9/11 Cross 2: The Crux of the Matter

[FriendlyFire]

Yes, I can see how seeing a cross is the equivalent of having a religion forced down your throat. OH NOES, A COW! DAMN THOSE HINDUS FORCING THEIR RELIGION DOWN MY THROAT!!

Hindus think the cow is sacred thus would not be forcing delicious beef down anyones throat. Your thinking of that sacred religion MacDonalds.

 

[bhsup]

Golden calf... Golden arches...

 

[illram]

I have paid zero attention to this. My comment might be hilariously uninformed since I have read exactly zero on this topic other than the OP and maybe 1 minute of googling this organization. With that said, I have this to say: the exuberance with which some atheist advocates and other outspoken supporters pursue their cause hurts the secular cause in general by making atheists look like, to put it simply, huge dickheads.

Secularism is very important. Government sanctioned religious symbolism should absolutely be viewed with suspicion. It should be used with the utmost caution and care to remain inclusive of all faiths. The default should usually be "don't do it." I sort of agree that here, the beam should probably not be installed on this government land. With that said, the push back should always be respectful. There is a difference between advocating for secularism and just advocating against religion. E.g., this is not helping, guys. Stuff like that detracts from this group's (and other Atheist groups) very valid goal of maintaining a separation of church and state both literally and symbolically. I think it goes too far, however, when the advocacy turns against religion in general. The battles should be picked carefully.

That is all.

 

[Berzerker]

privately funded religious symbols on state land do not violate the establishment clause

a law telling me to respect or worship them does

or a law telling children to pledge their allegiance to a flag and the deity it represents

 

[illram]

privately funded religious symbols on state land do not violate the establishment clause

a law telling me to respect or worship them does

or a law telling children to pledge their allegiance to a flag and the deity it represents

Link to video.

 

[Formaldehyde]

I have paid zero attention to this. My comment might be hilariously uninformed since I have read exactly zero on this topic other than the OP and maybe 1 minute of googling this organization. With that said, I have this to say: the exuberance with which some atheist advocates and other outspoken supporters pursue their cause hurts the secular cause in general by making atheists look like, to put it simply, huge dickheads.

Secularism is very important. Government sanctioned religious symbolism should absolutely be viewed with suspicion. It should be used with the utmost caution and care to remain inclusive of all faiths. The default should usually be "don't do it." I sort of agree that here, the beam should probably not be installed on this government land. With that said, the push back should always be respectful. There is a difference between advocating for secularism and just advocating against religion. E.g., this is not helping, guys. Stuff like that detracts from this group's (and other Atheist groups) very valid goal of maintaining a separation of church and state both literally and symbolically. I think it goes too far, however, when the advocacy turns against religion in general. The battles should be picked carefully.

That is all.

While I may not agree with all the methods used by the AA it is certainly their right to do so, jsut as it is the right for religious organizations to post their own similar billboards proselytizing their religion. Who knows? Perhaps it does get at least a few children of Muslims and Christians to see that they don't have to believe merely because their parents did. That they have a choice.

Somewhat related:

American Atheists leader wins fight for ‘ATHE1ST’ license plate

(RNS) Every state’s department of motor vehicles routinely rejects applications for vanity license plates that are deemed offensive or in poor taste, but officials in New Jersey apparently didn’t have the stomach for a high-volume fight over an application for an “ATHE1ST” plate.

New Jersey’s Motor Vehicle Commission initially rejected the application from David Silverman, president of the Cranford, N.J.-based American Atheists, as “objectionable.”

When Silverman called the MVC to lodge a complaint, he was told the word is “offensive.” A legal defense fund was set up and Silverman readied for battle, but on Wednesday (Aug. 28), Silverman was told he could have the plate.

“‘Atheist’ is not an offensive or objectionable word anymore than the word ‘Jew’ or ‘Christian’ or ‘man’ or ‘woman’ is,” Silverman said.

“It is a common noun, it is in the dictionary and it is not only allowed in multiple other states, the word is used on dog tags for the U.S. government. It is who and what I am.”

MVC officials, who declined to comment, cited a “clerical error,” according to Silverman.

New Jersey maintains a list of 1,085 words (or variations of them) that are banned from vanity plates, and any plate can be rejected at the discretion of department employees. While BOOBIES and KKK are included on the list, ATHEIST – in any form – is not.

In fact, New Jersey has issued an “ATHEIST” plate before. The retired plate is hanging on the wall in Silverman’s office, sent in by a supporter years ago. And the state approved Silverman’s previous vanity plate, “BLASFMR.” Minnesota, Alabama and Florida, among others, have all issued “ATHEIST” plates.

Religion-themed vanity plates frequently get the nod from state officials. Georgia has approved “GOD4EVR” and “44JESUS,” while people in Vermont are driving around behind “PSALM48” and “JN36TN.” The last is a reference to a Bible verse, and the owner of the plate won the right to bear it in a federal appeals court after it was rejected by local officials.

 

[Leoreth]

or a law telling children to pledge their allegiance to a flag and the deity it represents

Which deity does the American flag represent?

 

[warpus]

the word is used on dog tags for the U.S. government

Wait, what? The word "atheist" is used on dog tags?

Of course all dogs are by default atheist, but.. what the?

 

[Formaldehyde]

I guess we should really call them human tags:

Because when you are mortally wounded or dying it's important to know to keep priests away?

 

[warpus]

Wait, American soldiers wear tags named "dog tags" that specify their belief systems? And there's no dogs involved?

Okay, I'm confused, but don't have time to think about this for more than 20 seconds.

 

[Berzerker]

Which deity does the American flag represent?

I suspect the biblical "one", but you can ask Congress for clarification - its their deity