DocT5- The RaR Deity Trial

I'm almost sure researching a tech in X turns and finishing a gives-two-techs-wonder in X turns is fine; the research invention is made before the "finished building phase" begins, so the techs from the wonder come up in the moment the city finishes the wonder.


Since it hasn't been posted longer, the roster:

Greebley - Just played
Tinkez - UP!
grs - On deck
Pfeffersack
DocT
mad-bax
 
I'm almost sure researching a tech in X turns and finishing a gives-two-techs-wonder in X turns is fine; the research invention is made before the "finished building phase" begins, so the techs from the wonder come up in the moment the city finishes the wonder.
Click to expand...
Yes, it is. Income/research happens before production.
 
Pre-Turn:

Bring sci down to 90% (High explosives still in 5.)
Our military seems to be very small compared to the fact that we should conquer Persia.
-> Change quite a few cities to military.

IBT:

America and Persia sign trade embargo against us.
Spearman defends in S against mameluk, promotes and Larsa stays ours. (1-0)

1255AD(1):

Raise lux to 10%.
Kill 2 line inf. (3-0)
Try a safe steal from Chinese - and fail. They had Steel and Social Darwinism as monopoly. If they had declared I had bought India into war. Now I let it be.

IBT:

China and America make peace.
We get Steel from Encyclopedia.

1260AD(2):

Spend some(!) gold for military.

IBT:

One more Persian down (4-0).

1265AD(3):

Move forces towards Arbela, kill 1 cava. (5-0)

IBT:

Three counter-attacks from Persians, win 2, lose 1. (7-1)

1270AD(4):

Next turn bombardment of Arbela begins. Kill 2 hussars and 1 line inf. (10-1)
Pillage one of Persian gold.
Sell Social Contract to Russia for 278gp+38gpt+WM.

IBT:

High Explosives -> Electricity.
ToE is built: Electricity and Replaceable parts are discovered.
We have 3 rubber.
Start Screw Propeller. Ultimate target is Mass Production.
Indians and chinese switch to Taj Mahal.
I could get 3100gp+88gpt+2lux from China for High explosives, but I'll wait a little for them to build up cash. Don't want gpt.

1275AD(5):

Capture Arbela (13-1).

IBT:

Indians complete Taj Mahal and begin Universal suffrage.
Chinese switch to Universal suffrage too.

1280AD(6):

Kill 2 Persians (15-1).

IBT:

One Persian Hussar dies attacking our SoD. (16-1)
Social Darwinism comes in from Encyclopedia.

1285AD(7):

Attack Susa - kill 2 line infantry and raze the city; get 3 workers. (18-1)

IBT:

Indians complete Shakespeare Theater.

1290AD(8):

Attack Sardis - kill 2 line infantry and take the city. (20-1)

IBT:

Chinese begin Edison's Workshop :(

1295AD(9):

Zzzz

IBT:

Screw Propeller is invented -> start Corporation.

1300AD(10):

Find Hidatsa on the ruins of Susa.
Kill Hussar (21-1)
Attack on Gordium - kill 2 line infantry + 1 cannon (24-1)

Notes:

There are 2 factories coming up soon - we need third to be able to build crystal palace.
There is a colonist on boat going to settle nearby island.
Persians are dead meat - should be easy to finish off. They didn't offer much resistance.
Bison River should build next Edisons workshop - could be possible with that many shields against the chinese.
Sarcee is becoming a powerhouse - needs railroads and production boosters.
China has ~3000gp - maybe worth trading something. I did not trade gpt with them as future plans were a bit unclear.
China has also acquired corporation - trade or steal as India is broke and they won't get it for a while I think...

P.S. I managed to keep Larsa :D

Over to Grs!
 
Sounds good, Tinkez!
We have 3 rubber.
Start Screw Propeller. Ultimate target is Mass Production.
Click to expand...
Great :D. Fully agree, the CP is insane...we just need to have enough Workers to clean up the pollution.

