Adventures of the Vietnamese (III)

[12tn2]

Interesting read so far.

Tks

I would advise you to take advantage of your 152 gold and found a 2nd city at the mouth of the penninsula, so the Russians dont trap you in with their second city. You might also have access to Copper up there for Axemen.

Yes that's exactly what we're planning to do. But for the copper, no chance As I stated in some post before, there's no copper in the vicinity of our territory (sigh)

Destroy Peter, his vanilla colour did not fit at all.

If we can However, their capital is really a stronghold with hill and river. Now we don't have the means to do that yet.
Ok now let's take a look at the starting position of the Chinese:

Wow... it's really a good one, to be honest. At least four floodplains (and they're using two of them), access to the sea, happiness resource, hills and forests, blah blah... Better than ours, that's for sure And that's not to mention a cow spot just north of them, however, Mao will have to compete for it with Tokugawa. Hope they'll war with each other, otherwise we'll have a tough time catching them in score
Now to another issue. Like I have said in the last match, in this new adventure the Vietnamese will also try something completely new to them. Now it's time to reveal what it is and Le Loi's plan around it. Well, that's something too familiar with you, but not with us. Er... it's the Specialist economy Actually, this is the very first time I try this type of economy for my empire. The reason why I choose Le Loi to be the pioneer in exploring this powerful yet difficult SE is his traits: Philosophical and Organized. About Philo, it's pretty obvious: more GPP and faster GP means easier game. And Organized to relieve the burden from upkeep in case our toddling economy doesn't show a magnificent performance. Very good traits for SE starters, IMHO. But... mind you, this map is an Arid one, as pictured in the last post. Well, I think it's a critical blow to our SE attempt Because in an arid world, rivers are somewhat rare, so we have fewer options when it comes to irrigation needs. But that's just the minor reason, the big one is that food resources are also very scarce everywhere. Without them nobody can maintain a good surplus to feed their hungry scientists... Oh man ... what a big obstacle the Vietnamese has to overcome in their first try to make a change to the economy ...

 

[Lord_Herobrine]

Interesting, I also have never used the SE. Good Luck!

 

[12tn2]

Interesting, I also have never used the SE. Good Luck!

Tks, and welcome to our adventure! You seem to be new here, don't you
I too don't know much about the SE, but from what I read on CFC, the Specialist economy needs the Pyramids to run efficiently. Le Loi also knows that and he already has a plan to make the wonder affordable to build, via his second city:

The pink dot will be Hochiminh city, and it will provide the invaluable stone to the Vietnamese. That's a tough choice, because the tile just south of it has almost equal attraction: it will have access to the sea for the price of not being able to use the silk tile (and we can take another silk from the French to make up for it, if possible ). But that's a risky bet. We have no means to attack Louis right now, not to mention his Creative trait will pose a significant cultural barrier. Moreover, settling a city right between the Russian and the French AND the barbarians is quite dangerous without a decent defense. The pink dot has an advantage here: it actually is a plain hill, and will provide 25% bonus right out of the gate. We can't use the ocean tiles anymore, but we'll gain two grassland ones for possible farms in the far far future, and also can get rid of a food-decifit plain tile. Besides, the Vietnamese can use one more forest if we settle on the pink dot – it's that silk tile. In the race for the Pyramids, thirty (sixty? ) more hammers can make the difference. Of course, this is just the analysis of Le Loi for now, and since the second city is not built, every plan can be changed. Anyway, that pink dot is still our priority...
Now to the problems: we don't have any of the relevant techs yet. There's a need for Mysticism, Animal husbandry and Masonry to make our plan feasible. And at this research rate... (shrug) Well, that's not to mention our two workers are being intimidated by that Japanese warrior – mean Toky, are you going this far for a vengeance?

 

[12tn2]

In 2080BC, the Vietnamese receives a very very bad news: an opponent's couple of archer and settler is heading toward their own pink spot!!

