Cloud_Strife
Deity
Depends, are you involved in making other people's lives actively worse off?
There are more of us than there are of them
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Depends, are you involved in making other people's lives actively worse off?
Zack
99% hot gas
When did I suggest anything of the sort lol
CurtSibling
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Cloud_Strife
Deity
Transpeople, Gay people, PoC, ethnic and religious minorities, they don't exactly have it all good in society, hell in your own country you have problems with the police mistreating and abusing PoC, as well as transphobia in the press like let's not pretend there aren't swathes of society that aren't treated like 2nd class citizens on the basis of characteristics they did not choose to have.
Zack
99% hot gas
I didn't say it. I typed it.
CurtSibling
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Semantics with no substance. This thread is pure junk. Have fun, gents.
Cloud_Strife
Deity
But enough about your posts
CurtSibling
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At least people read my posts. 
Cloud_Strife
Deity
At least people read my posts.
If it helps you sleep at night, then sure persist with that belief.
Apparently not, though I have found conflicting sources. It's difficult to find the base data for this.
Regardless, you still don't get it.
You being poor doesn't make you magically immune to criticism, forever. People don't need to be poor to talk about privilege. Wealth inequality is only one type of inequality (and even then has disparities by gender and race). What you're describing is a class inequality; i.e. the working class.
You don't understand what we're talking about here. Instead of getting offended at what you think Mary is saying (or what I'm saying) for what you think are her living experiences, because you think you've had it harder, maybe do some reading on the subject. It'd be far more informative than continuing whatever this argument is here.
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Zardnaar
Deity
Some if those prices are way off lol. Mortage rates being a big one. Our gas is twice as expensive and that list excluded imported stuff. Which is basically everything that's not a service or food which that list is.
Our consumer goods are a lot more expensive.
Apartments are also funny, we have very few here and the ones that exist are in the expensive big cities.
As I said I find it funny when middle class liberal university types go on about poverty. Very few have actually experienced it. I find it offensive being lectured about white privilege when I grew up in a town mostly all white. Most of the non whites were foreign students from wealthy families.
Eating out at restaurants here I think is cheap. $25 dinner for two curry, drink, naan bread was tonight's effort. Tuesdays effort was $20 and we're going out again on Monday which will be dinner for two $20.
Cherry picking the cheap night deals at some places.
Wages are lower though that's what makes NZ expensive. The median wages look similar but our currency is worth 0.60 USD so we're paying us prices at 40% less income and imported stuff is expensive.
I suspect both nation's are in a similar boat with wealth disparity and median wages might not tell the full story.
But yeah try out US prices after a 30 or 40% pay cut and get back to me. Higher taxes and a 15% sales tax on everything.
Our mortgage us cheap and will be done in a month or two, after that it's utilities and expenses will be around $50-70 USD a week plus food. House needs repairs though probably 20k worth, paint, kitchen, bathroom.
I would rather be poor in NZ than USA by poor I mean on welfare.
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Yeah, the site lacks a lot of perspective. It also won't separate by region, or class. "The US" is huge. Even New Zealand covers enough area and economic situations to make generalising difficult.
I can't afford to eat out, at least more than once or twice a month. I'm on a decent enough wage (not enough for my skillset, but hey). I'm renting, we have a kid.
You have no idea what people have experienced with money. You have no idea who here is a "middle class liberal university type" and what they've experienced. I don't get your point here. You've been poor. That doesn't mean you have any idea what privilege is. I don't care where you grew up, because that doesn't matter either (being white). I grew up in a very diverse (and not very well off) neighbourhood, but I still mostly knew white kids like myself. I didn't know what privilege was either! But I learned. You just seem to find the idea offensive, and the only reason you've given me is because you don't like being lectured at.
Well, tough? I don't particularly like being told by you, in every thread going, that fascists "aren't that much of a threat", or something else "isn't that bad". You don't want to be lectured at? Why do you give lectures then? Why do you think you know better?
You've been through hardship. This doesn't mean other people haven't, nomatter what cliche you describe them as.
I can't afford to eat out, at least more than once or twice a month. I'm on a decent enough wage (not enough for my skillset, but hey). I'm renting, we have a kid.
You have no idea what people have experienced with money. You have no idea who here is a "middle class liberal university type" and what they've experienced. I don't get your point here. You've been poor. That doesn't mean you have any idea what privilege is. I don't care where you grew up, because that doesn't matter either (being white). I grew up in a very diverse (and not very well off) neighbourhood, but I still mostly knew white kids like myself. I didn't know what privilege was either! But I learned. You just seem to find the idea offensive, and the only reason you've given me is because you don't like being lectured at.
Well, tough? I don't particularly like being told by you, in every thread going, that fascists "aren't that much of a threat", or something else "isn't that bad". You don't want to be lectured at? Why do you give lectures then? Why do you think you know better?
You've been through hardship. This doesn't mean other people haven't, nomatter what cliche you describe them as.
In my experience you get this whole "I haven't had an easy life either but things can't be that bad I don't know what other people are whining about" thing from New Zealanders pretty often. Maybe there's a specific type of Kiwi who are opinionated online or as a country it's just a very strange place.
