Western US (Old West) Map & Terrain

Not sure if I should be proud or ashamed of the fact that I've seen that movie more than once...

In an attempt to re-rail this topic, Balthazar, here are some ideas I have for resources, some may be more useful than others....

Buffalo\Bison
Fur\Beavers
Longhorns\cattle (Longhorns introduced by Spanish in 1493)
Copper
Iron
Coal
Saguaro\Cactus
Sagebrush
Coyote
Desert Tortoise
Snakes
Wild Horses (escaped domestic)
Mountain Lion
Bear
 
Not sure if I should be proud or ashamed of the fact that I've seen that movie more than once...

I have too, and that's one reason why I've posted the Map sans improvements - so that if someone wants to put together a mod like that, they can, and have my blessing.

In an attempt to re-rail this topic, Balthazar, here are some ideas I have for resources, some may be more useful than others....

I've already thought about adding some of those animals as units, so discussion of this topic requires that we discuss those first, I guess:

Buffalo\Bison - roam the plains when the game begins in huge numbers (I use the m-unit to make it seem like more), but have 0/0/0 stats so that they can be captured. (I'd like to add a unit: Buffalo Hunter which could have both Euro and Native equivalents, but since Bison are easily captured I'm having trouble justifying creating a special unit to catch them). They have as much monetary value as I can give them. Alas, they disappear very quickly. I need to develop some further use for these (and for Eagles) for the Native Civs - to them, they had both scientific and cultural value. Downside: the AI has been using them as scouts after capture.

Wild Horses (escaped domestic) - also a unit added to the mod in this manner: Wild Horses can, like the bison, be found roaming free, and although they have smaller numbers, their speed (movement 2) keeps them viable through the first era, at least. After capture, they can be brought to a settlement and upgraded to a horseman (costs 1 citizen), or traded (they are the tradeable unit), or disbanded for value. The Horseman's horse will have one extra movement, and another hit point. A Stables will auto-produce a horse every 10 turns (or so). Euro Civs with a Post Office will be able to build the Pony Express Small Wonder, (Tech: Mail) which would autpo-produce a valuable (200 cost) horseman with a 5 movement. The Trading Post should allow the Building of a Stagecoach Station which would produce a two horse Stagecoach every 20 turns (or so). The Wells Fargo Wonder (tech: Telegraph?) would auto-produce a four-horse Stagecoach every 30 turns (or so) which would be faster, more valuable.

Whales - I've already planned to stock the Pacific with capturable Whales (using the Megaladon, which looks in-game like a whale) which would have benefits similar to Bison.

Other animals might be better as units in the Nature Civ I think: Bison, Horses, Wolves, Bears, Eagles, Deer, Cougars, Whales, Sharks, all auto-produced, so that the Nature Civ can't direct it. As I've noted, some will also be domesticated, and built by other civs. At the start of the game, I'm thinking of preplacing some of these around as barbarian units, though I have to be careful to restrict these to either immobile units or no-stats units. I'd like to place immobile "invisible" barbarian snakes, scorpions, and Alligators (in swamps) about as hazards. I also like the idea of a barbarian Buzzard, and there is a unit for that available.

But we were discussing resources:

Fur\Beavers - Yes, a valuable resource. Especially to our Northwestern Civ, the Oregonians, and to Native tribes such as the Blackfoot, the Nez Perce, and the Haida. I imagine these civs would be able to build more vigorous Trading Posts with access to Furs. Other resources I've thought of for the Northwestern Civs include Lumber/Hardwood Trees, Salmon, and Lake Trout.

Longhorns\Cattle - could be a resource (Plains) or a unit (but we have no Longhorn Steer unit yet). I would only place the resource on plains tiles near rivers, I'd think. It should be rare, but allow the building of a Cattle Ranch. We might give +14 Euro cities a Small Wonder called Slaughterhouse, which would significantly increase the value of Cattle and Steer Ranches. A Textile Mill might add value to a Sheep Farm. We could use Tony Boscia's trick for these types of buildings: a Euro Civ could build a pig farm, a Sheep farm, or a Cattle Ranch. These were, arguably, the "power plants" of the old west, and each could supercede the other, i.e., you can only build one, but a Cattle Ranch would be more expensive and produce new product less often than, say, a pig farm which has it's own problem: it has one corruption, due to the stink. Postscript: I suppose the list of "power" buildings ought to include a regular Farm (which would add +1 food to irrigated tiles). Eventually these could auto-produce new (as yet unavailable) units: a Pig, a Longhorn Steer, a Guernsey or Angus Cow, a Horse without a blanket. We already have sheep.

Other animals that might make good resources include: salmon, prairie dogs, mountain goats, and seals, because they would have no use as units. We might include resources such as Cave, Eagle's nest, and Salt Lick to limit where the Nature Civ can produce certain units.