Damn it Le Loi thought that Peter has plenty of land to the right of his position and he would make the priority of settling there instead of this 'rocky' and food poor site. Now judging from these units' direction from their departure place, it's very likely that the Russian is going to occupy this critical pink spot before the Vietnamese can do We now can only hope that these guys will change the way and move along the yellow path, there's a site with only one clam right under our nose. Le Loi would happily let Peter settle right next to his capital, rather than seeing him stealing the stone city. But, to be honest, there's nearly no chance the Russian will follow the yellow arrow, so we'll have to prepare for the worst scenario – WAR! How?
Well, in desperate times, crazy ideas can happen. Let's face the truth: if Peter is to be able to found his second city on that hill tile, we're doomed. Clearly. The Vietnamese don't have copper, and warriors and archers won't have a chance against a 'hilled and citied' defender. Neither do chariots, and we are even not sure if there's a horse source inside our capital or not! Likewise, researching Iron working will cost us more than five hundred years, and when we do have the tech it's not a guarantee for the Vietnamese to possess that metal with our tiny territory by the time. So, the most important thing now, if not to destroy this couple, is to prevent them from settling on the pink spot hill tile at all cost. Fortunately, our warrior there has half-a-step advantage against the Russian units in the race...

 

[hoplitejoe]

Time to archer rush!

 

[12tn2]

Time to archer rush!

Home run! You're reading my thoughts, eh?
There are bad news and good news when the third millennium of history approached. The bad news is, Peter the ugly has succeeded in his first move of the vile plan to block the Vietnamese The good news is, actually the bad news is not that bad :

So the Russian leader has chosen not to settle on the pink dot hill tile – a tactical position so important that Le Loi would declare war to deny him of. Instead, he placed his second city on a plain two tiles nearer to us. That act forced our own settler, who was completed some turns later, to head for the only site available left: that tiny peninsula on the right. And Hochiminh city was founded! Could be in a better place, if we can Phew, at least the worst case scenario, thank God, didn't happen. Hey, it's even better for us this way, after all. As you can see, the Vietnamese are researching Mysticism. An obelisk is going to be built soon – we need it for our second city to grab the clam (one of our worker will chop the forest he's in right when the tech is finished. Oh, by the way, it's pretty dangerous to let all of our labor forces working unprotected (and an empty city, too, in case you haven't noticed) right next to a foreign military unit, isn't it? Lucky for us, Louis is (argg, saying these two words is pretty tricky – or should I write Louis' instead? So it will not look like I typed an unnecessary “is” Or we can call the French leader Lou from now on ) playing a nobleman's style, and Le Loi trusts him for now. Anyway, that warrior guy will get kicked out when Hochiminh city or Hanoi's border pops). And when our second city does expand, the Vietnamese will also be able to 'neighbor' Peter and his saint city in the literal way. Now can we call this one the best bad case scenario?

 

[12tn2]

In an effort to reveal as much territory of the Japanese as possible before their capital's border expands (we know too well that Toky won't ever open his land to us to explore, especially after the last adventure ), Nguyen Xi has run into a barbarian warrior

Bad for us now Since our scout doesn't have a hill promotion to provide a better defense, the possibility for surviving is about from very low to zero, so the Vietnamese should prepare to hear the news of their first casualty next turn Anyway, the chance of seeing Kyoto is quite small, because it's likely that the only forested tile left fogged on one of the two diagonal line from the city is not a hill. However, just by judging at the revealed tiles under the Japanese control, Le Loi can already come to comment: this site is crazy!! Eleven tiles of floodplains is just insane! And the fur and the wine, two happiness resources in Kyoto's BFC ? Omg how could the map maker script produce such an imbalance, erratic distribution of starting locations on the world like this ?? Like if it's not enough, there's sheep to help feeding the already overcrowded Japanese! And that's not all, who can tell whatever crazy resources can appear in the black tiles out there? Oh, and there are three plain hills already in that BFC! ARRGGG And can you see the copper in the east? The crab in the north?? Gold and the silk in the west of them??? All waiting for Toky to get there and settle because that part of the map is empty and uncontested???? OH SH!T THIS MAP IS CORRUPTED!!!1!
Ok... ok. I've calmed myself down. This condition is not too serious, we at least haven't lost for now. After all, Le Loi was a hero capable of winning all the obstacles his enemies posed since his very early days of rebelling. He'll repeat it here...

 

[Lord_Herobrine]

This is gonna be a toughy...

 

[12tn2]

This is gonna be a toughy...

