The police force in the next town over from mine is well known for pulling stunts like that. The town even gave business owners tax breaks to create "exit only" and "enter only" areas (that are half a mile apart from each other) around a local McDonald's, just to catch people turning into or out of the wrong area. They're pretty awful.
Ferguson
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The police force in the next town over from mine is well known for pulling stunts like that. The town even gave business owners tax breaks to create "exit only" and "enter only" areas (that are half a mile apart from each other) around a local McDonald's, just to catch people turning into or out of the wrong area. They're pretty awful.
Timsup2nothin
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We have a place on a main street where as you come out of a business driveway if you look across the street you clearly see a 'no left turn' sign...which is perfectly reasonable for the circumstances because turning left out of that driveway would be pretty close to insane. The sign is right next to a driveway into a shopping center on the other side of the street, which has a left turn lane specifically so you can turn into it from the main street. The sign faces across the street, so people don't see it as they approach, get in the left turn lane, and start their left turn, at which point it is pretty much right in front of them.
On a fairly regular basis there is a cop hanging around writing people tickets in the parking lot for people who "made an illegal left turn". He points at the sign, says he saw them do it, writes the ticket. Either you just pay over the internet, walk in and pay at the window, or you can pay the fine and schedule a court date. The process actually involves three full days where the ordinary person has to miss work over a period of around ninety days, but if at your third court appearance you show up with pictures so you can fully explain the circumstances the judge will agree that the sign does not apply to vehicles in that left turn lane and perhaps should be relocated. Your fine will be reimbursed and you will be sent on your way.
But the sign never moves and despite every traffic cop in town having had at least one ticket thrown out, they continue to write them. I watched one guy write twenty-six over a period of about three hours one day.
On a fairly regular basis there is a cop hanging around writing people tickets in the parking lot for people who "made an illegal left turn". He points at the sign, says he saw them do it, writes the ticket. Either you just pay over the internet, walk in and pay at the window, or you can pay the fine and schedule a court date. The process actually involves three full days where the ordinary person has to miss work over a period of around ninety days, but if at your third court appearance you show up with pictures so you can fully explain the circumstances the judge will agree that the sign does not apply to vehicles in that left turn lane and perhaps should be relocated. Your fine will be reimbursed and you will be sent on your way.
But the sign never moves and despite every traffic cop in town having had at least one ticket thrown out, they continue to write them. I watched one guy write twenty-six over a period of about three hours one day.
MobBoss
Off-Topic Overlord
Ok, before everyone eats their turkeys today, set them on a table a few inches from the edge and shoot it with a pistol to make it fall off the table.That's a 10-25 turkey, now when it doesn't move very much, imagine trying to get any movement out of a 300 lb person.
He doesn't look like he's bracing himself from falling over backwards, he's bracing himself for a poke to the gut. Its not a pleasant feeling to get poked in the gut when you are not expecting it. Ask anyone who has even had a ball thrown to their gut when they weren't ready to catch it.
If Brown was standing straight up, on his tippy toes, on a tightrope, then maybe the shot would have sent him backwards.
I've seen plenty of guys knocked over by getting hit in the head with a baseball that has a lot less power than a .40 caliber round. But they don't go backward by taking a baseball in the gut.
Shoot the guy in the head like Brown was and lets see if he stands there straight.
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
They usually have quotas. The tickets fund a significant amount of their budget, so their bosses make sure that they get a certain number of ticket written - otherwise they might have a budget shortfall.
Timsup2nothin
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Well, our police operate from the advantageous position that they don't need any public credibility, they have guns.
As to quotas, no they don't have quotas. But they do have 'resolutions per shift' which have to be kept up to standards, so that their supervisors know that they aren't just out there sleeping in their cars or something. It may look exactly like a quota. It may have exactly the same effect as a quota. But since the intention is just to make sure cops aren't freeloading on the job we should all thank the police department's leadership for their bold and innovative management techniques.
Bugfatty300
Buddha Squirrel
Actually, flinching is something else entirely. I mean that tensing up and bracing your body to meet the recoil causes exhaustion and higher heart rate and this adversely effects accuracy.
Flying Pig covered this pretty well.
If it's a gun with a particularly nasty recoil, it will probably push my chest and head forward slightly at the most. Physically knock me down, even if I wasn't bracing myself? That's Tom and Jerry physics.