I think Persia was pretty gased from their wars against Babylon and even Germany; in RaR, the IA units are pretty expensive even for Deity AIs. If they lost most of their Cavalier/Knight forces, they cannot producce enough to keep up. But of course, this is even more true for the human; peaceful builder games without steadily producing units are critical.

One very important point: District Courthouses. We need 5 of them for the Supreme Court, the second-most important wonder ATM.
 
Our position looks very strong. Grats on keeping Larsa too. I really thought it was a goner.

Your mention of lowering science reminded me of something. In this case we wanted to get the tech in exactly 5 turns. However, in the general case it is often worth leaving the tech rate at 100% even if you can also get the tech in the same number of turns at 90 or 80% The reason is that your researching power is always growing. By researching at the highest rate, you often find you can get it a turn faster. Additionally, the AI may get the tech which completely changes the shields needed and so the faster rate might again be faster. Only when the number of turns is close (2 or 3) do you need to turn it down.

I don't know if you would have kept it at 100% if it weren't trying to time TOE, but if not, it is something to consider. You don't lose anything by running high because you can then run low in the last 2-3 turns and get the same cash as you would have gotten if you had lowered science.

[Edit: We might as well wake the Elite Mounted Warrior in Hannover and the Elite knight in Munchen and leader fish. We have a lot of small wonders to build and could use some armies. I suspect I accidentally fortified them.

Edit2: I would switch Yanktown and Nakota to a Aquaduct so they can continue to grow. Also build a Major Port in Lakota, Nadouesioux and Ellipi and Frankfort (Ellipi and Frankfort need ports first to build a Major Port). Our growth has stalled in all these cities.
 
Greebley said:
Our position looks very strong. Grats on keeping Larsa too. I really thought it was a goner.
Click to expand...
That was close - one defender against a mameluk, but RNG was on my side. I rushed a garrison there on the pre-turn and that gave me the chance to upgrade the spear + 25% defence for future attacks.
Greebley said:
Your mention of lowering science reminded me of something. In this case we wanted to get the tech in exactly 5 turns. However, in the general case it is often worth leaving the tech rate at 100% even if you can also get the tech in the same number of turns at 90 or 80% The reason is that your researching power is always growing. By researching at the highest rate, you often find you can get it a turn faster. Additionally, the AI may get the tech which completely changes the shields needed and so the faster rate might again be faster. Only when the number of turns is close (2 or 3) do you need to turn it down.

I don't know if you would have kept it at 100% if it weren't trying to time TOE, but if not, it is something to consider. You don't lose anything by running high because you can then run low in the last 2-3 turns and get the same cash as you would have gotten if you had lowered science.
Click to expand...
Point noted. Will implement in future games :)
Greebley said:
[Edit: We might as well wake the Elite Mounted Warrior in Hannover and the Elite knight in Munchen and leader fish. We have a lot of small wonders to build and could use some armies. I suspect I accidentally fortified them.
Click to expand...
I actually left them there as I did not want to keep any coastal cities without defence and I spent so much cash on near-the-front military rushes that did not want to short-rush defenders in north.
 
From my side, take your time.I would have to play now immediately or delay it to saturday evening/sunday.And since I'm trying to consider my turns carefully(which gets harder, if I get tired :D ), I would prefer the latter option.So no need to hurry for you, IMO.
 
1300 AD (PT):

- MM Nürnberg: Garrison now in 1t
- MM Yankton and switched Aqueduct (4t)
- Nakota switched to Aqueduct (3t)
- Frankfurt switched to Port (16t)
- Sarcee: switched to Town Clock (1t) (because it is more expensive, but we still can get it in 1t - I will MM next turn here and build the cheaper water mill then]
- Hamadan: concverted scientist in engineer to speed up courthouse construction (now 29t)
- did the same in Sardis (Monument now 9t)
- Larsa switched to Courthouse (57t)
- Hamburg switched to Shrine (4t) to combat upcoming unhappiness
- Arbela switched to Courthouse (25t)
- I thought about stealing Corporation from China...but we are giving them still elepahnts (for 3t) from an older trade.I'm not sure, but in case it fails and they declare war, we might ruin our rep here, so I abstain from doing that and trade instead
- Trade with China: Got Corporation and 925 gold <---> for Replaceable Parts and Screw Propeller [now it is displayed that the Chinese already have Refining - since we want to go for MP asap, I decided to make another deal]
- Trade with China: Got Refining <---> for High Explosives and 1704 gold
- ressource report: We have 4 sources of oil in our Territorium (near: Königsberg, Gordium, Babylon and Bison River)
- we are now researching Internal Combustion at 90%/6t (I use Greebleys advice to lower since only 2-3t before completion)

