numerical representation of loyalty. Its the first number in the pair, Confidence/Strength.

The stat itself definately helps a lot IMO, considering most of my questions to a mod consist of what political factions I'm up against and how strong they are, so on and so forth. That stat is a nice quick go to guide to show me how I'm doing. From there I can figure out which factions I want to please and which I can ignore. So yes it was a damn good idea (even if you ripped it from BirdNES who cares).

I do like your military description and organic like structure. I assume that when deploying one's army you can choose how many archers you want to have, how many spearmen and such (fitting inside the military description of course). The description itself seems like a nice addition and would allow players to tailor their strategy around the strengths of their army instead of arbitrarily throwing this many men at a certain situation.

My only fear is that these stats will become to bulky and cumbersome and therefore tedious for you to update. This is no pot shot at you or your work ethic. I simply mean that you are human and this much number crunching might burn you out. It happens to the best of us. However despite the initial size of the states I suspect much of the large descriptions (nation description, army descriptions) won't change very often and therefore most of the work is done already, leaving just adding and subtracting numbers when you need it.

At this point I'm just rambling so I'll leave it here.

 

[Dachs]

In respect to the Factions stat I assume you will add and take away Factions as they come and go. In this way you can reduce the amount of stat work, yet keep it as a relatively realistic representation.

That's the plan.

My only fear is that these stats will become to bulky and cumbersome and therefore tedious for you to update. This is no pot shot at you or your work ethic. I simply mean that you are human and this much number crunching might burn you out. It happens to the best of us. However despite the initial size of the states I suspect much of the large descriptions (nation description, army descriptions) won't change very often and therefore most of the work is done already, leaving just adding and subtracting numbers when you need it.

To be honest, there's not enough number crunching. I wish that there were an Excel version of QJM/TNDM/whatever floating around for easy use. I may be using a hell of a lot of informed guesswork, extrapolation from historical sources, and estimation for a lot of this stuff...but in the end, I'm pulling numbers out of my ass just like almost every other mod.

Most of the stuff that requires the most work is being done/finished now, yes.

 

[Abaddon]

I wouldn't worry too much about the different fractions. The numbers alone are enough in the stats. Initial update should be where their description goes (if needed) and any changes will be part of future updates.

(I was having a brainfart when i didn't connect loyalty to confidence.)

 

[Kentharu]

I've noticed that nations seem to have a large treasury and then low income. Will be semi-required to keep the treasury high. As in will spending everything and running only on annual income (or rather 5 year income) cause all the little people in our government to start running around like chickens with their heads cut off?

I'm so use to having that per-turn spending and nothing else that I'm kind of... at a lost lol.

Initial update should be where their description goes (if needed) and any changes will be part of future updates.

I'd say just let people PM the mod about it TBH. If they ask provide the info, if not then don't bother because then it might end up being a thousand tiny descriptions of factions that no one even carried about. Even for an update 0, that is a ton of unneccessary work.