Christian facists on the march?

[GenMarshall]

Exactly like how the abortion movement progressed. THROUGH THE CHURCHES.

Thats how it started with the Civil Rights movement in the 1960s with Martin Luther King Jr.

 

[Katheryn]

Western Africans? American Indians?
The coming of Christians in new lands did not always result in a vast increase of freedom and happiness for all.

The entire American Indian culture was wrapped up in, was obsessed with war. Everything was dependent upon a warrior mentality.

If you think they would have lived in peace without the white man, you have rocks in your head. They fought one another constantly. That kind of culture cannot stand. A value system for a lasting community must include components that allow that culture to survive.

That is why the Mayans and the Aztec cultures disappeared. Too much value placed upon war.

The West African Trade was done by ARABS. Look it up. And I happen to be one of the only posters who want to continue Affirmative Action, so don't even go there.

 

[Masquerouge]

The entire American Indian culture was wrapped up in, was obsessed with war. Everything was dependent upon a warrior mentality.

And Christian Europe was a haven of peace. Right. Even the Pope has Swiss guards. Warrior mentality? I say Chivalry.

If you think they would have lived in peace without the white man, you have rocks in your head. They fought one another constantly. That kind of culture cannot stand. A value system for a lasting community must include components that allow that culture to survive.

We're not talking about peace, actually, we're talking about FREEDOM. And I guess they would be a lot freer today without the white man.

That is why the Mayans and the Aztec cultures disappeared. Too much value placed upon war.

No, they disappeared because they were less good at war than the white Christian man.

The West African Trade was done by ARABS. Look it up.

True. But who bought these slaves? And last time I checked they did not come to the US on Arab ships. Triangular trade was an affair between the US, France and England, all of them very Christian countries.

 

[Katheryn]

Too bad the Mayans aren't there anymore to thank the Christians. I wonder what happened to them?

I already answered this a few pages back.

But here you go again:


http://www.archaeology.org/0507/abstracts/maya.html

Excessive warring, excessive human sacrifice - mass human sacrifice. Instead of putting their captives to work, they butchered them. Hence the decline. This was centuries before the Spanish.

 

[Trajan12]

The entire American Indian culture was wrapped up in, was obsessed with war. Everything was dependent upon a warrior mentality.

If you think they would have lived in peace without the white man, you have rocks in your head. They fought one another constantly. That kind of culture cannot stand. A value system for a lasting community must include components that allow that culture to survive.

That is why the Mayans and the Aztec cultures disappeared. Too much value placed upon war.

The West African Trade was done by ARABS. Look it up. And I happen to be one of the only posters who want to continue Affirmative Action, so don't even go there.

If I may interrupt, Im half Black (brown basically ) and I think AA is stupid. Not to take away from your point, Im sure you are a good person. Carry on.

 

[GenMarshall]

Even the Pope has Swiss guards.

The Pope needs protection, much like the President needs the Secret Service to protect him. So it does not connects with a "war" mentality.

 

[Masquerouge]

I already answered this a few pages back.

But here you go again:


http://www.archaeology.org/0507/abstracts/maya.html

Excessive warring, excessive human sacrifice - mass human sacrifice. Instead of putting their captives to work, they butchered them. Hence the decline. This was centuries before the Spanish.

Fine- let's talk about the Aztecs then.

 

[Trajan12]

And Christian Europe was a haven of peace. Right. Even the Pope has Swiss guards. Warrior mentality? I say Chivalry.

Yeah and hes ready to storm the shores of Tripoli with them. The Pope has boosted security because the terrorists have called for his death, go figure

 

[Little Raven]

The Pope has boosted security because the terrorists have called for his death, go figure

In 1506? Really?

 

[Gilder]

Yeah and hes ready to storm the shores of Tripoli with them. The Pope has boosted security because the terrorists have called for his death, go figure

The Swiss Guards have been with the Pope for five hundred years.

 

[Katheryn]

And Christian Europe was a haven of peace. Right. Even the Pope has Swiss guards. Warrior mentality? I say Chivalry.



We're not talking about peace, actually, we're talking about FREEDOM. And I guess they would be a lot freer today without the white man.



No, they disappeared because they were less good at war than the white Christian man.



True. But who bought these slaves? And last time I checked they did not come to the US on Arab ships. Triangular trade was an affair between the US, France and England, all of them very Christian countries.

Your problem here, you absolute illogical reasoning, your fallacy, is that you are comparing 1100 AD Europe to 1860 America. That is comparing apples to oranges.

I can see that you have been programmed, brainwashed to hate the West.

Tell me, why does everyone want to live here? Why do you want to trash it? Bring unassimilated cultures into it? Why don't you THINK for a change? Instead of regurgitate ultra left wing guilt complexes?

The Christianized West may not be perfect, but IT IS THE BEST THAT HAS EVER BEEN AROUND IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD!