Then there are the "Mineral" Resources you mention:

Copper - could allow Telegraph
Iron -
could allow Blacksmith, among other things
Coal - could allow Steam Engine, Coal heating, and Iron Works

I can see uses for all of that. I would also include:

Gold
Fool's Gold
Silver
Turquoise

Because this mod will be called Goldrush! We must also have Gold, and Silver with impressive uses: improvements such as Claims Office, Goldsmith and Silversmith, and Wonders such as Goldstrike! and Boom Town (producing Golden Ages?). The Navaho and Ute might combine Silversmithing and a Turquoise resource to make a Turquoise Jewelry improvement. I could imagine a unit called Claim Jumper which would be like a cowboy with a "build colony" ability. The 'Fool's Gold' is a mcguffin for the AI to chase, but the icon should look just like gold. It would have no useful effect.

You also mention:

Sagebrush
Desert Tortoise

The trick is thinking of a practical use for them.

Some natural resources that I think might have practical use:

Saguaro Cactus - which you mentioned. Okay, no use that I can think of, but I like it because I'm already using it to augment the landscape..
Lake - definitely using this. Considering waterhole and poisoned waterhole.
Hardwood trees - mentioned above, could allow Sawmill, Lumberjack.
Redwoods - already a terrain type, could allow Californians to build lawn furniture.
Peyote Cactus - allows Peyote Religion to the Utes, Navaho, Apache, and Commanche, and enables the Ghost Dance Wonder.
Hemp - used to make Rope, among other things.
Agave - Tequila, anyone?
Apple Trees - would appear in Northwest following Johnny Appleseed.
Orange Trees - found in California.
Oil - should appear late in the fourth era.
Waterfall - both a bonus resource and Unit, will be used to improve the scenery. I'd like to have more resources like this, particularly an Old Faithful geyser for Yellowstone.
Grapes - the Missions brought the Vitis vinifera (Mission Grapes), so a Mission resource would logically allow a Winery. But wineries only flourish where the weather is optimal, so these will mainly be found in the hills north and east of San Francisco on this map.

That reminds me of another last category of resource: Pre-existing structures, specifically Missions, which were largely already built by the time the settlement of the west began in earnest. Unsure how to handle it, particularly in Mexico; should make the building of a religious place (i.e.,church) unnecessary, but a Mission Building could do handy things, like auto-produce a missionary every 50 turns or so.

And there are two non-appearing strategic Resources: Native Culture and Euro Culture, which I created to keep our modding options open.

I've put all of these possible resources in bold lettering, and count 33 resources including 25 strategic/luxury resources and 8 bonus resources (in purple) in this list. What d'ya think?
 
@Balthasar - have you thought about using tom2050s 'trick' of using barbarian camps to produce your capturable buffalo, horse or even beaver units? That way they'd last longer and have to be actively hunted down - perhaps your hunter unit could just be a 1.0.2 unit that can scout and capture buffalo/horses.

Thinking about another thread (the billboard/TV one) Animals could be resources represented on the map by a preplaced unit that can't be destroyed (I'm thinking more of the 0.0 hidden nationality unit rather than one placed on impassable terrain). It's simply eye candy but it would be nice to see "animated resources". I wonder though if you can still "build a road on the resource" - I'm thinking you could because these units will share the same tile as your own unit when you move "on top" of them.
 
I love every word of it. If you're missing a particular animal unit, I can give it a shot.

Well, Dark Sheer's horse moves oddly and has a horse blanket, which makes it an unsatisfactory wild horse; Tom2050's Bison is actually a water buffalo, not an American Bison, and we have several Eagles, but no North American Bald Eagle.

@Balthasar - have you thought about using tom2050s 'trick' of using barbarian camps to produce your capturable buffalo, horse or even beaver units? That way they'd last longer and have to be actively hunted down - perhaps your hunter unit could just be a 1.0.2 unit that can scout and capture buffalo/horses.

I'm still unsure how that trick works. Right now, the Barbarian camps produce savage natives that provide a lot of action early in the game. They upgrade (too soon) to mounted units. What I don't and wouldn't want to see are stacked Buffalo, beavers and Braves. I'd like the Era 2 and later barbarians to be "outlaws" rather than hostile natives. I definitely need to learn more about Tom's trick, though.

Thinking about another thread (the billboard/TV one) Animals could be resources represented on the map by a preplaced unit that can't be destroyed (I'm thinking more of the 0.0 hidden nationality unit rather than one placed on impassable terrain). It's simply eye candy but it would be nice to see "animated resources". I wonder though if you can still "build a road on the resource" - I'm thinking you could because these units will share the same tile as your own unit when you move "on top" of them.

Good idea. I'm already using the animated waterfall. Animated beavers, "jumping" fish, shimmering lakes, and definitely Prairie Dogs would be fun. I'm not sure whether to allow deer to roam or not. They might be better off confined to certain terrains. I love animated resources, particularly in City Terrains, which can look rather lifeless when nothing moves.

