Single Player bugs and crashes - After the 29th of March

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I did some tests related to workers and tile improvements and came up with the following list of possible bugs (I used SVN revision 5218). Please note that since there is no specification of the system I have no idea what is a feature and what is a bug, therefore I'm listing everything that seem inconsistent or counter-intuitive.

Thanks for this. Yes there are problems with improvements and terrain features. I started adding then both without understanding either.

There are inconsistencies in how building certain improvements does or doesn't remove terrain features (Forests, Jungles, etc.) on that tile. Often, early versions of certain improvements do not remove forests therefore it's preferable to build an early version of the improvement and upgrade it through being worked by nearby city. This requires disabling of hiding obsolete worker improvements in BUG menu and even with the option disabled later workers are usually unable to build the old improvements. I've tested which improvements remove which features and the results are in the attached file (sheet Feature compatibility).
There are inconsistencies in whether or not certain improvements are buildable on certain combinations of terrain types, features, etc. I've thoroughly tested this as well and the results for Workshop, Cottage and Farm are also in the attached file (on their respective sheets). Other improvements seemed fine, or the inconsistencies were minor and are mentioned later in this post.

There have been many discussions back and forth on if improvements should remove jungle/forest or not. One thing I have not done is add code to remove the jungle/forest when the improvement upgrades from one that does not remove it to one that does. I should be able to do that without worrying about what the improvement is just what is being removed and when so I can give the correct number of hammers.

Some terrain features need to be removed before something can be built rather than having the removal on the improvement. An oversight on my part.

The new workers - Llama/Mammoth/Camel Workers cannot build Tree Nurseries unlike the other workers of that era (regular Worker or Mule/Elephant/Buffalo Workers). Industrial Era Workers are again able to build Tree Nurseries.

Tree Nurseries are an optional mod and the person adding the new workers probably forgot (or did not know) that they had to update the mod also.

The "improved" Forts (the ones providing +75% and +100% defense bonus) are only buildable on the terrain types form the original game, while Forts are buildable on every terrain type.

Should be.

Not sure if the Tree Nursery improvement, after growing into Young Forest and later into Plant Forest, should also place a forest feature on the tile as does the late game Plant Forest worker action (available when terraforming/reforestation option is enabled), but it doesn't.

I thought I did both. Obviously not. :(

Tree Nurseries cannot be built on Marsh, even though it's possible to plant all types of features on this terrain type (Forest, Savanna, Bamboo in late game with the terraforming/reforestation option enabled). On Permafrost, it's possible to build Tree Nurseries, but it's impossible to plant any features.

Again because it is an optional mod it got forgotten.

With the Usable Mountains option enabled, when mousing over a Mountains tile, the tooltip doesn't display its terrain type or features on it (most likely because in unmodded Civ4 mountains are never usable). It's often impossible to tell what improvements will be be buildable on Mountain tiles, because some are only available on certain terrain types. It would be great if this info was displayed in the tooltips or at least if Mountains ignored terrain types altogether (they have the same yields for all terrain types anyway).


The New Forest terrain feature (not sure if it's currently supported by any map generators) cannot be removed except by building certain few improvements on that tile. It also doesn't allow building of any Lumbermill-type improvements.

It is not supposed to have improvements on it, you have to nurture its growth by working it, then you can do what you want with it. It is not supposed to occur at map generation.

We also have a burnt forest that, with new forest, is supposed to be used with the forest fire and volcano events.

Cacti terrain features (again, not sure if it's currently supported by any map generators) cannot be removed at all, only by planting another feature over it.

Windtrap improvement seems like a late game version of the Windmill improvement, but cannot be build on Mountains even though Windmill can.
It's possible to build Lumberjack and "Gather Wood" (the first tier of the improvement) on Jungles, but it's impossible to build Lumbermills.

Jungle tile feature seem to block building of many different types of improvements on certain terrain types (see the attached file for more details), it also appears that you cannot build the Ancient Relics special improvement on Jungle tile. This is quite strange since it can be removed by chopping it down and the improvements can be build there afterwards. Similarly for Swamps and Peat Bogs.

