Possible new leader for each civ

Socrates for portuguese leader? :suicide: And I thinked that Salazar was bad enough......

IMHO no Portuguese leader after Sebastião de Carvalho e Melo ( Marquis de Pombal... and even him :/ ) has the slightest chance of being remotely close of being a good portuguese leader ( atleast with decent standarts )

About Spain: definitely Philip II of Spain, I of Portugal... the peak of Spanish power in the world.... All of of the rest looks insignificant compared with that.

I would like seing another Japanese leader... Maybe one from the Meiji restoration?.....
 
the thing is, with the inclusion of the HRE, that rules out A LOT of previously possible good German leaders, like Otto I or the "other" Frederick. Wilhem II was the only German I could think off the top of my head. and no Hitler, obviuosly.

A post WW2 leader might be a good choice, could be either a chancellor or president. Theodor Heuss and Konrad Adenauer would be atleast as worthy as Wilhelm II, imho.
 
I've said it before, and I'll say it again:

Marquês de Pombal para líder português.

Vote Marquês de Pombal!
 
A post WW2 leader might be a good choice, could be either a chancellor or president. Theodor Heuss and Konrad Adenauer would be atleast as worthy as Wilhelm II, imho.

possibly, but recent leaders (within the last 3/4 of the century or so) are quite well-known, or at least well-known enough. ask the average person, and they'll go :confused: when you mention Heuss or Adenauer. ALthuogh I pretty much don't know anything about them (just that they were barely after WWII), I suppose they could make so-so choices.
 
Feel free to add more to the list.

Portugal: Henry the Navigator, Joao III, Alfonso I, Marquis of Pombal

If you want to update, please update this one:

It isn't Alfonso!!!! Our 1st king was AFONSO HENRIQUES!
AFONSO without the L!!!

Alfonso with L is the spanish name!!!

Thanks!!!
Peace!
 
If you want to update, please update this one:

It isn't Alfonso!!!! Our 1st king was AFONSO HENRIQUES!
AFONSO without the L!!!

Alfonso with L is the spanish name!!!

Thanks!!!
Peace!

It's Alfonso in English; English, like the forms of Romance spoken in medieval western Iberia (Castile, Leon and Galicia-Portugal), doesn't distinguish a "Portuguese" from a "Spanish" form.

Besides, it's ludicrous to think that Alfonso Henriques thought he had a different forename from his maternal grandfather, Alfonso the Brave, after whom he was named ... anachronistic nationalism; his father gave him that name both to honour his lord Alfonso the Brave, stress his son's royal ancestry, and thus to make his heir more Spanish so that his subjects in his new Spanish kingdom (i.e. Portugal) would more likely accept him (son of an immigrant mercenary from France) as ruler. He styled himself:

Alphonsus Henrici , (Alfonso, son of Henry


See .. ph. :p
 
^^We have Joao ( should be João, but most of th e people don't have the ã )not Jonh..... And Isabella and not Elizabeth.... Why not Afonso and not Alfonso?

P.S His father came from Burgundy, not France.....
 
Byzantium - Constantine (spiritual, organised. There must be a founder if we do not consider them to be the roman empire, as they themselves did as well as the Turks who ended them)

Spain - mighty country blessed by great founders, but cursed by a crappy sequence of insignificant rulers thereafter. Franco merely existed because nobody cared after the spanish civil war, the global focus being WWII and the cold war.

France - Henry of Navarre (expansive, charismatic. Awesome at high difficulties. Possibly the best french ruler ever, and this is quite a feat in a country gifted with tremendous leadership. But France has already 3 rulers, so I would take one of them out, De Gaulle)

Vikings - Rollo (a.k.a. Robert of Normandy, a man whose actions shaped the histories of France and England. aggressive, expansive)

HRE - Barbarossa (imperialistic, organized. Think of what you could do with this guy in charge of the Holy Roman Empire. Cheap Rathaus. Makes you shiver.)

Arabia - Harun al Rashid (philosophical, cultural)

Persia - Abbas I (spiritual, philosophical)

India - Babur (charismatic, cultural. Could be considere mongol or turk or persian though. Uzbeck as of birth. A beast on the battlefield and a rabid architectural builder)

Japan - Ookubo Toshimichi (organised, industrious. One of the meiji oligarcs, the one responsible with the modernising of the economy. Pop out forges and factories in a breeze, then drop the shale plant in.)

