YOU'RE FIRED!

[civver_764]

The definition of jingoism is (according to google):

"extreme patriotism, especially in the form of aggressive or warlike foreign policy."

I don't think respecting the national anthem falls under that definition, but we can agree to disagree. What really matters is what the NFL fans think, and I think more will agree with me than with you.

 

[stinkubus]

Only in USA #1 can 19th century war propaganda become a hallowed hymn.

 

[Evie]

Standing up to salute the flag/anthem is not jingoistic, nor bad in and of itself. Patriots can certainly do it (like firefighters can wear their uniforms), and many often do (see, again, firefighters), but that's the extent of the link between patriotism and the gesture.

Insisting it must be done, that those who do not do so are anti-patriot, disrespecting the country, etc, etc - that's over-aggressive (not warlike, but close enough) nationalism and in that sense, both bad and rather jingoistic.

You don't yell at people trying to douse a fire for not wearing their uniforms - unless, of course, you think they should let the fire burn.

 

[Zelig]

Also pretty sure you're gonna be hard-pressed to find a country where black people are better off than the United States.

I actually had a really easy time finding such a country. I only had to look up stats for a single one. Presumably people could find more with comparable ease if they tried.

Canada stats: http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/nhs-enm/...=0&Temporal=2013&THEME=98&VID=0&VNAMEE&VNAMEF
US stats: http://blackdemographics.com/households/african-american-income/

Despite median income in the US and Canada being fairly similar overall, even after adjusting for the currently weak CAD, a black person in Canada can expect to earn nearly 10% more than a black person in the US, before accounting for stronger social programs. And it's not like stats for blacks are very good in Canada, they're just really bad in the US.

 

[Dachs]

Only in USA #1 can 19th century war propaganda become a hallowed hymn.

Eh. France has a lock on 18th century war propaganda, though.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

Take it from a black man then:

 

[stinkubus]

Why should this one random person's opinion be taken as representative of the black community at large?

 

[civver_764]

I actually had a really easy time finding such a country. I only had to look up stats for a single one. Presumably people could find more with comparable ease if they tried.

Canada stats: http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/nhs-enm/...=0&Temporal=2013&THEME=98&VID=0&VNAMEE&VNAMEF
US stats: http://blackdemographics.com/households/african-american-income/

Despite median income in the US and Canada being fairly similar overall, even after adjusting for the currently weak CAD, a black person in Canada can expect to earn nearly 10% more than a black person in the US, before accounting for stronger social programs.

Congratulations, but 10% isn't really all that much. What do you think the best country for black people is?

And it's not like stats for blacks are very good in Canada, they're just really bad in the US.

Well if I had to guess they're even worse in Africa.

 

[Ajidica]

Only in USA #1 can 19th century war propaganda become a hallowed hymn.

Still a better anthem than the UK has. I mean, seriously? A funeral dirge imploring a non-specified deity to intervene on behalf of some inbred Germans? Pffft.
Sad thing is they have a much better anthem waiting in the wings with Jerusalem.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

Why should this one random person's opinion be taken as representative of the black community at large?

He makes some good points and gives perspective which wasnt mentioned in this thread so far. Plus he speaks about the problems of the black community his solution and finaly points out where the majority of reg. people who support the NFL stands. Pretty comprehensive and powerful message imo.

 

[stinkubus]

Congratulations, but 10% isn't really all that much. What do you think the best country for black people is?

Well if I had to guess they're even worse in Africa.

LOL a 10% difference in per capita income is huge. Let's take a wild guess as to which country's police shoot more black people: the US or Canada? What difference does it make if QoL in the African nations is worse? Stop shifting the goalposts.

 

[Zelig]

Congratulations, but 10% isn't really all that much. What do you think the best country for black people is?

Statistically, probably some Euro country with low % of black people. I doubt any country with overall comparable median income to the US has worse numbers for black people.

LOL a 10% difference in per capita income is huge. Let's take a wild guess as to which country's police shoot more black people: the US or Canada? What difference does it make if QoL in the African nations is worse? Stop shifting the goalposts.

To be fair, American cops shoot a lot of people in general.

 

[stinkubus]

They do, but there's plenty of research showing that blacks, specifically black men, are far more likely to be killed by police in the US then any other demographic, as measured by deaths per police contact.

 

[civver_764]

LOL a 10% difference in per capita income is huge. Let's take a wild guess as to which country's police shoot more black people: the US or Canada?

Which country has more violent crime, US or Canada?

What difference does it make if QoL in the African nations is worse? Stop shifting the goalposts.

I'm just saying, a little perspective never hurt anybody. United States might not be the best but it's near the top.

 

[Evie]

Even the best country has room for improvement. Let alone countries that aren,t the best.

 

[Oerdin]

Ratings are expected to be up this week

Of course, the season is starting. Before there was nothing to watch.

 

[Berzerker]

I can think of a million other ways to protest whatever they're trying to protest. Attacking the national anthem is specifically meant to provoke people and is the definition of unpatriotic. Their whole point was to create controversy and that's exactly what they got. The question is - will it end well for them? I don't think so. Alienating your fans isn't usually a smart move.

I saw an interview with a green beret, he was the reason Kaepernick was kneeling... Kaep was protesting the anthem back when Obama was Prez, but he did it by sitting on the bench. A team mate (Nate Boyer?) talked with him about it and suggested he kneel, thats what soldiers do at the graves of comrades. I guess its a symbolic gesture lamenting the fallen, but could include the flag/anthem (the ideals they embody).

You can think of a million ways, but can you think of a better way? I tried, couldn't come up with anything. Write my congressman? Nope. Write a letter to the editor? Eh... Seems like his little protest has ballooned into a national debate, cant argue with the results. Besides, if the system is mistreating people shouldn't people protest? He's making a sacrifice to create a better country, we need more people like him.

 

[Commodore]

Taking a knee during the national anthem is not one of them.

Taking a knee during the anthem is against NFL rules though. In the NFL rulebook it says all teams must play the anthem before each game and all players and coaches must be on the field and standing at attention silently facing the flag until the anthem is completed. Penalties for failing to comply with this rule include suspensions, fines, and loss of draft picks for teams.

So it seems to me that if Goodell were actually interested in doing his job instead of playing politics, the Steelers (since they were obviously the worst offenders) should be losing their draft picks and their entire team except Villanueva should be suspended and fined.

Ratings are expected to be up this week

Source? Because it sounds like you are just making this up, especially since the NFL's ratings have been down the entire season so far.

 

[Oerdin]

Kaepernick has always been a hack. He saw that his career was failing because he sucked so he tried to play political games in hopes that he could extend his failing career. That is all, there is no deeper meaning, he is a race baiting piece of crap who was angling to extend his own failed career and nothing else.

I wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire. He is just racist garbage and nothing else.

 

[Berzerker]

he pissed off owners to extend his career?