There is a problem with limiting improvement by technology which may be causing this problem. If something is on marsh and has an improvement that can be built there but you don't want the improvement built on swamp because you can't remove the swamp until a later tech then you need two improvements and we may not have done the second. Eg you can build a cottage on marsh if it has fresh water when you get the tech for cottages if we put the remove swamp on that improvement then you would be able to remove swamp long before you should be able to remove swamp. This is probably the reason for the other similar cases.

Rapa-Nui Workers' pedia description states that they should be able to build special Moai improvement, but they cannot. No such improvement seem to exist either. They can also build Highway and Jumplane, but cannot build Railroad, Electric Railroad and Maglev (these seem inferior to Jumplane).

That means that they forgot to tell me that they wanted the Moai improvement and provide me with a link to the graphics. (This may be a solution to the "geoglyphs" problem I am having ie have a worker that requires the Nasca Lines wonder.)

Different worker units are supposed to have different work rates (and they appear to), but these work rates don't seem to be displayed anywhere. This means it's impossible to tell how much of a work speed upgrade are you getting when upgrading workers without extensive testing.

It is just a number, the larger the number the faster they do stuff. Since with promotions it will vary by unit they probably need it in the hover over text. I can add it to the pedia, I think, which will be the work rate unadjusted for wonders or promotions.

For some reason the Buffalo and Elephant Workers cannot Burn/Remove Bamboo unlike Work Mule and Dog Worker (same tier workers). They all share other worker actions.

An oversight.

Entranced Workers (the cheap worker units trainable with Voodoo as state religion) are not tagged as Worker type unit and while they are able to earn experience, they are unable to purchase any promotions, since they have none available.

Another oversight because Voodoo is optional and so are their workers so the XML is in a mod.

When attaching a Noble (and possibly Great General) to a unit, the experience points from the Noble are also shared with worker units on the same tile.

Probably not what was intended.
 
Glad I could help in identifying some oversights.

There is another weird issue that is not related to workers or improvements.
I'm not exactly sure how to describe it... When reassigning citizens on a city screen manually, sometimes the game lags quite a lot whenever I change an assignment. Each reassignment lags the game for me for about 1 or 2 seconds.
But that's not all. Sometimes when I play for a while, at some point it suddenly stops lagging and it doesn't lag until I quit the game (or it crashes for that matter). After restarting the game and loading save in which this happened I start having those lags again. Unfortunately I wasn't able to identify the cause of the improvement.
I think it started with the introduction of property manipulators for specialists, but I'm not absolutely sure. It was around that time I started realizing it though.
Also when reassigning slave specialist to some other occupation while having unhappiness, the reassignment causes one of the unhappy citizens to become happy. They usually choose to become slaves which again causes a citizen to become unhappy. This keeps repeating until there is a "better" occupation than slave available for the unhappy citizen to choose when they become happy so that they won't cause unhappiness again.
 
Had a weird CTD just happen:crazyeye:

Everything was good, when i seen the new event i put ingame and it was missing a TXT, so i used the "go to windows" button on my keyboard and the game went to desktop icon , i then proceeded to fix the TXT and when i came back i pressed ON my (civ IV) C2C icon and when it came back it was originally missing the interface, then i re-clicked i to go back down, then re-clicked it to come back to play, BUT this time the interface was there but the units were INVISIBLE, i then re-did it again and this time POOF, CTD.:crazyeye:

SVN 5219, No VP
Attached minidump, savedgame (Must have a good PC for this save to work)

Core engine crash according to the minidump, so almost certainly an assets problem or a subtle graphics MAF.
 
Playing a deceiver civ in my current game for a change and it good to be able to look at AI. This save you can see one clear mistake by mexico who has a big capital but not many improvements.. this is totally sub-optimal. Also i've noticed in other games (as well as this one) when there are tiles that are across a 1 tile coast - the ai never puts a worker in a boat to ferry it over so they can put an improvement on these tiles, again a big mistake.

Also in this save (I can only see 2 AI cities) Dehli has 3 settlers horded inside and guess what asoka is building next? You guessed it, another settler :) Its not really that bad, not as bad as not improving the land, but i'm just curious why she is doing that.