I don't see much point arguing what Michael Brown's balance was when he got shot. People (and animals) almost never die absolutely instantly when shot. I even saw a cat take a direct hit getting rolled over by a car tire, and that cat still made it all the way off the road before dying. Michael Brown could have made any kind of reflexive movements before falling face forward. It really doesn't indicate anything either way.
Maybe he was overwhelmed by the smell emanating from the cop's trousers.
JohnRM
Don't make me destroy you
That all depends on the orders and your version of unreasonable. Provided that the orders are causing you real harm, just follow the orders and file a complaint and lawsuit later. If the cop is ordering you to put your cigarette out on your eyeball, feel free resist.
How hard is this to understand?
If a cop gives you an order, you don't have to agree that he is justified or right to do so. All I am saying is that if you plan to resist, plan to get beat and/or shot. It is only common sense.
Especially given the lack of common sense of many cops.
We have the problem where cops are ordering you not to film them, to give over your phone and camera, to disperse protests and forfeit your right to assemble, to comply with their obstruction of evidence. A guy was ordered not to pick up his own dog after the police just shot it. A guy was ordered to vacate his spot at a drive-thru by a cop in his squad car with his lights on. Evidently getting his hamburger on taxpayer time was "police business". Flat out unlawful orders. If you resist those orders, should you expect to get beat? Yes. Are you justified in resisting? Yes. Is acting in self defence using all means necessary justified? Yes.
Senethro
Overlord
also lolling at darren wilsons cheerleaders saying proper redress against police should be sought in courts
Timsup2nothin
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So in other words, yeah, as far as you are concerned those guys should have gotten up out of their wheelchairs as they were told, and the beating they got is fine by you.
By the way, the one time I considered filing a complaint, just for the experience of it, I consider myself lucky to have gotten out of the police station.
"You hate cops, and cops know that only criminals hate cops, therefor the cop who pulled a gun on you was totally right in doing so because you're obviously a criminal. If you weren't a criminal you would love cops, and have no complaint. So, do you really have a complaint?"
As to filing a lawsuit, if I had the financial horsepower to line up enough attorney power to compete with the city attorney and the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department legal division I would just buy a third world country and install my own police force there. The idea sounds great as a cop out if you don't really want to think about the issue, but in practice it's an absurdity.
Before you even get started you face the real world fact that it is an accepted precedent that 'the officer is a trained observer, so if your testimony contradicts his, his will be automatically accepted in the absence of other evidence'. In short, your attorney will have to prove every word you say with some added corroboration, and the officer can describe events however he wants.
"He yelled 'get on the ground and a string of expletives'."
"I asked him to stop so I could ask him some questions."
Well, there's a bit of a discrepancy, so we'll go with the trained observer. Then what happened?
Filing a lawsuit against cops is an uphill climb. The judge can toss the case for any number of reasons, the big one being sovereign immunity. If you actually get to trial, a judge or a jury is likely going to give the cop a good head start on credibility whether warranted or not.
Timsup2nothin
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So is scaling Mount Everest in boxer shorts. It's amazing more people don't suggest that.
Bamspeedy
CheeseBob
The baseball has more mass, that's like the size of a fist, and I don't doubt you can knock someone over with a punch.
sophie
Break My Heart
Also a baseball isn't pointed.
Bamspeedy
CheeseBob
This is the internet so we don't need to conduct any experiments, there are enough gruesome videos you can find of real shots to the head. Obviously we can't post them here.
Three I looked up. One was a robber shot in the face by a store clerk, the robber was leaning forward over the counter. Yes, he landed on his back but it doesn't appear it was from the force of the bullet, but his legs kicking forward. Like he was falling straight down and the counter did not offer any support (the counter appeared as solid as a folding table, not bolted to the floor or anything).
Another guy sitting in an interrogation room, shoots himself in the head on his left side with a .45. His head barely moves before slumping to his left, where the bullet came from.
Another man standing up took about 5 shots to the head before slumping forward.
Three I looked up. One was a robber shot in the face by a store clerk, the robber was leaning forward over the counter. Yes, he landed on his back but it doesn't appear it was from the force of the bullet, but his legs kicking forward. Like he was falling straight down and the counter did not offer any support (the counter appeared as solid as a folding table, not bolted to the floor or anything).
Another guy sitting in an interrogation room, shoots himself in the head on his left side with a .45. His head barely moves before slumping to his left, where the bullet came from.
Another man standing up took about 5 shots to the head before slumping forward.