MR:
- killed redlined Muja outside larsa with Rifleman (1:0)



IBT:
- lux/ressource deal with Russia expired. I renewed it, but take out the camels (and got better conditions):
Got Wine, Spices + 14GpT <---> for Salpeter and Horses
- lux deal with India expires, too...renewed deal:
Got Tea, Silks, 2 GpT <---> for Incense , Tobacco, Gems, Cotton and Sugar

1305 AD (1):
- Bison River: Factory --> Edisons Workshop (17t)
- Sarcee: Town Clock ---> Water Mill (3t)
- Ellipi: Forge ---> Harbor (1t)
- Nürnberg: Garrison ---> Rifleman (8t)

MR:
- wounded persia IoL outside Tarsus with cannon, tried to kill it with our elite Curassier...and failed thanks to RNG (1:1), killed the now redlined IoL than with el. MW (2:1)
- vet Hussar killed Arabian Pikeman outside Hidatsa (3:1)...and spotted a Persia 2-unit-army (vet Hussar, reg line inf.) on the hill NW of Tyre.I guess the Hussar will be lost, because I forgot to factore in that desert tiles in enmy territorium cost 2 move points...sorry :(



IBT:
- Persia Army kills Hussar between Gordium and Hidatsa (3:2)
- America offered straight WM trade, declined.

1310 AD (2):
- Little Bighorn finished the Military Academy! ---> Windmill (4t)
- Ellipi: Harbor ---> Watermill (4t)
- Hunkpapa: Library ---> Rifleman (8t)
- founded Crow NW of the 3 rice sources (building project: Courthouse 60t)

MR:
- after weakening it with 3 cannons I killed the Persian army between Hidatsa and Gordium with an vet. Dragoon (prom. to el.) (5:2)



IBT:
- The Adventurer outside Gordium (moved it outside to protect the cannons) holds against Persian Hussar and got even promoted to elite (6:2)

1315 (3):
- Nineveh: Town Clock ---> Major Port (3t)
- Ashur: Rifleman ---> Town Clock (4t)
- Heidelberg: Leathernek ---> Watermill (5t)
- Nakota: Aqueduct ---> Rifleman (8t)



IBT:
- Russia offers deal: They offer Sanitation in exchange against Social Darwinism and 150 Gold.I declined for the moment (IIRC, IBT trades give the AI the ability to trade the tech further around)...of course to come back during my turn!
- Persia deployes 3 IoL outside Hidatsa...

1320 AD (4):
- Ur: Town Clock ---> Rifleman (4t)
- Sarcee: Watermill ---> Granary(1t) [reason: city only grows slowly and a granary gives also better MM opportunities]
- Hamburg: Shrine ---> Laborer (5t)
- Wounded Knee: Rifleman ---> Town Clock (5t)
- Yankton: Aqueduct ---> Town Clock (4t)
- München: Barracks ---> Port (12t)
- Oglala: Leatherneck ---> Laboerer (2t)
- Samarra: Courthouse ---> Port (20t)
- Tarsus: Forge ---> Harbor (3t)
- Nadouessioux: Port ---> Major Port (3t)
- upgraded 3 bab. Workers to Laborers in Nürnberg
- MM Nürnberg to get Rifleman in 4t
- China has now Rep.Rifle
- about Russias offer...it is debtable if we need sanitation...it is optional and I am doubtful if we will have many cities which need those expensive Sewer Systems...on the other hand it disables diseases in floodplains, we can build CfC later if we want and Russia is not really dangerous, so why not trade and
get even some money?
- Trade with Russia: Got Sanitaion, 142 Gold, 6 GpT <---> for Socal Darwinism (nice sideeffect is China hasn't Sanitation yet...)
- Trade with China: Got 2339 Gold, Dyes and Silver <---> for Sanitation

