Troy

[Lone Cat]

It is now accepted that the fabled city of Troy do exists. and it's located in Turkey. but what about trojans?
1. Who are they? what differentiate them from their rival Greeks? how should they looks like? (european OR middle easterners)
2. were they ancestor to Turks?
3. What happened to Troy during the day of Ottoman empire? do they preserve the city? raze it? or just leave it as ruins?
4. What should Trojan archetechture looks like? does it looks like greek? Egypt? or Mesopotamia?
5. Renaissance illustrations of trojan wars please (one with Italian pikemen fighting each other and the Troy itself is represented as a typical european city), how do christian europeans depiches the 'outlawed' gods of Olympus?
6. Strategic and Tactical importance of Troy during the days of first world war. If Britain invade Ottoman Empire through the ruins of the legendary city. what could be the possible results of 'secold Trojan War'?

=^.^=

 

[Kyriakos]

2. were they ancestor to Turks?

I hope you are joking, but doubt you are.

 

[sophie]

You forgot:

7. Does Turkey have the potential to become a potential superpower?

 

[NovaKart]

The ruins of Troy are mostly from a later period. From what I remember when I visited, there was a theater and many columns but they were from the Roman period and maybe some were Greek.

It's difficult to get a good feel for the architecture because what's left from the Bronze Age period is mostly just stone walls.

By the time the Turks arrived in Anatolia Troy was long gone. I assume they were unexcavated ruins until the 19th century when Schliemann discovered the ruins. He did discover some treasure from Troy which was taken to Germany and later to the Soviet Union.

At first he made all these connections between what he had discovered and The Iliad but I believe there's no way to establish any connection between the ruins and artifacts and the characters from the Iliad and even the events. Perhaps there is some evidence of a war but whether or not it was the Greeks or someone else I don't know.

 

[ParkCungHee]

You forgot:

7. Does Turkey have the potential to become a potential superpower?

8. Did the Trojans actually found the nation of Britain?

 

[Virote_Considon]

8. Did the Trojans actually found the nation of Britain?

No, that was the Scythians.

(Scythians... Saxons)

 

[ParkCungHee]

No, that was the Scythians.

(Scythians... Saxons)

The Saxons came later.
First were the British, named after Brutus.

 

[Virote_Considon]

Well, where does Atlantis fall into all of this?

 

[LightSpectra]

6. Strategic and Tactical importance of Troy during the days of first world war. If Britain invade Ottoman Empire through the ruins of the legendary city. what could be the possible results of 'secold Trojan War'?

Uh. You know that Troy, even during its "glory" period, is nothing but a tiny hill fort by modern standards?

 

[aelf]

9. Did Zheng He found the ancient city of Troy?

 

[Lone Wolf]

2. were they ancestor to Turks?

I hope you are joking, but doubt you are.

It was a popular idea back in the days. Some even used it to justify the Turkish conquest of Constantinople. As Laonikos Chalkokondyles, the Byzantine historian, put it:

It seemed that this misfortune was the greatest of all on Earth. The sufferings it caused were similar to the sufferings of Troy. It seemed that the Hellenes' death at barbarian hands was a punishment for Troy. And thus, the Romans [Western Europeans] thought that the Hellenes received their retribution for Troy, which they had destroyed in the ancient times.

 

[Masada]

10. Are Malayo-Polynesians refugees from Troy?

 

[NovaKart]

It was a popular idea back in the days. Some even used it to justify the Turkish conquest of Constantinople. As Laonikos Chalkokondyles, the Byzantine historian, put it:

Judging from the quote you mentioned, it sounds more like viewing it in an East vs. West way and not that they literally believed the Turks were the descendants of the Trojans.

 

[Louis XXIV]

Troy was located at a good strategic location for trade. It's been attacked many times over generations. It declined in significance, probably because of silt deposits essentially moved them from the coast and ruined the strategic advantage. Although, they had long since been surpassed by others (Ilium apparently existed even during the time of Constantine, since he considered founding his new Rome on Ancient Troy, but it certainly wasn't a power remotely comparable to what was described in the Iliad).

I personally don't think they're Greek, but I don't know enough about them to know for sure. In that time period, Asia Minor is associated with the Hittites.

 

[Dachs]

Well, where does Atlantis fall into all of this?

For somebody who lives in Wales, you're awfully unfamiliar with Geoffrey of Monmouth.

 

[Traitorfish]

No, that was the Scythians.

(Scythians... Saxons)

It's spelled "Sassenachs".