Zardnaar
Deity
It's because there's a harden up mentality here. The privilege I got was being born in NZ, nothing to do with white privilege. Or the number 8 wire mentality which basically means fix it or sort it out yourself.
Throw in the great outdoors, summer camps, school camps, scouts etc it kinda gets drummed into you from birth.
My American friend describes it as every NZ male can do the haka, play rugby and drive a forklift.
Oh Zardnaar, you totally don't get what privilege is. Yes, wealth privilege is one type, but just one type - you do have an easier life of course, but there are many other ways you have benefits over other people. Privilege doesn't mean you automatically get easy wealth and happiness, it means society provides you with certain benefits not afforded to those of other demographics.
I wasn't starving or anything, but I struggled to pay all my bills when I was making $25k a year (and please remember that's my AGI, not my takehome pay - I got about $700 twice a month at that time)
But anyway, when you're dirt poor and white, at least you're not black in your same situation. Look at how well you pulled yourself out of it: if you had a different skin color, it would've been much more difficult, and that's what it's about. Someone here who is of African descent can explain white privilege much better than I can, but it's basically about things you and I take for granted. One simple example, is if you're black and you go shopping at a nice store, security will be much more likely to start harassing you as a potential shoplifter, and your rights are far more likely to be violated.
Or think about transgender people: as cisgender, you and I don't have to prove our gender status to anyone. You and I can have our ID showing our gender without any hassle, we can use whatever bathroom we want without fear, we don't have any problems seeking medical treatment, etc etc.
I can explain male privilege pretty well, from my own personal experience. Some things to think about:
- If you're in a bad mood or acting crabby, do people ever blame it on your sex?
- If you get promoted, do people say it's because of a gender quota?
- Do you routinely get passed up for promotion in favor of your less-talented coworkers of a different gender?
- Do people regularly feel entitled to criticize your choice of clothing and hairstyle?
- If you fail at something, do people say it's because of your gender, and try to use your failure as a gender criticism?
- Do you ever get turned down for a job because your potential employer assumes you might get pregnant?
- Can you walk down the street at any time of day without fear of being sexually harassed?
- How likely do you think you are to not only be abused by your domestic partner, but also told you should stay with that partner?
- Have you ever been accused of succeeding in your career only because you provided sexual favors?
- What happens if you go to work without spending 90 minutes working on your appearance?
- When you do spend time to make yourself look nice, do you get criticized for supporting gender norms?
- If you brag about having sex, do people call you a slut or whore?
You can of course try to be a smart *** and say "yes" to these, but you'd be very disingenuous, and clearly showing you don't give a snot about learning anything at all.
I wasn't starving or anything, but I struggled to pay all my bills when I was making $25k a year (and please remember that's my AGI, not my takehome pay - I got about $700 twice a month at that time)
But anyway, when you're dirt poor and white, at least you're not black in your same situation. Look at how well you pulled yourself out of it: if you had a different skin color, it would've been much more difficult, and that's what it's about. Someone here who is of African descent can explain white privilege much better than I can, but it's basically about things you and I take for granted. One simple example, is if you're black and you go shopping at a nice store, security will be much more likely to start harassing you as a potential shoplifter, and your rights are far more likely to be violated.
Or think about transgender people: as cisgender, you and I don't have to prove our gender status to anyone. You and I can have our ID showing our gender without any hassle, we can use whatever bathroom we want without fear, we don't have any problems seeking medical treatment, etc etc.
I can explain male privilege pretty well, from my own personal experience. Some things to think about:
- If you're in a bad mood or acting crabby, do people ever blame it on your sex?
- If you get promoted, do people say it's because of a gender quota?
- Do you routinely get passed up for promotion in favor of your less-talented coworkers of a different gender?
- Do people regularly feel entitled to criticize your choice of clothing and hairstyle?
- If you fail at something, do people say it's because of your gender, and try to use your failure as a gender criticism?
- Do you ever get turned down for a job because your potential employer assumes you might get pregnant?
- Can you walk down the street at any time of day without fear of being sexually harassed?
- How likely do you think you are to not only be abused by your domestic partner, but also told you should stay with that partner?
- Have you ever been accused of succeeding in your career only because you provided sexual favors?
- What happens if you go to work without spending 90 minutes working on your appearance?
- When you do spend time to make yourself look nice, do you get criticized for supporting gender norms?
- If you brag about having sex, do people call you a slut or whore?
You can of course try to be a smart *** and say "yes" to these, but you'd be very disingenuous, and clearly showing you don't give a snot about learning anything at all.
Spoiler Personal examples from some of these :
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I love this cartoon, it's a great visual metaphor of privilege, and how clueless people (like the poster above) sound when they dismiss it.
It's a great way of illustrating it. You still have a distance to go, and you have hurdles in your way, but you just don't understand the types of obstacles other people have to face.
It's a great way of illustrating it. You still have a distance to go, and you have hurdles in your way, but you just don't understand the types of obstacles other people have to face.
Cloud_Strife
Deity
OK boomer
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