Woah, I just went to attach by bbai log and its 65.5MB what the hell.. Does it accumulate the data from each game or something? Thats the biggest text file i've ever seen. I can upload it somewhere else.. Do you want it?

I have had a look at this save and the associated logs, and this is my analysis (and action plan):

1) The improvement situation around Mexico city is not so bad - all the major resources that civ knows about are improved and routed, and it has 2 workers actively engaged currently (one on the bambooed hill just SE of the city, and one making a route. The one building a route is a bit misguided (it's routing to the plots across the sea inlet from the city and as a result going a long way around) but really it's a relatively minor thing. Part of the reason it's a bit behind is that it's not fully in tune with the use-once nature of gatherers, and doesn't replace them until they are used up (and also doesn't decide it needs more of them than it would non-expendable workers).

2) The flurry of settler building in Delhi is because 4 Indian cities realized at the same time that settlers were needed and all put out tenders for a settler build in the same turn. Delhi won all the bids and queued 4 settlers up! This is a rough edge left over from the replacement of cities building everything for themselves vs tendering for them via the contract brokerage system. Ideally settler building would now not be controlled by cities at all, but rather by a larger scale unit (regional governor sort of thing) which would put out tenders in a more coordinated fashion. However, those structures don't (currently at least) exist, so the cities are still in charge of ordering the units.

To address (1) I think we could consider (but I'm not going to do it now, because it feels like it might be a situational thing and risk degradation in other circumstances, so for now this point is just for discussion and feedback) modifying the AI's assessment of how many workers it actually has (when comparing to how many it thinks it needs) so that expendable workers count for less than 1. That would encourage the AI to keep more gatherers around than it would workers since they can only do one thing and then die.

To address (2) I have modified the AI's count of the number of settlers it thinks it has to include any outstanding (but not yet fulfilled) tenders. That should mean that in a situation where it needs (say) 2 more, then only 2 cities (at most) will tender for a new settler in that turn and so excess will not be queued up.
 
Not sure if the Tree Nursery improvement, after growing into Young Forest and later into Plant Forest, should also place a forest feature on the tile as does the late game Plant Forest worker action (available when terraforming/reforestation option is enabled), but it doesn't.

The code looks like it should be working but it maybe that when an improvement upgrades it does not trigger the python "onImprovementBuilt" function which may explain the problem. Its either that or I have the wrong improvement name.

For the tree nursery it actually checks latitude and puts the correct graphics on the map. I probably should do that for the terraform plant forest.

Tree Nurseries cannot be built on Marsh, even though it's possible to plant all types of features on this terrain type (Forest, Savanna, Bamboo in late game with the terraforming/reforestation option enabled).

This is a case of advanced technology. Planting Tree Nurseries is low tech and it was decided it could not go on marsh. Whereas terraforming is a more advanced tech and adds marsh to what can be done.

On Permafrost, it's possible to build Tree Nurseries, but it's impossible to plant any features.

Permafrost is one of the new terrains. I need to check what features can appear on it to see which can be planted.
 
Newest game, started with rev 5190 and updated to 5211, it's 4565BC in an Epic game with 10 AI, only 4 religions have been founded.

1st Religion founded in the game - Tengrii, by me, 13350BC
2nd - Mesopotamism, AI, 5965BC
3rd - Shinto, me, 5930BC
4th - Judaism, me, 4600 BC

No Druidic, Shamanism, or Ngaii and these are normally the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd/4th religions, respectively, to be founded in any game prior to this SVN version range. And the AI usually founds these 3 while I'm bee lining Tengrii.

Something relatively recent has put the AI Off of building/founding religions, (with Mespotamism the lone exception? Fluke?).

There was some complaining by some recent new players about the AI researching religion techs that had already been founded and the AI was "tweaked". I think it's maybe broke now?

If needed save game can be attached.

JosEPh
 
Save game several turns before I got Judaism.

EDIT:Screenshots from current turn after updating to SVN 5234. No change in religion founding status.