You should be on your knees thanking GOD you weren't born in Somalia, or Indonesia, in India, Pakistan or God forbid, in Africa.

It is because of people like you, brainwashed by guilt ridden idiots, that is going to be responsible for the west falling. And you have Sharia to look forward to! Well the good thing is, you can have all the women you want, if you can look at them!

 

[Trajan12]

The Pope has increased security because no one is safe. I know he has always had gaurds, hes like any other important figure.

 

[.Shane.]

I don't know why I bother with this, you people are ridiculous.

LOL, "you people", careful on your judging, for all you know, I'm your local pastor.

Women didn't just 'get the vote'.

I realize the value of certain Christian movements in many of the reforms and progresses that occurred in the US. What you seem to either be oblivious of or want to ignore is that fact that these changes were often brought about while being opposed by an equal or greater number of Christians.

Hence, the simple fact of them being "Christians" is not the determining factor, in most cases.

Also, many times the "progress" that some Christians advocate is not really progress, it can be regressive at worst, or controversial (meaning, unlike women voting, there's no true "correct" side, just opinion). For example, prohibition, ala pro-choice, anti-science school curriculum, to name a few.

Also, "Christians", have done all of the following in the US:
*tried to force blacks back to Africa
*destroyed Indian tribal society (mind you, I'm all for assimilation, but there's a right and a wrong way)
*defended and extended slavery
*participated in the slave trade
*wanted to bar blacks from full civil rights

My point is not "oh, Christians are evil" no more than it is "oh, everything Christians touch is great" or "all Christians are great".

I'm simply trying to refute the point of view you consistently express, which IMO is historically incorrect, narrow-minded, arrogant, and self-serving.

I'm quite willing to give credit where credit is due: abolition movement, women's rights, etc... But, unlike you, I'm also willing to assess blame where it is warranted: treatment of Indians, protection of slavery, etc...

 

[.Shane.]

As to the OP, what I think is not being understood is that the religious are not fascists. However, they are often the tools of the fascists, who, in fact, typically are irreligious or amoral in their outlook, but see the value of using religion as a tool of power.

 

[Katheryn]

Fine- let's talk about the Aztecs then.

Forget it.

I'm the ONLY ONE who does research, who provides links.

Just remember this. It is the CHRISTIAN CONCEPT of forgiveness, of loving thy enemy, of equality, that has changed the world from being a WARRIOR mentality that destroyed both the Mayans and the Aztecs, and all the rest.

That is the difference. It hasn't always PREVAILED in the world, but nonetheless bit by bit, century by century it HAS changed it. It has brought it into conformity with the general philosophy of FORGIVENESS and EQUALITY.

There is no other religion that does that.

You may be an atheist, you may be taught by an atheist who minimized the contribution of Christianity, but if you go to the ROOT cause of change - whether it is the civil rights movement, the suffrage movement, the emancipation of slaves, public education, the university system, the hospital system, the abolishing of polygamy, the abolishing of late term abortion (hopefully), you will find a CHRISTIAN church in the beginning, one who took the BIBLE seriously.

 

[GenMarshall]

*wanted to bar blacks from full civil rights

So Martin Luther King Jr.'s words means nothing. Mind you that King is a Christian and he did pushed forward for civil rights. Both African American and Caucasian Christians (Most from the north and there are some from the south as well) pushed forward for full Civil Rights.

 

[Little Raven]

The Pope has increased security because no one is safe. I know he has always had gaurds, hes like any other important figure.

Oh, I think you'll find the Pope is quite a unique important figure, particularly in 'Christian Europe.' The Pope had so many guards he actually had to build barracks for them.

And believe me, he needed them. The Aztecs were wimps compared to his Christian neighbors, as history ultimately demonstrated.

 

[Irish Caesar]

So Martin Luther King Jr.'s words means nothing. Mind you that King is a Christian and he did pushed forward for civil rights. Both African American and Caucasian Christians (Most from the north and there are some from the south as well) pushed forward for full Civil Rights.

So the actions of Klansmen who called themselves Southern Baptists across the South for over a hundred years after the War Between the States mean nothing, either?

 

[GenMarshall]

There is no other religion that does that.

What about Islam, Judaism, and Buddhism? They also preach about Forgiveness.

 

[Gilder]

Just remember this. It is the CHRISTIAN CONCEPT of forgiveness, of loving thy enemy, of equality, that has changed the world from being a WARRIOR mentality that destroyed both the Mayans and the Aztecs, and all the rest

.

Europe perhaps, but Buddhism preached the opposite of the "warrior mentality" in the Far East before Christ was even born. And let's not forget the ancient pagan religions of the empires of Antiquity. I don't believe they were anymore violent then the West any later.

That is the difference. It hasn't always PREVAILED in the world, but nonetheless bit by bit, century by century it HAS changed it. It has brought it into conformity with the general philosophy of FORGIVENESS and EQUALITY.

There is no other religion that does that.

I direct you to older religions than Christianity.