Shooting at Wilders speech in Texas

Except that that's not bigotry, of course. I'm not sure what it is, but unless you actively dislike the people who don't wear buttons, it's not bigotry.

Simply misattributing a marginal characteristic to a wider group than usual isn't bigotry by itself, just a mistake.

Also, Koumpounophobia.

What does the 'no' there mean (i suppose it is not 'button-no-phobia'...)?

The ancient term for button would be Komvion, with Koumpi being later and (i think) latin-greek hybrid of something. But even so it should have been Koumpiophobia or some such :yup:

(if it is supposedly the verb form of that later term, it should have been 'Koumponophobia'; 'button-up phobia').
 
What troubles me is the fact that the media is censoring itself. And that they are doing this for the sole reason that some Muslims have demonstrated their willingness to complain violently about things they don't like.
What troubles me is that millions of Muslims have complained nonviolently about this, and they aren't even part of the debate.
 
I was like WTH do germs have to do with anything.....

Then realized that's weird shorthand for Germans and that we are back to Nazis. :lol:
 
I was there to do some real life trolling, but left a bit early after it was clear that real life infractions were about to be issued.

Most of the "artwork" linked the Abrahamic figure to terrorism or made lewd sexual connotations.

Again, not making excuses for the shooters, but if we really had a terrorist problem in this country, I think we would have seen a more competent attack.

Were there any portraits of Holy Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) and his 9 year old wife Aisha?
Or any of his 12 other wives?

Thank goodness you weren't there when the shooting started!

Do they have the right to mock Muhammad? Yes. But it seems to me that the defenders of free speech come out swinging on the same side as actual Islamophobes and that defending this sort of thing too much leads one to glorify efforts to be as unproductively offensive as possible. It's one thing to make a political cartoon that mocks a government for its actions. It's quite another to deliberately choose the most important prophet of a religion and make extremely crude caricatures of him purely to get as much of a rise out of others as you can, or merely to show that you can.

It's like if schoolyard bullies find out that a classmate really likes cows, so they start cornering him and eating beef with exaggerated pleasure in front of him, or mooing at him, or showing him photos of dead cows at slaughterhouses, over and over, just to hurt the other kid and to prove that it's technically not prohibited by playground rules. Then the bullied kid has enough and injures or kills someone in the group of bullies. Obviously an awful overreaction, and worse than the bullying itself. Don't get me wrong, bullying doesn't warrant murder. You'll never find me saying that terrorists are better than caricaturing trolls. But I find it hard to believe that we're supposed to rally in defense of the bullies' right to pick on someone for no productive purpose. I'd rather criticize both deliberately offending people for no good reason, and terrorism. Obviously I'd criticize terrorism more, since while both are bad things, that doesn't make them equally bad, but the point remains.

Maybe if the cartoonists stopped getting shot and killed, they'd fade into obscurity where they belong.
Free speech being protected is more important than peoples' hurt feelings.
 
Free speech being protected is more important than peoples' hurt feelings.

Absolutely. Just think how much better this forum would be if I could just respond to every post with an obscene tirade. I mean, there is really nothing better for forwarding society than being able to spout the most offensive non sequitur at random without suffering any consequences, AmIRite?

Free speech means that you get to submit your opinions to the discussion, not that you get to sidetrack it or shout it down...at least it should mean that.
 
Absolutely. Just think how much better this forum would be if I could just respond to every post with an obscene tirade. I mean, there is really nothing better for forwarding society than being able to spout the most offensive non sequitur at random without suffering any consequences, AmIRite?

Free speech means that you get to submit your opinions to the discussion, not that you get to sidetrack it or shout it down...at least it should mean that.

That's a really good point.
We should abolish Freedom of Speech then, and enact a very strict national speech code.

Then we could jail and fine all the bigots and loudmouths and everyone who sidetracks and shouts down conversations.
There's a whole list of things we could finally make right in this country.