JosEPh
 
For some reasons i cannot build any culture wonder nor the heroes despite having the appropriate requirements.

Is there a chance to check the recent changes on culture wonders?
 
For some reasons i cannot build any culture wonder nor the heroes despite having the appropriate requirements.

Is there a chance to check the recent changes on culture wonders?

Need more info on what the heck you are talking about??

Give at least 1 example, and a screenie, thx.
 
For some reasons i cannot build any culture wonder nor the heroes despite having the appropriate requirements.

Is there a chance to check the recent changes on culture wonders?

mea culpa, I forgot to set something in the Special Buildings XML. You can't build heroes without the cultural wonders.
 
@Taxman66
Spoiler :
Code:
<LeaderHeadInfo>
	<Type>LEADER_BISMARCK</Type>
			<Description>TXT_KEY_LEADER_BISMARCK</Description>
.
.
.
.

<Traits>
		                <Trait>
					<TraitType>TRAIT_CHARISMATIC</TraitType>
					<bTrait>1</bTrait>
				</Trait>
				<Trait>
					<TraitType>TRAIT_POLITICIAN</TraitType>
					<bTrait>1</bTrait>
				</Trait>
				<Trait>
					<TraitType>TRAIT_EXCESSIVE</TraitType>
					<bTrait>1</bTrait>
				</Trait>

He is charismatic, politician, excessive as shown above (taken out of the CIV4LeaderHeadInfos.xml). Whats make you think he is Scientific, Progessist and Megalomaniac?

My mistake, I thought I was playing with Bismark, turned out I had Freddie instead who does have those traits. BTW, I'm so far ahead tech wise by late prehistory ~ early ancient I'm wondering if Scientific is too powerful.
 
@ DH

Does this event for Religious cathedrals need to be updated??

EVENTTRIGGER_HYMNS_AND_SCULPTURES:

Spoiler :
Code:
<BuildingsRequired>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_JEWISH_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_CHRISTIAN_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_ISLAMIC_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_HINDU_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_BUDDHIST_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_CONFUCIAN_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_TAOIST_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_HELLENIC_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_ZOROASTRIAN_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_EGYPT_MYTH_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
			</BuildingsRequired>
 
Newest game, started with rev 5190 and updated to 5211, it's 4565BC in an Epic game with 10 AI, only 4 religions have been founded.

1st Religion founded in the game - Tengrii, by me, 13350BC
2nd - Mesopotamism, AI, 5965BC
3rd - Shinto, me, 5930BC
4th - Judaism, me, 4600 BC

No Druidic, Shamanism, or Ngaii and these are normally the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd/4th religions, respectively, to be founded in any game prior to this SVN version range. And the AI usually founds these 3 while I'm bee lining Tengrii.

Something relatively recent has put the AI Off of building/founding religions, (with Mespotamism the lone exception? Fluke?).

There was some complaining by some recent new players about the AI researching religion techs that had already been founded and the AI was "tweaked". I think it's maybe broke now?

If needed save game can be attached.

JosEPh

What is needed is the ai logs from the game up to the point where religions should hav been founded but weren't. Save game not really useful, sorry.
 
Don't have the logs as the file was deleted earlier today while working on an AND2.0 problem.

I just have tonights session, if that helps at all.

JosEPh
 
I have had a look at this save and the associated logs, and this is my analysis (and action plan):

1) The improvement situation around Mexico city is not so bad - all the major resources that civ knows about are improved and routed, and it has 2 workers actively engaged currently (one on the bambooed hill just SE of the city, and one making a route. The one building a route is a bit misguided (it's routing to the plots across the sea inlet from the city and as a result going a long way around) but really it's a relatively minor thing. Part of the reason it's a bit behind is that it's not fully in tune with the use-once nature of gatherers, and doesn't replace them until they are used up (and also doesn't decide it needs more of them than it would non-expendable workers).