 

[Dachs]

Also, Arthur was totally Sarmatian, not Skythian.

 

[Lord Baal]

It is now accepted that the fabled city of Troy do exists. and it's located in Turkey. but what about trojans?
1. Who are they? what differentiate them from their rival Greeks? how should they looks like? (european OR middle easterners)
2. were they ancestor to Turks?
3. What happened to Troy during the day of Ottoman empire? do they preserve the city? raze it? or just leave it as ruins?
4. What should Trojan archetechture looks like? does it looks like greek? Egypt? or Mesopotamia?
5. Renaissance illustrations of trojan wars please (one with Italian pikemen fighting each other and the Troy itself is represented as a typical european city), how do christian europeans depiches the 'outlawed' gods of Olympus?
6. Strategic and Tactical importance of Troy during the days of first world war. If Britain invade Ottoman Empire through the ruins of the legendary city. what could be the possible results of 'secold Trojan War'?

=^.^=

1. They were likely just a colony of Ionian Greeks living in Asia Minor. They'd look like Greeks.

2. Dear god no. Are you serious? The Turks were nomads who migrated to modern-day Turkey from Central Asia. Like I said, the Troians were likely simply a group of Greeks. They were also only a small city-state, so their genes would have very little impact on whoever moved into the area.

3. Nothing. There have been cities on the site of Troy since before the Trojan War. After it was sacked by the Greeks (circa. 1200 B.C.) several new cities were rebuilt on the spot, most notably by the Romans. By the time of the Ottoman Empire the city had lost all importance for the reasons listed above, mostly that a silted-up harbour is pretty useless for trade. That's why the city was eventually abandoned.

4. Simple Bronze Age architecture.

5. I don't know of any. I'd suggest Google.

6. Why would the Allies launch an invasion in a strategically unimportant hill? The only reason anyone would want to control Troy is for the prestige of having one of the oldest cities in the world under their control - which might matter for the Greeks in their later war with the Turks, but not for most others - and the city hadn't even been rediscovered by WWI. Even at its height, as LS said above, it was barely more than a hill-fort. Even Thucydides pointed out that it would be incredibly unimportant at the time he was writing, 800 years ofter the War, and he was writing 2400 years ago. The ruins of Troy have no strategic or tactical importance whatsoever.

 

[aelf]

6. Strategic and Tactical importance of Troy during the days of first world war. If Britain invade Ottoman Empire through the ruins of the legendary city. what could be the possible results of 'secold Trojan War'?

Actually, crazy as it may sound, I have an answer to this one. If British troops had made a landing and charged up the hill, they would certainly have encountered the cyclopean walls of Troy, which the artillery of that time would presumably have no difficulty tearing down - assuming the British brought artillery along. Then maybe there would have been some street fighting against the Ottoman defenders, but nothing the British would not have been prepared for.

The trouble is the pyramid. The British could simply leave it alone. But do you think they would? No, of course they wouldn't. They would have forced an entry to try and find a hidden cache of weapons (or treasure) that the desert Fremen could use in their resistance efforts, but instead they would have unleashed an ancient and unspeakable force. Unidentified flying objects would have easily dealt with the Spitfires and the British would have quickly found themselves in an untenable position - if they weren't sucked into a black hole of oblivion to begin with.

Seriously, the Second Trojan War would not simply have been the second of anything. It would have been the beginning of a series of catastrophic wars against unknown forces. It would have been the beginning of the end.

 

[Lord Baal]

Actually, crazy as it may sound, I have an answer to this one. If British troops had made a landing and charged up the hill, they would certainly have encountered the cyclopean walls of Troy, which the artillery of that time would presumably have no difficulty tearing down - assuming the British brought artillery along. Then maybe there would have been some street fighting against the Ottoman defenders, but nothing the British would not have been prepared for.

The trouble is the pyramid. The British could simply leave it alone. But do you think they would? No, of course they wouldn't. They would have forced an entry to try and find a hidden cache of weapons (or treasure) that the desert Fremen could use in their resistance efforts, but instead they would have unleashed an ancient and unspeakable force. Unidentified flying objects would have easily dealt with the Spitfires and the British would have quickly found themselves in an untenable position - if they weren't sucked into a black hole of oblivion to begin with.

Seriously, the Second Trojan War would not simply have been the second of anything. It would have been the beginning of a series of catastrophic wars against unknown forces. It would have been the beginning of the end.

I think this may be better than my "Napoleon as an ostrich" post. You win the interwebs.