Make Fox News illegal.
Outlaw conservative viewpoints. (The #1 threat to our country according to some)
Get rid of unlimited campaign contributions.
Jail all the racists.
Think how much better things would be.
 
Tim, you're applying standards to people who want to be productive and cooperative in civil society. These cartoonists, like their extremist counterpoints, are the ones just jonesin' in their balls through and through for a conflict of societies. They want the fight. They'll pick the fight. Two dumb dead Muslim men untrained and willing to come against the institutional violence of the States is textbook exactly the best outcome they were hoping for.
 
Millions of Germs were no violent, did they matter?
If you literally tell people who express their opinion in a nonviolent way that they don't matter, then you are explicitly endorsing violence.
 
What troubles me is that millions of Muslims have complained nonviolently about this, and they aren't even part of the debate.
Millions of police make nonviolent arrests, that makes police violence ok?

These cartoonists, like their extremist counterpoints, are the ones just jonesin' in their balls through and through for a conflict of societies.
Maybe they're dicks, doesn't mean they deserve to get shot.

When you're an oversensitive lil' b!t¢h of a religion you can expect to get teased. Fundy Christians get mocked all the time & they don't usually kill anyone (at least not in civilian life).

Let them have their little art show, if they start tagging up mosques with derogatory art then I won't have much sympathy for them being shot.
 
If you literally tell people who express their opinion in a nonviolent way that they don't matter, then you are explicitly endorsing violence.
That logic is not logic.

If you got 1000 nonviolent people at a concert at 10 violent ones you damn well better have security there. "But I didn't do it" doesn't help the victims of the ones who did.
 
In the end religious people of all creeds are going to have to get used to the fact that their gods and prophets are going to be ridiculed from time to time.

This isn't a theocracy, religious icons aren't sacred. I wouldn't recommend for anyone to go out of their way to insult a religious figure either, but it's going to happen.. so get used to it, or move somewhere where such a thing is outlawed.
 
Oh Narz. I didn't say they deserved to get shot. I said they got exactly what they wanted and exactly what they were trying to get.
 
So if you tease the oversensitive fat kid & he flips out & has to be restrained you're a jerk but the fat kid still needs to learn to control himself or he's gonna continue to have problems in life.

Nobody picks on the Unitarian Universalists.
 
That's a really good point.
We should abolish Freedom of Speech then, and enact a very strict national speech code.

Then we could jail and fine all the bigots and loudmouths and everyone who sidetracks and shouts down conversations.
There's a whole list of things we could finally make right in this country.

Make Fox News illegal.
Outlaw conservative viewpoints. (The #1 threat to our country according to some)
Get rid of unlimited campaign contributions.
Jail all the racists.
Think how much better things would be.

I'm assuming that you realize that none of your examples is even remotely related to what I said.
 
Millions of police make nonviolent arrests, that makes police violence ok?
That logic is not logic.

If you got 1000 nonviolent people at a concert at 10 violent ones you damn well better have security there. "But I didn't do it" doesn't help the victims of the ones who did.
I'm even more troubled that you immediately assume what my opinion on violent terrorists is even when I haven't said a thing about them.

That's exactly the problem.
 
So if you tease the oversensitive fat kid & he flips out & has to be restrained you're a jerk but the fat kid still needs to learn to control himself or he's gonna continue to have problems in life.

Did you mistake the assessment of what the convention's goal was with acceptance of the behavior of the dead idiots with the assault rifles?
 
I didn't really assume your opinion. I just think its strange why you think the nonviolent & good citizens should make news. News is always about violence, troublemakers, drama.

People make fun of Jews all the time. There are hundreds, probably thousands of conspiracy theories about them. Yet you don't see many Jews going nuts & shooting people up (again in civilian life). Granted there are 100 times more Muslims than Jews but even accounting for this the violent of radicial Muslims is off the charts.
 
Back
Top Bottom