Ethiopia - Bob Marley (spiritual, charismatic. Why not?)
 
you're wrong,in every english sites the name of the King Afonso Henriques is written without L.
Alfonso is a spanish name of somebody else,Afonso is a portuguese name.
Well lets call Queen Elizabeth to Elisabete?

the peak of spanish power in the world was after the reign of Isabela a Católica,and portugal was after the reign of D.João II.
 
It's Alfonso in English; English, like the forms of Romance spoken in medieval western Iberia (Castile, Leon and Galicia-Portugal), doesn't distinguish a "Portuguese" from a "Spanish" form.

Besides, it's ludicrous to think that Alfonso Henriques thought he had a different forename from his maternal grandfather, Alfonso the Brave, after whom he was named ... anachronistic nationalism; his father gave him that name both to honour his lord Alfonso the Brave, stress his son's royal ancestry, and thus to make his heir more Spanish so that his subjects in his new Spanish kingdom (i.e. Portugal) would more likely accept him (son of an immigrant mercenary from France) as ruler. He styled himself:

Alphonsus Henrici , (Alfonso, son of Henry


See .. ph. :p

I agree with Luso!
It's AFONSO!!!

If you went to the English, then João II should be Jonh II!!!

Elizabeth can be Elisabete or Isabel, so with your concept Isabel of Spain should be also Elizabeth!!!

SO I rest my case! IS AFONSO without the L!!!

Spanish kingdom?!? Calgacus you know better then that!!!
First Iberia kingdons, then Portugal, then must more latter Spain!!!
And you know what I don't like!!! :)

PS: and is Henriques not Henry! It's a type of last name!
PS2: Henry = Henrique!
PS3: it depende in with language you say! E.g. James in portuguese it's Tiago!

PS personal: Great to see you!!!
 
Byzantine - Constantine
Turks - Selim I (he conquered middle east(Mamluks)) or Ataturk
Spain - Franco
Greece - Phillip II of Macedon
 
Why do so many people want Franco as a leader. He was an absolute despot and not good at anything but staying out of WWII.

WARNING! HISTORY DETOUR!

If I am not mistaken, he offered to get in but was politely turned down by the germans, who feared the opening of another front which would have further sapped their resources without any strategical advantage - France only lasted a small number of weeks anyway.

Moreover, I still hold the opinion that he was a small fry, overlooked by the Powers That Be for hotter and more pressing matters: WW2, Cold War.
If you check a map of the Mediterranean in the 60ties, you could see how most countries were dictatorships of some sort. Nobody cared. Or, to be more cynical, the right-left leaning of the dictatorships demarcated the USA-CCCP spheres of influence:
- Spain (fascist dictatorship)
- Portugal (fascist dictatorship)
- Turkey (frequent army intervention)
- Greece (fascist dictatorship)
- Jugoslavia (socialist dictatorship)
- Albania (socialist dictatorship)
- Algeria (socialist dictatorship mired in independence, civil and religious wars)
- Libya (socialist dictatorship with a taste for international terrorism)
- Egypt (socialist dictatorship)
- Israel (uh... socialist pro-US democracy mired in a nationalistic colonial preemptive war?)
- Lebanon (not yet in civil war but getting there, thanks to the 6-days-war refugees intake)
- Sirya (fascist dictatorship - actually the Baath party, an arab clone of the Nazi party who had a twin in Iraq, before someone "liberated" the latter)
- Italy was a sort of strange exception, a defeated enemy turned vassal under the (in)direct control of the US: usually the Americans support friendly fascist dictatorships, but they would not do that in Italy because, well, the country invented the concept and fought against them. So they went for democracy, kept in check from turning too right or left by a strategy of terrorism: 20 years of random bombings from far-left and far-right groups left the powers in the hand of basically one moderate, pro-US and deeply corrupt party.
- France... well, France was a democracy with a General in charge, getting nookilar weapons of mass destruction and urging the independence of Free Quebec. Probably with a Free Louisiana in his mind, too. As if it were not enough, in 1968 it was packed with young surrenderous cheese-eating monkeys with a liking for Mao and free sex. Pity it just got liberated recently, otherwise another round of "liberation" might have felt proper.

