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Where is Poland?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by NickyJ, Jul 4, 2012.

?

Where is Poland?

  1. Eastern Europe.

    59.5%
  2. Central Europe.

    24.8%
  3. I'm gonna relocate it to your mouth if you start another stupid poll!

    15.7%
  1. warpus

    warpus In pork I trust

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    It is silly to say that the war didn't end, but not really to say that the struggle didn't end, which is the national sentiment that was maybe incorrectly described by Domen (I'm not sure, I haven't been following)

    It's said in the context of everyone in the west celebrating the end of the war and the freeing of cities and entire societies, without an acknowledgement of those of us still under foreign domination. That's where that sentiment comes from.
     
  2. AdamCrock

    AdamCrock Master of Darkness

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    I do not agree here - You are either free of not - You cannot be half-free ;) And we cannot allow ourselves to think this way - because if we do the tyrants have won already and we are all their slaves.
    Also in my opinion freedom does not depend on political system of government but on the rights that system gives to its people. So in my opinion being democracy or not does not matters - Civil rights, the labor and economics system is what matters. So I would accept any system as being free as long as it gives me my civil rights - including the right to say what I want to whoever I want, does not discriminate anyone which happens to have a different religion or a different race, and ability to make my own choices in life and call it freedom. If some of it is not satisfied I would call it illusion of freedom , which we cannot allow.
     
  3. Traitorfish

    Traitorfish The Tighnahulish Kid

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    I don't disagree. But it's generally understood that "freedom", in this sort of general usage, describes an effective liberal democracy, in which their exists effective political accountability, strong civil rights, and effective free press, etc. What an optimist might call "the freedom to win freedom". These things didn't exist in Poland between 1926 and 1939, so it would commonly be regarded as unfree.

    We tend not to talk about societies as simple as the San in terms of "democracy" because we prefer to thing of them as existing in some pre-historic state of savagery. However, if you read about more complex egalitarian societies, to whom authoritarian alternatives were clearly known, you'll tend to find the idea cropping up more and more often, to the point that in certain heavily-romanticised cases, such as the early cossacks or the Iroquois Confederacy, it's practically a cliché. Whatever democratic and egalitarian characteristics these societies wasn't based on any abstract theory, of which they had little, but on the absence of asymmetries of power great enough to support undemocratic or unaccountable authority. For them, "no man may hold another" was as much a statement of fact as one of principle.

    I think that any such nostalgia is for being taken seriously as a world power, rather than for the empire in particular. Orthodox and neo-Tsarist nationalists tend to distrust Putin as much as the Communists do, even if they may be more willing to work with him for pragmatic reasons. Most Russians to whom such sentiments appeal to them aren't all that picky about the details of the flag.

    Fair enough. I'm ready to accept that Pilduski's mixture of presidentialism and strongmanism was a unique one, and that the state of the Polish Republic immediately prior to the German invasion did not reflect the entire history of the Pilsudskite regime.
     
  4. Domen

    Domen Misico dux Vandalorum

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    So there is no difference between the status of a slave in Ancient Sparta and of a citizen in modern Russia ??? :)
     
  5. AdamCrock

    AdamCrock Master of Darkness

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    There is a difference - the citizens of modern Russia at least got their illusion of freedom ;)
     
  6. Domen

    Domen Misico dux Vandalorum

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  7. warpus

    warpus In pork I trust

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    There are varying shades of freedom. The state could for example limit your freedom of expression of religion while allowing you full freedom of expression or freedom of travel.
     
  8. AdamCrock

    AdamCrock Master of Darkness

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    Somehow I just don't have this feeling that this is my : "Give me liberty or give me death" feeling ;)
     
  9. AdamCrock

    AdamCrock Master of Darkness

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  10. warpus

    warpus In pork I trust

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    I spent father's day drinking vodka, beers, and eating a really good outdoor meal with my dad, my mom, and a bunch of other Polish people. I do this sort of thing with a bunch of older Polish people every once in a while and it's always a blast. Everyone gets drunk, the food is amazing, the conversation stimulating, there are a lot of jokes, a lot of stories, and nobody ever throws up. I got my dad a bottle of Polish Belvedere Vodka for father's day and he really enjoyed that gift. I enjoyed it with him.

    There is just something .. very enjoyable about a social event like that. And I say that as an introvert. There was even a non-Polish guy there who married a Polish girl. His Polish was very impressive. He could understand almost everything being said. Every once in a while we'd switch over to English to include him more, because he couldn't say everything he wanted to in Polish. My brother in law is learning Polish too, and can understand a lot less, and say even less.. but in 10 years he'll be fluent ;)
     
  11. Domen

    Domen Misico dux Vandalorum

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  12. AdamCrock

    AdamCrock Master of Darkness

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    I have suspected it to be a laugh but it was pretty amazing edit of that old movie ^^ :)

    @warpus - way to go ! That suonds like a perfect celebration in true polish style ^^ :) :beer: btw. Your brother in law - He will catch on in polish pretty quick I'm sure, You just need to drink more vodka with Him ;) (I bet he learned all the swears like "huj", "kurwa" etc. at first :D ;) )
     
  13. warpus

    warpus In pork I trust

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    Actually, he's been learning stuff more like "Can you please direct me to the national museum?" and "Can I please have an uncarbonated water?" and "Can I please have a bun with cheese?"

    but he can also introduce himself in Polish, pick up on things, and.. he's slowly getting there.
     
  14. AdamCrock

    AdamCrock Master of Darkness

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    It's okay , just warn him about the swears so no one can take advantage of him not knowing this words and he would not repeat it when talking with someone important etc. ;) and drink more vodka xD , it's always in a good tone :D
     
  15. Aleksey_aka_al

    Aleksey_aka_al Smiley

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    Talking of illusions, people who have not lived through Russian 90's know nothing of freedom.
     
  16. Mise

    Mise isle of lucy

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    Just FYI, I've decided to demote Greece into Eastern Europe, and promote Poland into Central Europe :)

    Czech Rep is still Eastern Europe though, don't worry. Nothing's changed there.
     
  17. AdamCrock

    AdamCrock Master of Darkness

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    Hi ! :) How's Russia these days ?
     
  18. really

    really Chieftain

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    I'm going to Poland next week.

    I better brush up on my Polish.
     
  19. Mechanicalsalvation

    Mechanicalsalvation -

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    Thanks man, it would really worry me to get promoted while Czechs arent obviously ready yet. It could do so much harm....
    Meanwhile I just wait to see Britain get promoted to orthodox caliphate.
     
  20. Domen

    Domen Misico dux Vandalorum

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