Out of control gun control

[kochman]

I don't even know what we're talking about anymore.

In case you are serious, we were talking about your bad analogy...

 

[Defiant47]

In case you are serious, we were talking about your bad analogy...

In case you didn't realize, I decided the inanity of our discourse warranted halting.

 

[IglooDame]

You were doing fine stating facts right up until that last (bolded) bit, which went from fact to opinion without warning.

Correct. I was afraid that the facts might look a certain way, so I inserted an opinion to influence readers.

(Too much honesty?)

On the contrary, explanation much appreciated.

 

[emzie]

I do, and it is a ridiculous argument.

You have one guy (Hitler), who happened to love Wagner's music... and as a result, his lackies all listened more than they would otherwise, etc.

Versus gangster rap, which is completely direct in it's lyrics, it's clothing styles are glorified, and they direct lyrics are directly acted upon every day...

I get what you are saying, there was already a criminal element in the areas where rap spawned... but "gangster rap" was like giving that element steroids.

You might as well claim Doom caused Columbine. It's a facetious argument with nothing more to back it up than one's gut feeling.

You're treading dangerously close to, "If you didn't count blacks, America would rank much better."

 

[kochman]

In case you didn't realize, I decided the inanity of our discourse warranted halting.

Hahaha, nice cop out... considering you were wrong.

You might as well claim Doom caused Columbine. It's a facetious argument with nothing more to back it up than one's gut feeling.

You're treading dangerously close to, "If you didn't count blacks, America would rank much better."

First, did Doom encourage going into a school and killing students? No...

Gangster rap directly talks about it's results... and glorifies it.

And, for the "racist" record, you're the one suggesting that only blacks are into such thug life, not me. Perhaps you should look in the mirror when calling someone racist?
Street thugs come in all sorts of colors... it's a subculture, not a race!!!

 

[nonconformist]

So it's more of a class issue than a race one, amirite?

 

[kochman]

So it's more of a class issue than a race one, amirite?

It's more of a subculture issue (which we could easily argue can include "class"... where as culture wouldn't include class because it encompass the entire society within the class)...
Not even remotely all poor or whatever class are into street thuggism. The gangster rap subculture is something present more in America than any other country to which I have been.

 

[nonconformist]

But why the hate for Gansta Rap? It doesn't necessarily incite violence, and quite often is able to see itself in quite an ironic fashion.

Hell, I listen to a lot of it, and I'm a ForSci graduate.

 

[emzie]

First, did Doom encourage going into a school and killing students? No...

Gangster rap directly talks about it's results... and glorifies it.

All yer showing is a correlation.

And, for the "racist" record, you're the one suggesting that only blacks are into such thug life, not me. Perhaps you should look in the mirror when calling someone racist?
Street thugs come in all sorts of colors... it's a subculture, not a race!!!

I didn't call you a racist, I chose my words carefully so I could dance around such a retort. Regards,

 

[kochman]

But why the hate for Gansta Rap? It doesn't necessarily incite violence, and quite often is able to see itself in quite an ironic fashion.

Hell, I listen to a lot of it, and I'm a ForSci graduate.

Personally, I find it to be hilarious and listen to a lot of it as well... old school stuff... like NWA for example.

However, there is a large section of American society for whom this stuff is all too real and reflects their environment to a "T", which then seems to be perpetuating more.

 

[Traitorfish]

Kochman, how much of the Troubles in Northern Ireland do you think can be attributed to The Wolfe Tones? All of it, or just most of it?

 

[nonconformist]

Kochman, how much of the Troubles in Northern Ireland do you think can be attributed to The Wolfe Tones? All of it, or just most of it?

Pfft, they were the moderates

 

[DrakeD]

And the bombing in Norway? Was that done through the use of legally-acquired fertilizer, obtained under a pretense of 'agricultural use'?

Yes. He even registred a agricultural company to cover for it. Also rented a farm where he made the bomb.

If your gonna make a point about gun control of this incident, then the conclusion must be that it should be increased. He got both the Glock and the Ruger legally.
You dont need semi automatic 5.56 rifles for hunting, and 9mm handguns are only useful for shooting humans at close range.

 

[Defiant47]

Yes. He even registred a agricultural company to cover for it. Also rented a farm where he made the bomb.

The question was ironically-rhetorical.

 

[kochman]

Yes. He even registred a agricultural company to cover for it. Also rented a farm where he made the bomb.

If your gonna make a point about gun control of this incident, then the conclusion must be that it should be increased. He got both the Glock and the Ruger legally.
You dont need semi automatic 5.56 rifles for hunting, and 9mm handguns are only useful for shooting humans at close range.

The point is, the police should have ready access to it, and don't.

I love when people say things like "you don't need 5.56mm for hunting"... says you, I could tell you you don't need a pen to write, use a pencil from now on...
And, yes, 9mm handguns are used at close range, typically on people... It's often called SELF DEFENSE.

I could run someone over with my car, better make it illegal... I could stab someone with a butterknife and kill them, make it illegal... I could kill someone by hitting them over the head with a hammer, make it illegal...

Get with the program...

 

[Defiant47]

The point is, the police should have ready access to it, and don't.

They do when the situation calls for it.

I could run someone over with my car, better make it illegal... I could stab someone with a butterknife and kill them, make it illegal... I could kill someone by hitting them over the head with a hammer, make it illegal...

Are those items primarily for the purpose of killing people?

 

[JollyRoger]

Guns don't kill people, rap music does.

 

[kochman]

They do when the situation calls for it.



Are those items primarily for the purpose of killing people?

Doesn't matter what they are primarily for, they can and do cause deaths, including murders.
Better question... how many lives have butterknives saved?

 

[Defiant47]

Doesn't matter what they are primarily for, they can and do cause deaths, including murders.

Your analogy fails because the differences are enormous.

A car is essential to every day life, and its use for murder is difficult. A butter knife is extremely difficult to use in murder, and provides only slightly better killing potential than a branch. A hammer is essential to construction, and thus essential to life; its use in mass-murder is difficult.

A gun is not essential to daily operations, and it makes mass murder a cakewalk.

The items just aren't comparable.

 

[kochman]

Your analogy fails because the differences are enormous.

A car is essential to every day life, and its use for murder is difficult. A butter knife is extremely difficult to use in murder, and provides only slightly better killing potential than a branch. A hammer is essential to construction, and thus essential to life; its use in mass-murder is difficult.

A gun is not essential to daily operations, and it makes mass murder a cakewalk.

The items just aren't comparable.

Well, your rabid anti-gun position is noted...
I disagree that a gun is not essential, I have lived in bad neighborhoods where having a gun has afforded me daily protection...
The point is, waaaaaaaaay more people die from other things, but they are legal.
Get over your hatred and fear of firearms and learn that trying to control people's right to defend themselves and their loved ones is a God given right. Guns just happen to be the best tool for it these days.