BACK TO GAME ISSUES

There is quite a number of brutal despots in Civ4 (Stalin anyone? What about Mr. Cultural Revolution?) so your argument against Bad Guys does not hold, sadly. On the contrary, some despots are politically correct while others are not. Apparently, joining a war and siding with the winner helps winning "correctness" points.

I would say that Franco is not there exactly because he did NOT join the Second World War on the good side. Joining on the bad side means that, in free strategy games, history pretends you never existed.
On the other side, if you need a clearly evil supervillain for a shoot-em-all game, then what is better than a zombie cyborg clone of the austrian Weird Hairdo?
 
I'm almost 100% willing Franco had no intention of fighting in the war, due to the state of his country. After all, Hitler paid him a personal visit, and spent hours trying to convince him to attack Gibraltar. This would've been a serious blow to the British and cut off their fleet and troops in the Med and Africa from the isles. Franco even wanted Gibraltar. But Franco refused to do it, even when subjected to the near-hypnotic charm of Hitler himself. I think it's pretty safe to say he had no intention of participating.
 
I'm almost 100% willing Franco had no intention of fighting in the war, due to the state of his country. After all, Hitler paid him a personal visit, and spent hours trying to convince him to attack Gibraltar. This would've been a serious blow to the British and cut off their fleet and troops in the Med and Africa from the isles. Franco even wanted Gibraltar. But Franco refused to do it, even when subjected to the near-hypnotic charm of Hitler himself. I think it's pretty safe to say he had no intention of participating.

Are you sure about Gibraltar? The Mediterranean and Africa were of no consequence for the Germans. In their plan it should have been a battlefield between stronger italian forces and weaker british ones, sapping some strength of the latter.
In reality, British forces less than a third of the Italians were not only able to resist, but to sink most of the italian fleet in Taranto and invade Libya, forcing an unplanned german intervention...
 
Umar, Abu Bakr and Ali are great leaders, but rendering them in 3D is as bad as drawing the Prophet. Now I wouldn't mind, but CIV is more popular then CivIII(Which included Abu Bakr) among us Muslims who would like to TAKE OVER THE WORLD according to our accusers. Think of including Hitler in this game for the Germans, get the idea?

I personally wouldn't mind BTW, although I would like to play as Haroun Al Rasheed. Saladin is great, and the fact that he is in fact a Kurd does not matter.
 
Umar, Abu Bakr and Ali are great leaders, but rendering them in 3D is as bad as drawing the Prophet. [...]

I personally wouldn't mind BTW, although I would like to play as Haroun Al Rasheed. Saladin is great, and the fact that he is in fact a Kurd does not matter.

I did not know about the drawing ban being so wide, I thought it was limited to God and the Prophet.

Harun al Rashid would be terrific to play, I agree. Cultural and what else?

The fact of Saladin being a kurd is indeed impressive, on par of being considered in his own age chivalrous and worthy of praise in Europe, which rarely showed at the time anything but fear and loathing for anything muslim. He must really have been all the great stuff that was written about him and then some, to overcome medieval ignorance, hate and misunderstanding - let alone achieving great successes after reunifying many different arab groups is such a short time span. Indeed, it proved too much for any successor to cope with.

Fortunately in Civ we do not have leader time limitations ;)
 
Harun al-Rashid would probably be the best contender for a new Arab leader. Pity they didn't include him in Civ4.
 
I did not know about the drawing ban being so wide, I thought it was limited to God and the Prophet.

Harun al Rashid would be terrific to play, I agree. Cultural and what else?

The fact of Saladin being a kurd is indeed impressive, on par of being considered in his own age chivalrous and worthy of praise in Europe, which rarely showed at the time anything but fear and loathing for anything muslim. He must really have been all the great stuff that was written about him and then some, to overcome medieval ignorance, hate and misunderstanding - let alone achieving great successes after reunifying many different arab groups is such a short time span. Indeed, it proved too much for any successor to cope with.

Fortunately in Civ we do not have leader time limitations ;)
The Kholafa' al-Rashideen (All four of them) ;)

I'd recommend you watch "Kingdom of Heaven", although it focuses on the "other side"'s point of view, it's one of my favorite movies.
 
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