MR:
- killed 2 Persian IoL between Hidatsa and Gordium wth Dragoon and Cavalier (8:2)



IBT:
- Persia send 2 Hussars against Tarsus and Arbela; one attacks Arbela and manage to kills a Rifle inside (8:3)

1325 AD (5)
- Babylon: School of Scribes ---> Academy (7t)
- Sarcee: Granary ---> Guild Hall (5t)
- Dakota: Factory ---> District Courthouse (7t) [not really necessary here, but we need 5 of them...and building is only possible in river cities and effective in high-production cities, so there is not much choice...]
- Hannover. Forge ---> Port (12t)

MR:
- killed both Hussars (MW enslaves) (10:3)



IBT:
- Larsa expands borders

1330 AD (6):

- Internal Combustion researched; new goal: Mass Production (6t)
- Nineveh: Major Port ---> Academy (6t)
- Little Bighorn: Wind Mill ---> Water Mill (3t)
- Ellipi: Watermill ---> Port (2t)
- Oglala: Laborer ---> Laborer (3t)
- Köln: Library ---> Watermill (8t)
- Cree: Forge ---> Watermill (13t)
- Gros Ventre: Shrine ---> Courthouse (12t)
- Shurrupak: Windmill ---> Port (6t)
- Lakota: Rifleman ---> Major Port (3t)
- MM Larsa and added two Engineers; construction time for Courthouse now 17t



IBT:
- Persia sends IoL against Tarsus
- Hamadan and Izibia expanding their borders

1335 AD(7):
- Ashur: Town Clock ---> Water Mill (3t)
- Tarsus: Harbor ---> Courthouse (10t)
- Assiniboine: Courthouse ---> Harbor (3t)
- Nadouessioux: Major Port ---> Town Clock (8t)
- upgraded Persia Slave to Laborer in Santee II

MR:
- killed IoL with Leatherneck (prom to el.) (11:3)



IBT:
- Spain offers straight TM-trade, declined.
- Persia Muja dies attacking Larsa (12:3); sends another Hussar towards Tarsus
- A popup says that America joins Persia in the war against us because of a MPP

1340 AD (8):
- Ur: Rifleman ---> District Courthouse (10t)
- Ellipi: Port ---> Major Port (2t)
- Yankton: Town Clock ---> Rifleman (3t)
- Heidelberg: Watermill ---> Laborer (1t)
- Nürnberg: Rifleman ---> Windmill (5t)

MR:
- killed Hussar near Tarsus with MW (13:3)



IBT:
- France and Russia sign MPP
- a deal which supplies us with Coffee runs out

1345 AD (9):
- Little Bighorn: Watermill ---> Town Clock (3t) [note: feeding cit. from granary is on purpose to speed up the TC a round!]
- Hamburg: Laborer ---> Laborer (5t)
- Wounded Knee: Town Clock ---> District Courthouse (10t)
- Oglala: Labourer ---> Port (6t)
- Sardis: Monument ---> Port (30t)
- Lakota: Major Port ---> Library (8t)

MR:
- killed American Pikeman outside Larsa and promoted the Rifle to elite (14:3)



IBT:
- Russia starts building Universal Suffrage

1350 AD (10):
- Sarcee: Guild Hall ---> Factory (10t)
- Ashur: Watermill ---> Factory (10t)
- Ellipi: Major Port ---> Town Clock (6t)
- Heidelberg: Laborer ---> Townclock (6t)
- Hunkpapa: Rifleman ---> Leatherneck (9t)
- Teton: Hussar ---> Forge (4t)
- Santee II: Rifleman ---> Rifleman (10t)
- Assiniboine: Harbor ---> Port (12t)

End notes:
- There is still trading possible with China (Rep. Rifle agianst Int. Comb.); I have avaoid that trade to keep them away from Mass Production and the Crystal Palace...
- I have made no offense progress against Persia, but moved troops to S, so the next attack can be launched soon


Over to DocTS!
 