Have to be careful not to go overboard with animated terrain, though. My current Old West file is 250 MB right now, and I've added units only up to the 2nd era. The Steampunk Mod is over 500MB. Tony Boscia's mod is, like, a Gigabyte! Someday, when a GB is no more important than a MB is to us, we can have completely animated terrain for C3C, including animated trees, using that trick.
 
Thinking about another thread (the billboard/TV one) Animals could be resources represented on the map by a preplaced unit that can't be destroyed (I'm thinking more of the 0.0 hidden nationality unit rather than one placed on impassable terrain). It's simply eye candy but it would be nice to see "animated resources". I wonder though if you can still "build a road on the resource" - I'm thinking you could because these units will share the same tile as your own unit when you move "on top" of them.

Why not make them the barbarian and immobile equivalent of the EfZI balloon ?
 
Great post Balthazar. Sagebrush and tortoise are admittedly borderline useless, but like the saguaro could make decent minor bonus resources (+1 to gold?) that add to the look of the terrain. Love the animal units idea.
 
Not sure what you mean...

The Survivor Balloon couldn't be attacked and other Civilization units could share the same spot with it. I haven't played myself with this concept but perhaps the same settings, minus the movement, could be used to have an unit acting as an animated overlay for one spot in the map.
 
Fur\Beavers - Yes, a valuable resource. Especially to our Northwestern Civ, the Oregonians, and to Native tribes such as the Blackfoot, the Nez Perce, and the Haida. I imagine these civs would be able to build more vigorous Trading Posts with access to Furs. Other resources I've thought of for the Northwestern Civs include Lumber/Hardwood Trees, Salmon, and Lake Trout.

The Haida had seals and sea otters. There were very few beaver in the coastal areas of what is now British Columbia and the Alaskan Panhandle because of the very steep mountainous terrain and massive trees. The Lake Trout is restricted to the Great Lakes only, and is not found in the Pacific Northwest.

Apple Trees - would appear in Northwest following Johnny Appleseed.
The Northwest Territory that Johnny Appleseed wandered through was the OLD Northwest Territory, now comprising the states of Indiana, Michigan, Illinois, Wisconsin, and Minnesota. It was NORTHWEST of the original colonies. I am not sure if Johnny Appleseed was ever west of the Mississippi River.

prairie dogs/QUOTE]
Prairie Dogs were, and still are, viewed as"vermin" and exterminated whenever possible. They were and are viewed as competing with cattle for the available grass, and their holes resulted in numerous cattle and horses breaking their legs and thereby needing to be destroyed. You could use them as a nuisance, occupying the grassland and preventing any other resource from being located there, with no benefits whatsoever.

The two principal whale types located along the Pacific Coast were the Humpback and the Gray Whale, with the Gray Whales migrating along the coast going from the Gulf of California to the Bering Sea and back. The limit to sharks along the coast is about level with San Francisco, as the water is too cold for the Great White and other sharks further north. You do have Abalone and Kelp as additional sea resources.

You also have the Ponderosa Pine, a valuable lumber timber, the Pinyon Pine, source of the valuable Pinyon Nut food resource, and the Camus plant, a highly edible tuber found in the Great Basin and more common further north in what is now Idaho, eastern Oregon, and eastern Washington.
 
Another resource that you could use along the Pacific Coast would be the Eulachon, a very oily fish that also is called "candlefish" or "hooligan". The Eulachon is sufficiently oily that when dried, it can be used as a candle. Aside from being a significant food resource, the oil was also a valuable trade item and used for a variety of things. As the Eulachon is in the Smelt family, it is found in large quantities during spawning run.
 
Thanks for the announcement, I don't know how I missed this map. It's very beautiful, I think Goldrush's gonna be great.
 
Have to be careful not to go overboard with animated terrain, though. My current Old West file is 250 MB right now, and I've added units only up to the 2nd era. The Steampunk Mod is over 500MB. Tony Boscia's mod is, like, a Gigabyte! Someday, when a GB is no more important than a MB is to us, we can have completely animated terrain for C3C, including animated trees, using that trick.

You can actually have tons of animated visuals and use relatively little space. CoMM3 scenarios that I started back in late 2008 use lots of eye candy objects scattered around the maps, but they only need a default and fidget animation, and can usually be quite small in size. Of the hundreds there are (they were released in that pack of 200+) they aren't over 40 or 50MB unpacked IIRC.
 
You can actually have tons of animated visuals and use relatively little space. CoMM3 scenarios that I started back in late 2008 use lots of eye candy objects scattered around the maps, but they only need a default and fidget animation, and can usually be quite small in size. Of the hundreds there are (they were released in that pack of 200+) they aren't over 40 or 50MB unpacked IIRC.

Jesus, Tom, I must have been unconscious when you released that pack, because I swear I never saw it before. Absolutely, some of the units in that pack must be used! I posted a little graphic of the ones that I think would fit an Old West Mod particularly well at the other Old West Mod thread...
 

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