The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
The English term is "Second Intermediate Period". Do you want the Swedish too? 
The Nile Gift - scenario creation thread
- Thread starter LouLong
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Arne
King
True, but they settled (in parts) the same lands. Hurrtians where ejected from indogermanic tribes, one of this tribes became that, what we today call "Hethitians". The Land caled "Hurri" is not identical with that, what you call "Hurritians".Takhisis said:
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
Hurrian is not an Indo-European (or "Indo-Germanic") language. There was an Indo-European language spoken in Mitanni, but that belonged to the Indo-Iranian (AKA "Aryan") branch of Indo-European, whereas Hittite belongs to the Anatolian branch.
Arne
King
It seems we sholud think about, going back to topic, becouse sorting all that languages, spoken by Hethitians and all that cultures in that region are much more complicated then it seems. For example, the language "Hattic" is not the language of (indo european) Hethitians, but its the language of the anatolian Hattians. To be correct... Hethitians did also not spoke Hittite, this therm IMHO is not longer used. They spoke "Nasili", that means something like "in the tongue of the citie NESA." (Hope that makes sense in english). Hattians are not Hethitians, even if this names are sometimes used synonymous. This is mad? Yes, it is, but we don't need to discuss about that any longer, we could simply go forward discuss about ideas for LouLongs sceanrio... 
PS: Hopefully I said nothing wrong, its pretty hard to translate the "German" therms in the right way.
PS: Hopefully I said nothing wrong, its pretty hard to translate the "German" therms in the right way.
Well, Hattian means "he from Hattusas" while "Hittites" means the whole group of the HittitesArne said:It seems we sholud think about, going back to topic, becouse sorting all that languages, spoken by Hethitians and all that cultures in that region are much more complicated then it seems. For example, the language "Hettite" is not the language of (indo european) Hethitians, but its the language of the anatolian Hattians. Hethitians spoke "Nasili", that means something like "in the tongue of the citie NESA." (Hope that makes sense in english). Hattians are not Hethitians, even if this names are sometimes used synonymous. This is mad? Yes, it is, but we don't need to discuss about that any longer, we could simply go forward discuss about ideas for LouLongs sceanrio...
ShiroKobbure
Still modding Civ3
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
In Hittite, Hittite and Hattic are known as "Nezili" and "Hattili" (not 100% on spelling), but the name "Hittite" is too worked in in English to change.
Anyway, the map doesn't go far north to include any Hitties, Hattis, or Hurrians.
Anyway, the map doesn't go far north to include any Hitties, Hattis, or Hurrians.
Arne
King
Sounds simple, but if it is that simple and "Hattian" means "he from Hattusas", what language is "Hattusas"? From what cames that and what dos it mean? ...Takhisis said:
Arne
King
@TLC: Did you read this?
LouLong said:
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
I've always assumed that Hattusas is a Hatti name, but I don't actually now; I'll find out, if it's known.
AFAIK, Mitanni never reached that far south. Source?
AFAIK, Mitanni never reached that far south. Source?
LouLong
In love with Rei Ayanami
???? Err... as much as I like historical debates about scenarios so as to make them both accurate and a good learning/"dwelling into" tool, I think your discussion should be in the History forum at this point... Because all lurkers are lost I guess seeing how I am myself.
About Mitanni, the map I showed is the result of cropping of an existing map of mine. So I can crop it less and Mitanni could be in easily. Even if only include Cilicia, Wassuganni is just at the northern limit so I don't need to change the map much to include a larger territory.
About the Hurrits I mentionned. For me they are partly related to the Hyksos.
The Hyksos mean in Egyptian the leaders of the foreigners. As happened during the Great Invasions at the end of Western Rome it is very likely a group of hurrits (a pillage or war party raid from the Van lake for instance) using chariot technics that established a fief in northern Palestine from where they created a mixed culture (hurrit/semitic) with mostly hurrits as the "nobility" (marjanni which is Indo-European BTW, in the Indo-Indian/Iranian branch) then invaded Egypt.
@ Arne : I really trust you for the Egyptian names of cities but for the moment and for the ease of comprehension, could we use Greek names right now. It would be nice to have the real names for the scenario but since I know maybe 3 of them, communications bewteen us right now would not be easy ;-)
On the other hand albeit extremely rusty my German exists so I can get most references you make. Besides I am no native English speaker myself !
@ all : the major question right now is "what time frame do we choose ?"
I have made a proposition that seems to please some people but you might have different opinions/propositions. I just won't go for hellenistic times because that's not our topic (albeit I love hellenistic times and am really knowledgeable about it (or maybe because I studied and worked on that era too much actually).
About Mitanni, the map I showed is the result of cropping of an existing map of mine. So I can crop it less and Mitanni could be in easily. Even if only include Cilicia, Wassuganni is just at the northern limit so I don't need to change the map much to include a larger territory.
About the Hurrits I mentionned. For me they are partly related to the Hyksos.
The Hyksos mean in Egyptian the leaders of the foreigners. As happened during the Great Invasions at the end of Western Rome it is very likely a group of hurrits (a pillage or war party raid from the Van lake for instance) using chariot technics that established a fief in northern Palestine from where they created a mixed culture (hurrit/semitic) with mostly hurrits as the "nobility" (marjanni which is Indo-European BTW, in the Indo-Indian/Iranian branch) then invaded Egypt.
@ Arne : I really trust you for the Egyptian names of cities but for the moment and for the ease of comprehension, could we use Greek names right now. It would be nice to have the real names for the scenario but since I know maybe 3 of them, communications bewteen us right now would not be easy ;-)
On the other hand albeit extremely rusty my German exists so I can get most references you make. Besides I am no native English speaker myself !
@ all : the major question right now is "what time frame do we choose ?"
I have made a proposition that seems to please some people but you might have different opinions/propositions. I just won't go for hellenistic times because that's not our topic (albeit I love hellenistic times and am really knowledgeable about it (or maybe because I studied and worked on that era too much actually).
LouLong
In love with Rei Ayanami
MaisseArsouye said:
Great Minds always meet
MaisseArsouye (c'est bien un nom de frite ça
) got exactly what is on my mind. Does not mean everybody has to agree though.
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
The Second Intermediate is probably the most interesting period.
The Predynastic could also work, but we'd have much less to work with unitwise. Tech-tree might be easier, tho.
(It occurs to me that a Predynastic scen might be similar to my Maya scen in some respects - very limited variation in units, and a bunch of basically very similar civs as the main players. Speaking of which, Lou, did you ever try it? Your input would be valued.
)
The Predynastic could also work, but we'd have much less to work with unitwise. Tech-tree might be easier, tho.
(It occurs to me that a Predynastic scen might be similar to my Maya scen in some respects - very limited variation in units, and a bunch of basically very similar civs as the main players. Speaking of which, Lou, did you ever try it? Your input would be valued.
)
MaisseArsouye
gentil petit nuton
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
(It seems that Hattusas is a Hittitized form from Hattic Hattus. The -as is then presumably cognate of Latin -us, Greek -os, Sanskrit -ah, Old Norse -R, and so on.)
utahjazz7
Deity
I also think that this could be a great scenerio.
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