No doubt about it
Turn after turn, bad news are consecutively reported, with the latters worse than the formers. At first, our scout Nguyen Xi has to end more than two thousand years of his adventures in an unequal fight with the barbarians Now we don't have any unit to find the Spanish, the only civilization whom the Vietnamese haven't know the whereabouts of But then the next is even more depressing: Le Loi doesn't have horses in his hands!

How disappointing We have expected for these horses so much, partly because the Vietnamese is desperately in need of them to break the blockage Peter has done to us. Now what can we do?
The above picture also shows you the territories of two of our neighbors: Louis and Caesar. And it can explain the reason why we can't launch an early assault against neither of these two capitals, as opposed to someone's demand of destroying Rome before it can produce Praetorians in a previous post. The reason is clear: the Vietnamese don't have sight into those cities yet. We don't know what they have, and blindly attacking the Romans will likely not yield us a good result, especially when our troops don't possess decent weapons. However, both Paris and Rome can access the sea, which means the opportunity for sudden attack with two-moves galleys are still remain open. The problem is whether Le Loi and his people can build up a powerful army to deal a deadly strike or not. Judging from the current situation, that chance is small, though
Oh, and there's one thing that makes me confused from this pic. Rome has achieved level 3 culture, but why doesn't the plain tile south east of the city turn to their purple color? Does that mean it's an island separated from land?

 

[hoplitejoe]

Rush gunpowder!

 

[Daedwartin]

Yes...you have no choice. Musket an will be your first unit you will actually be safely able to use. If you rush gunpowder, you WILL be almost garenneeted to beat everyone by enough turns to get ride of at least Peter and maybe the french

 

[12tn2]

Rush gunpowder!

Yes...you have no choice.

Gunpowder?? I don't know how long it will take, though. Forever, maybe But hey, you have forgotten something: the Vietnamese haven't researched Iron working yet! There's a chance we can get our hands on that lovely metal and who knows, it'll be kickass time then
Although the Vietnamese have met all of their competitors, we only have complete map of just one capital. It's Tenochtitlan. Have a look at it:

Wow, another food heaven. Maybe the arid map is not a food poor one, after all? There are five floodplains including the tile Montezuma chose to settle on. One corn, one pig resource – they're to bring a balance to the Aztecan people's menu, we guess. The result of this healthy diet is that the city's population is increasing at a good speed and doesn't show a sign of slowing. Monty has four forests to keep his pollution index in check, and two plain hills to boost his hammer count when an idea of war springs up in his head That's not to count those elephants – the most powerful happiness resource on earth. These animals will not only provide shields but also riding means and an unhappiness counter for Monty in his crazy wars. And when in peace? There's a river to provide those lovely tiny extra coins, and eight grassland tiles are not bad places for cottage at all. Oh, and Tenochtitlan also possesses all kinds of fresh water available for a city. What a position! Last but not least, from that place, the Aztecs are free to expand to whatever direction they sees fit. Need some axes and spears? Go south east and an oasis will aid you of both water and food amidst a tiny desert. Plus, there are gems out there, offscreen. Want a wonder built? Ok get to the north east and stone along with some silk worms are waiting for your exploitation. Or tired of riding the ivory giants and feel like some smaller yet faster ones? South east is your destination, there you can also taste some delicious wild rice, as a bonus. Now if Monty is not as crazy for wars as usual, he'll definitely end up a big guy, maybe only after Tokugawa and his irrational, fantasy land ...

 

[12tn2]

Nearly, if not all, other civilizations have settled their second cities. Because our scout Nguyen Xi has died during mission, the Vietnamese can't keep track of the situation of far away empires. However, we can at least guess the locations of our neighbors:

