Single Player bugs and crashes v38 plus (SVN) - After the 20th of February 2018

[Fermongu]

More so, hunters do gain XP normally and level up, but stone throwers don't even show XP in portrait. And XP gained for Ambushers are anormally low (train with 2 natural XP, kill lots of animals, gatherers and even military units, and XP may be like 2.53 after that) I haven't tested XP gaining in other units since it was early prehistoric era.

 

[Toffer90]

I have always played with Dynamic XP on, but I have only see this behaviour since a few SVN versions ago.

Yeah, you always get some XP with the "Dynamic XP" option active. Not getting any XP from a fight is something I've never ever experienced.
So you were reporting a new and unknown bug... Possibly, it will have to be reproduced/confirmed by someone other than the initial bug reporter. ^^

That's right the Free starting techs were removed! So the Types of units the AI would now get is only the base start units, ie Stone Throwers. Oops! Maybe the Deity and NM Deity AI should get some of those Free Tech back? Would be Much simpler than writing new Python code. Don't you think so? Actually all Handicap levels that got Free Tech at start for AI should be put back in like you stated. Simple fix really.

Yup, added back the free techs in SVN rev. 10024 just now.

 

[JosEPh_II]

So what are your plans for starting in Eras besides Prehistoric?

 

[Toffer90]

None really... I wouldn't use it much even if we made it a viable option.

 

[JosEPh_II]

Starting in any Era besides Preh does kind of take away from the whole Mod's premise, Caveman2Infinity and beyond! Cap't Buzz!

 

[Toffer90]

Still, some may wan't to play Castle2Cosmos or Factory2Cosmos, or some such, so a long term, and unimportant, goal should be to improve later than prehistoric starts.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

They've always been a little too reluctant with gatherers because they are one shot units. They only build as much as they need to improve for their population so are a little behind their own curve there and slow to get the improvements made and progress can easily be hurt by barb incursions - which can kill the workers, raze the improvements, and set things back even farther. We might have to treat the one shot units no differently than full workers. I know as a player I hardly treat them different... just have to deal with their losses when they go.

They are not putting in trails either. They would help later building of improvements reducing the time to get the resources in the city but I think Afforess changed the code so that they build the trails only after discovering the bonus and not building them throughout your lands when there is nothing else to do.

So what are your plans for starting in Eras besides Prehistoric?

To support this we need to decide on what constitutes a good nation to make the play of the rest of the game fun. How many cities? Of what sizes? What starter buildings? Specialist cities? What improvements should exist and what units should exist. Further what has been explored and if there are other nations found what is the relationship between them down to what they are trading.

My initial guess for Ancient start

• Cities
  • one city size 15-20
  • two towns size 6-8 (one of these is the science city)
    
  • three villages size 1-3
• Buildings
  • all the myths of the animals spawning in that area, as well as landscape myths valid for each city and the Elemental Myths
    
  • all the Prehistoric National Wonders that are still active
  • each village and above
    • all the early prehistoric gathering buildings still active
    • all the early prehistoric education (not animal), crime fighting and disease fighting buildings
    • all the city terrain dependent buildings
  • each town and above
    • all the prehistoric gathering buildings still active
    • all the prehistoric education, crime fighting and disease fighting buildings
  • city
    • buildings needed to build all special units available at the beginning of the Ancient Era
• Units
  • in all settlements enough of the best available crime and disease fighting and story telling units to keep the current property rates at zero until the player does something to change things.
  • enough defensive units including dogs
  • one attack stack
• Land improvements
  • all improvements done and connected with trails
  • perhaps a fortification or two blocking choke points just outside the normal borders

For a Classic start I would go with similar ideas but have one big city, two cities, three towns and 4 villages. The point is to have an interesting start not a start that you could have reached if you had played the earlier eras. Hence the small number of citiies

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Two bugs

1) in vanilla it costs one movement point to cross a river. For awhile there we had it at none and now it is at all. Can we put it back to one please. Scouts and Hunters will thank you

2) subdued animals have a cost when they are outside your borders but have no cost when inside. This is leading me to having no problem keeping science on 90% while having hundreds of subdued animals waiting for new cities to move to. We have gone from slightly too costly to the extreme of no cost. Is there any way to up the cost a bit? Ideally having them cost food, about 1 food per 10 would be a realistic way to go but then you would need some way for each city to choose to support some of them or let the animals starve.

 

[JosEPh_II]

Two bugs

1) in vanilla it costs one movement point to cross a river. For awhile there we had it at none and now it is at all. Can we put it back to one please. Scouts and Hunters will thank you

2) subdued animals have a cost when they are outside your borders but have no cost when inside. This is leading me to having no problem keeping science on 90% while having hundreds of subdued animals waiting for new cities to move to. We have gone from slightly too costly to the extreme of no cost. Is there any way to up the cost a bit? Ideally having them cost food, about 1 food per 10 would be a realistic way to go but then you would need some way for each city to choose to support some of them or let the animals starve.