Sioux, 1350AD
Looks good.
I’m a bit surprised how few spt our capital makes, guess we need more Workers
Minor points:
*MilAc in Little Bighorn; not the best choice, this city needs to shrink in favour of the capital.
*Königsberg builds a reg Rifle, switch to Windmill.

Screw Propellors to India for 2 Luxes.

Enter.
IBT:
Persian Hussar kills Rifle near Hidatsa.
Couple of WltKDs.

Turn 1: 1355AD
Kill 2 Persian Hussars.
Hm, we’re already at 30%WW.
IBT:
Loose Cava
Mass Production->City Planning
We learn Repeating Rifle.
Start many Toll Houses, our income isn’t great.
Delhi completes USufr

Turn 2: 1360AD
Ack, cannot switch to Crystal Palace, we don’t have enough Factories!
Short-rush the one in Sarcee.
57% WW! Lux to 30%. Get Emancipation and 250gp from Russia for Steam Engine. Emancipation to China for 141gpt.
IBT:
Sarcee Factory->Magna Charta

Turn 3: 1365AD
Final turn of war, don’t want to risk Anarchy.
Assault on Tyre: Cannons do their job. Elite Cava spawns Bigfoot. Capture Tyre.
Sorry, we cannot sustain this war any longer. The next city we could reach is Persepolis, and we’d need Cannons here; that means 3 turns within their territory.
China already knows Advanced Metallurgy (Artillery), and we need a military railnet first. We need to come back in 20 turns.
Since we coldn’t get anything more than 19gp and a WM, I don’t even take that, and make straight peace.
Bison River switched to Crystal Palace.
Lux back to 10%.
Nice, notice Kish where I planned to rush the Naval Academy with the leader already has a Shipyard.
IBT:
WltKDs almost everywhere.

Turn 4: 1370AD
Zzzz..
IBT:
China and India sign MPP.
American Longship shows up at Hamadan.

Turn 5: 1375AD
Russia has cash, sell her Electricity for 530gp and 170gpt.
Rush the Naval Academy in Kish (not so much for the AotF, but the movement bonus)
IBT:
America lands 2 Ghost Dancers at Hamadan – should be their entire offensive forces :lol:. NP, we have 2 Cavas there.
Naval Academy done.

Turn 6: 1380AD
I’m an idiot – those are two Babylonian Cavas at the Hamadan island…
Make peace with Lincoln.
Ack again – China beats us to the nice city spot on Crow Island
IBT:
China starts Eiffel Tower :( - they know City Planning. And complete Edison’s.

Turn 7: 1385AD
China is up Espionage, City Planning, Advanced Metallurgy, Refrigeration :hmm: looks like India researched CP, and China one tech, plus the 2 for free; but at last, they lack Internal Combustion.
Found a city in a mediocre spot on our continent.
Turn off research.
IBT:
Learn City Planning, start on Motorized Transportation
Ur completes District Courthouse, and I notice we need only 3 of those.

Turn 8: 1390AD
Switch Sarcee to Eiffel, if we fail, there are enough wonders to fall back.
Wounded Knee from DC to Supreme Court, due in 7.

Turn 9: 1395AD
Zzz…
IBT:
We learn Realpolitik.

Turn 10: 1400AD

Crystal Palace is due next turn, by all means get a Park next in the capital. Then Sewer System, this city should grow ASAP.
Skipped the MM for this turn, mood with the CP finishing anyway.

Dakota needs as many commercial/scientific buildings as possible.
And, don’t forget to sell the 3 District Courthouses once the Supreme Court is done (in the capital, Dakota and Ur).
Nothing special for techs, we should get some more from the Encyclopede.

The Save

Over to mad-bax .
 
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