Above is two among them – Orleans of France and one from Persia (Susa? Can't remember well). And Le Loi has to admit, despite belonging to a leader who is creative and possesses an impressive score, the French city is utter crap Really, is that your choice, Lou? A place with no food resources (can that oasis count?), no grassland (because you settle on it ), only one hill and two forests, two or three incense trees that you already had and a bunch of desert? Your taste for land is quite weird, my friend And you have also proved yourself stupid when you ask us to give you our clam resource for free some turns ago. You know, when we refused that arrogant ask, you're not the only one who didn't took it lightly.
On the contrary (yet similar), Le Loi can not take the Persian lightly at all, either. After all, Cyrus is deserved his suffix of 'the great': his city is very wisely placed in order to grab all four resources available (and two of them are general ones ) while avoiding as many bad tiles as possible. A good catch! He compensates the plain tiles with two food sources, he deals with the lack of fresh water by using a lot of trees. On top of those, now the Persian have copper for their troops, and with the creative trait they will get their hands on the marble soon enough. Hey, it's kind of a critical, 'pink spot' city on a map like this!
So, both being creative, how on earth can they be so different – one guy is really smart, the other exceedingly stupid and swollen headed?

 

[Lord_Herobrine]

Wow, Louis, wow. Never seen him settle such a terrible place, he should of atleast tried to get the gold in his BFC. The Persian second city is Pasargadae if I remember correctly.

Oh wow, take a second look at the map, 5 gold sources all in that view, someone's gonna make persian Elderado (I think thats how you spell it ).

 

[trexeric]

Do you mean El Dorado?

Anyways, great story, and consider this my official sub post!

 

[12tn2]

Wow, Louis, wow. Never seen him settle such a terrible place, he should of atleast tried to get the gold in his BFC. The Persian second city is Pasargadae if I remember correctly.

Oh wow, take a second look at the map, 5 gold sources all in that view, someone's gonna make persian Elderado (I think thats how you spell it ).

Yes! - Pasargadae The Persian cities' names can be bizarre sometimes, but that's not to mention the Aztec ones
About the gold, IMO it's actually Cyrus who will take the most disadvantages. Three mines on the left will be under Alexander's control, while the right resources may be in the hands of Peter or Louis. Being in the middle of everything sometimes is not the best case.

Anyways, great story, and consider this my official sub post!

Welcome! Our adventures will just get more & more exciting! Besides, judging by the number of wins in your sig, it is really true that your civ4 difficulty is just warlord? Are you being too modest of yourself, or are you being too lazy to update your stats, huh

 

[trexeric]

I haven't been playing much recently... I'm still working my way up to the next level.

EDIT: I'm on Noble now... just played a game as Portugal and won... still technically working my way up.

 

[12tn2]

I'm on Noble now... just played a game as Portugal and won... still technically working my way up.

Well, then if we win this Prince game, I hope we can provide you with these little bits of experience
In the early game, food count is argued to be the most important index when one comes to analysis. So let's take a look at how well all the civilizations are doing on the field:

As Le Loi has analyzed in the previous turns, the first three positions are no one else than Monty, Toky and Cyrus. What's a little surprising is that Tokugawa has somehow managed his crop-heaven poorly enough for Montezuma and his food-crazy empire to take the top. Meanwhile, the Persian and their smart city placing strategy have risen from the middle of the pack and have taken the third place. Those are the big guys. In the second group, there's no wonder Mao Zedong got to be the fourth, because of a considerable amount of floodplains his capital Beijing possesses. And impressive enough, Peter is on par with the Chinese leader Since the Russian will be our first opponent on our way to victory, this is not a good sign at all Oh, so where are the Vietnamese on this graph? Sad but true, we are dead last for quite some dozens of years now Le Loi had to sacrifice his people's food in order to pump their ability hammer-wise, and you probably have known why. Yes it'll be a war with Peter. We have neither metal nor horses whatsoever, but a flood of archers will do against a city not on hill (we hope so ). During the past turns, the Vietnamese second settlement has completed an obelisk already, and in the upcoming years nearly all our forces will be garrisoned next to St. Petersburg, thanks to the culture provided from Ho Chi Minh city. To be honest, Le Loi still thinks this move is a very risky one, but he has almost no other choice. He can't wait or rely on the iron – it will not even appear in the next centuries...

 

[MedicInDisquise]

Good luck on the culture battle, you are in a tough spot.

 

[Daedwartin]

This is why I always pick continents or terra.
Also. Civfanatics...your conquering ways have become contagious. More and more these days, my preferred solution to a problematic AI is to blob into them.
Eh. At least your not playing EU3 as some nation that can't form Germany or Great Britain, or not playing as France in it...
GO for guns. They work wonders for a resourceless people.