SVN 9987 alberts2 did this to river and peak movement:

• Reworked CvPlot::movementCost and added extra movement from crossing a river controlled by RIVER_EXTRA_MOVEMENT.
• Set RIVER_EXTRA_MOVEMENT to 3.
• Increased PEAK_EXTRA_MOVEMENT to 3 bacause it was only set to 1 and thats the same as it is for hills.

 

[KaTiON_PT]

SVN 10022

I'm noticing in deity the AI sometimes can't deal having two cities at the same time as its economy tanks. This didn't happen before even in this scenario.

See attached save file.

 

[Thunderbrd]

I'm noticing in deity the AI sometimes can't deal having two cities at the same time as its economy tanks. This didn't happen before even in this scenario.

That could explain some AI players not founding the 2nd city right away.

 

[Toffer90]

That could explain some AI players not founding the 2nd city right away.

They found it right away on the test I did after upping their Stone throwers to 10 and wanderers to 4 on Deity. All 10 AI's had founded their second city by turn 8 which was when I checked worldbuilder.
Though, I did the test with no leader traits gameoptions, which could affect it somewhat.
I find it a bit odd that the AI can't support 2 cities early on, they pay zero distance to capital maintenance until they found their third city, and their expenses on overall is much lower than that if the human player on deity difficulty.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Two bugs

1) in vanilla it costs one movement point to cross a river. For awhile there we had it at none and now it is at all. Can we put it back to one please. Scouts and Hunters will thank you

2) subdued animals have a cost when they are outside your borders but have no cost when inside. This is leading me to having no problem keeping science on 90% while having hundreds of subdued animals waiting for new cities to move to. We have gone from slightly too costly to the extreme of no cost. Is there any way to up the cost a bit? Ideally having them cost food, about 1 food per 10 would be a realistic way to go but then you would need some way for each city to choose to support some of them or let the animals starve.

We don't have unit food upkeep right now. It's something I did propose a while back but was shot down. Not a small project but something that may come up on the radar fairly soon.

More so, hunters do gain XP normally and level up, but stone throwers don't even show XP in portrait. And XP gained for Ambushers are anormally low (train with 2 natural XP, kill lots of animals, gatherers and even military units, and XP may be like 2.53 after that) I haven't tested XP gaining in other units since it was early prehistoric era.

Are you playing Size Matters?

 

[Fermongu]

No

 

[Thunderbrd]

Then it's just a matter of the difficulty/ease of the fight. Withdrawal factors in as an alternative form of difficulty of dispatching the unit. Yes, the calculation has changed some. It's also working as designed. At some point it might get further review and editing.

 

[KaTiON_PT]

Here's the AI struggling with its economy. By fully committing to lesser wealth it isn't building up their cities.

 

[JosEPh_II]

Here's the AI struggling with its economy. By fully committing to lesser wealth it isn't building up their cities.

Would you please post a screen shot of your game settings, found in the Victory screen, red fist top right Main screen.

 

[KaTiON_PT]

Would you please post a screen shot of your game settings, found in the Victory screen, red fist top right Main screen.

Sure thing. The only option not on the screenshot is the "No Vassal States".

 

[Thunderbrd]

Infinite loop (cant go to next turn)

I'm stumped on this one. The problem is bound up in the city queue completion for the Barbarian AI. It selects a worker to build but for some reason that's bound up in the multi-threading I can't fully interpret still, it somehow eventually spits out the selection and tries again, coming up with the same selection result and going back through the same mysterious process.

@alberts2: I hope you can understand this one better than I can. Multithreading is still fairly mysterious to me. I tried to set the number of city pipeline threads to 1 but it doesn't stop the problem from happening. It might not be a flaw in the multithreading setup but that's the wall I can't figure my way through in full - it starts doing some things I don't understand at all, even with just one thread. Please take a look at this if you can find the time. I'm hopelessly lost trying to figure this one out now. I don't THINK it's a problem with the worker itself... but that's a possibility that one validation check doesn't agree with another later. I just can't find the 'other later'. It seems to go straight to the core of the thread processing and go all wonky.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Here's the AI struggling with its economy. By fully committing to lesser wealth it isn't building up their cities.

This actually isn't that hard a status for the AI to hit. I've seen it before. If gold gets toooo challenging and the AI hits a wall like this where it cannot make enough gold to survive, it can tend to spiral out of control, stuck trying to build wealth and it not being enough. How to solve it? I'm not really sure. It's a good thing for the AI to consider some wealth building to patch short term deficits but there's a difference between all on wealth and still losing gold and a short term patch. The human player has an easier time understanding that. It's possible the AI needs to learn when to sack certain units better perhaps. A bit of a study in figuring out how they get into this spot may be necessary. When I saw it happen it was when I was playing rev and the AI took over my culture which I was running on complex wealth production propped up economy to support as many cities as I had.