Would the GOP types push the USA into default ?

[Hygro]

Moreover, before anyone gets all upset, remember that WE (voting Americans) put both houses in office.
They are only doing what we charged them to.
Maybe not what you or me in particular wanted them to, but as a bloc, they are responding to the collective wishes of the voters.

It is not the representative’s fault that their bosses are schizoid.

This is true. But we can't say it's a completely legitimate system--uneven population representation, gerrymandered districts, and waaay too much private money in the game throwing everything off balance. But this is our government and these are our legislators.

 

[bugwar]

How would you characterize it then?

How would you describe a minority of government threatening to cause economic damage unless it gets its way on an unrelated, duly passed by the House budget just for a six-week continuing resolution, as something other than a hostage situation?

This is how this is playing out:

Obamacrats: "that's a nice government and economy you got there, it'd be a shame if something happened to it, so give us what we want on Obama care"

Republicans: "no, you can't blackmail us"

Obamacrats: "why aren't you doing my bidding?”

 

[bugwar]

This is true. But we can't say it's a completely legitimate system--uneven population representation, gerrymandered districts, and waaay too much private money in the game throwing everything off balance. But this is our government and these are our legislators.

And for the best part:

"Democracy is the absolute WORST form of government, save for all the others tried."

 

[DemonicAppleGuY]

You realize the Democrats control the majority of the government right?

 

[KMRblue1027]

D. Boehner has the balls to risk his job to save his country. Is this a safe assumption to make?

I think Boehner's smart enough to realize than he cannot be the face of the first default in US Federal history. He'll call of vote on the 16th but my biggest worry is a teahard will filibuster until past mid-night.

 

[bugwar]

You realize the Democrats control the majority of the government right?

Um...

Obamacrats
President
1

Senate
52

House
200
Total 253

TeaParty
Senate
46

House
232

Total 278

 

[DemonicAppleGuY]

Um...

Obamacrats
President
1

Senate
52

House
200
Total 253

TeaParty
Senate
46

House
232

Total 278

Except numbers alone mean nothing because not all congressmen are equal.

If we assume one in the senate is worth four point three-five in the house then the totals we get are 497.2 and 432.1.

And that's not even counting the President. Whom you seem to be somehow be equating with every other congressmen in power.

 

[JollyRoger]

A clean bill would pass the House and Senate and be signed by the President. The hostage takers are the ones with the power to put it to a vote in the House who are refusing by do so.

The Tea Party is a minority of the Republicans, so the math needs to be a bit redone.

 

[DemonicAppleGuY]

If I was more inclined I'd do that. Any recalculation would still leave the democrats with a majority though.

 

[Antilogic]

Actually, they can hold the country hostage. Though I wouldn't characterize it as that. All appropriations bills are supposed to start in the House. They are just fulfilling their Constitutional responsibility. That the Senate and Presidency are not singing to their tune is another matter entirely.

Here, I think we gotta draw a line between the budget negotiations and a debt default. Budgets for upcoming years are up for debate, while defaulting on what is already passed should not be by any sane individual.

I think Boehner's smart enough to realize than he cannot be the face of the first default in US Federal history. He'll call of vote on the 16th but my biggest worry is a teahard will filibuster until past mid-night.

Fortunately, there is no such thing as a filibuster in the House. You can yell and scream all you want, but when a vote is scheduled, the vote is scheduled.

The Senate, on the other hand... at least 5 Republicans will have to vote for cloture along with the Dems, otherwise a talking filibuster is possible.

 

[Gucumatz]

And for the best part:

"Democracy is the absolute WORST form of government, save for all the others tried."

Random side point - Socrates and Plato considered Democracy the 2nd worst government possible, largely because they expected demagoguery and division on polar opposites that would render a Democracy ineffective. They considered people who believed in Democracy foolish and that the only worse form of government would be an all out tyranny/dictatorship. For the record - their pick for world's best form of government was an aristocracy .

We should never have allowed the reforms and transparency done to Congress in the last 30 years. Grease keeps the system rolling, when people attack Pork spending, earmarks, politicians having social events with each other, back-room dealing, etc. all it serves to do is allow for this polarization to happen. Its why the founding fathers envisioned a Representative Democracy - anyone can understand partisanship only breeds situations like the Tea Party terrorists. We need more backroom dealing, hypocrisy, and pork in Congress. Not less.

 

[Hygro]

Aristotle's aristocracy had the potential to be pretty universal though. It just required, oh I dunno, universal healthcare.

 

[Mr. Dictator]

Why don't the moderate republicans do more to speak out against their extremist brothers?

 

[sophie]

Why don't the moderate republicans do more to speak out against their extremist brothers?

Because that's political suicide.

 

[Lord Baal]

What they don't realize is that harming the fascists really only makes them stronger.

That depends on how badly you harm them.

 

[bugwar]

Because that's political suicide.

What!?

How dare they fear the wrath of the voters who elected them.

 

[Leoreth]

That's exactly what Owen said.

Clearly moderate Republicans are too afraid of their own voters to do what they think is right.

 

[bugwar]

That's exactly what Owen said.

Clearly moderate Republicans are too afraid of their own voters to do what they think is right.

Ah!
So the represenatives should do what YOU think is right, and not what the people who elected them think is right.

Interesting thought pattern you have there.
Of course, with your ability to read the minds of congressmen, that goes without saying.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

How would you describe a minority of government threatening to cause economic damage

Republicans from the moment they lost the election

This is how this is playing out:

Obamacrats: "that's a nice government and economy you got there, it'd be a shame if something happened to it, so give us what we want on Obama care"

Republicans: "no, you can't blackmail us"

Obamacrats: "why aren't you doing my bidding?”

Are you for real?

It's one thing to see the hilariously moronic damage control from the republicans.

It's quite another to see it swallowed hook, line and sinker.

Why don't the moderate republicans do more to speak out against their extremist brothers?

They do, but the extremists' shouting tends to drown it out.

 

[Leoreth]

Ah!
So the represenatives should do what YOU think is right, and not what the people who elected them think is right.

They should do neither. They have been elected to do what they think is right*. That's the point of a representative democracy.

* for the country, I might have to clarify. Not for their re-election.