2) The flurry of settler building in Delhi is because 4 Indian cities realized at the same time that settlers were needed and all put out tenders for a settler build in the same turn. Delhi won all the bids and queued 4 settlers up! This is a rough edge left over from the replacement of cities building everything for themselves vs tendering for them via the contract brokerage system. Ideally settler building would now not be controlled by cities at all, but rather by a larger scale unit (regional governor sort of thing) which would put out tenders in a more coordinated fashion. However, those structures don't (currently at least) exist, so the cities are still in charge of ordering the units.

To address (1) I think we could consider (but I'm not going to do it now, because it feels like it might be a situational thing and risk degradation in other circumstances, so for now this point is just for discussion and feedback) modifying the AI's assessment of how many workers it actually has (when comparing to how many it thinks it needs) so that expendable workers count for less than 1. That would encourage the AI to keep more gatherers around than it would workers since they can only do one thing and then die.

To address (2) I have modified the AI's count of the number of settlers it thinks it has to include any outstanding (but not yet fulfilled) tenders. That should mean that in a situation where it needs (say) 2 more, then only 2 cities (at most) will tender for a new settler in that turn and so excess will not be queued up.

Thanks for this, the Mexico examples wasn't such a good one I admit. The thing is though that some turns ago Mexico had virtually no improvements. I'll try and find the example.

I've also noticed that all of the AI's, when they intend to put cottages on hills instead of mines always wait until they have pottery. This is very bad. Its much better for them to build the prehistoric mines (forget the name, the workshop thingy's) and then to replace them with cottages, instead of just having no improvement for all that time.

I definitely feel like the AI needs to build more gatherers for sure! They also need to understand that gatherers are hella slow and sometimes its optimal to have 3+ building certain needed improvements, even if they want to disband them afterwards (with a nice $$ refund, of like 23:gold: I think it is in my current game) its definitely worth it. Having extra improvements earlier than your opponents is a sizeable and very tangible advantage. Lets say you are working a hill and an opponent is working a hill with a prehistoric workshop thingy, they'd be getting like +3 or 4 hammers per turn. Over 50 turns lets say thats 150:hammers: before modifiers! If they are building military units as an example, they could easily have +40% modifier thats 210:hammers: - 280:hammers: advantage over a small window of only 50 turns. I've seen the AI go without them for 100's and 100's of turns.. Also the AI have far superior population to me. If it wasn't for their total disregard of lumberjacks and prehistoric mines, I would have no hope of being anywhere near as close to them in score imo.
 
My mistake, I thought I was playing with Bismark, turned out I had Freddie instead who does have those traits. BTW, I'm so far ahead tech wise by late prehistory ~ early ancient I'm wondering if Scientific is too powerful.

Scientific has been nerfed in recent SVN changes. If you are using the default traits and not Is612's focused traits I should mention.
 
@ DH

Does this event for Religious cathedrals need to be updated??

EVENTTRIGGER_HYMNS_AND_SCULPTURES:

Spoiler :
Code:
<BuildingsRequired>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_JEWISH_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_CHRISTIAN_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_ISLAMIC_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_HINDU_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_BUDDHIST_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_CONFUCIAN_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_TAOIST_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_HELLENIC_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_ZOROASTRIAN_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
				<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_EGYPT_MYTH_CATHEDRAL</BuildingClass>
			</BuildingsRequired>

Yes but in a modular way since some people turn off some of the optional religions.
 
Wow... crazy big problem in our hotseat game. We had an infinite hang at end of turn, got out and I was hoping to be able to replicate it but going back to the last autosave we find we can't load it. Nor can we load the one before that. This takes us back to the original save when we started this evening and we CAN load that. A bit annoying but ok.

But running the debugger on the load sequence comes up with a REALLY interesting result. I've seen Revolutions produce a nation with no cities and I'm wondering if it has something to do with that having taken place somewhere after we started tonight. The crash takes place when the game tries to initiate the -1 player as if its an actual player with some established data. VERY odd.

Anyhow, Koshling/AIAndy, if you'd like to see if you can figure this out beyond what I can, here's the autosaves.

I figure the original hang problem was the one Koshling just recently fixed so an update will probably solve the original issue... THIS is just weird though and it makes me concerned that the autosave mechanism may have an issue, possibly even just on hotseat somehow. It's out of my comprehension zone anyhow :(
 
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