Game of Thrones Season 5 discussion thread

[Atticus]

Before seeing the TV-series I begun to read the first part of Ice & Fire, but quit it after 100 pages or so. The problem was that he switched through the main characters and none of them became familiar enough to be interesting by that time. In TV that works since the passages are usually shorter, but in novel it would have been better if he'd stayed with one character long enough to make his/her story interesting enough.

 

[Birdjaguar]

You didn't read enough. Go back and read another 400 pages.

 

[Evie]

Or don't, because any character whose story becomes interesting or endearing gets scheduled for a meeting with a knife, sword, noose, poison vial, stake, bonfire, dragon, spear or other implement of death shortly thereafter, and their story peter out due to a terminal case of death.

 

[Kyriakos]

The Wildlings are not at castle black. They were given lands south of the wall, in the episode you could see them march straight through the castle and out the southern gates.

They can't be that far away, though, i mean they were mostly left to pass through so as to help fight against the WW when they reach the Wall.

 

[Gucumatz]

So I was rewatching part of the series and was wondering what would have happened if Tyrion's plan with the wildfire didn't go off as planned and Stannis was able to take the city. Its not like the war would have ended, instead the Lannisters and Tyrells would have been the ones beginning a protracted siege.

What do you all think Stannis would have done next (had he won the battle of the blackwater)? He didn't want to ally himself with Rob under Rob's terms, he had minimal/next to no diplomatic prowess, and would have been in a city already low on resources. I think he would have eventually had to have abandoned King's landing by sea and the war would continue. With Myrcella outside of his reach, there would have been no way for the war to end it seems

 

[Kyriakos]

^I doubt the Tyrells would still ally with the Lans if KL fell.

Btw, prior to the foundation of KL (i assume by the first Targaryen), which city was the regional capital there? (i mean including the territories now crown-lands)

 

[Gucumatz]

The thing is the Tyrells (Marg and Loras) both want something more (power and revenge respectively), they would continue pushing for something. With Tommen and Joffrey captured/possibly killed by Stannis, Myrcella becomes the key pawn - which would mean Dorne's involvement, even if the Tyrells just packed up and went home

As for the prior capital, I have no idea

 

[Yeekim]

Harrenhall... I think.

 

[Leifmk]

I've also heard his short stories are more literary but I haven't read any of them yet.

You should; they're great. Especially "Sandkings" and "The Way of Cross and Dragon" (both award winners back in the day). His earlier novels are pretty sweet too (at least the ones I've read). One legit criticism of ASOIAF is excessive bloat and sprawl; his shorter works do not suffer from this.

 

[MacAttack]

Before seeing the TV-series I begun to read the first part of Ice & Fire, but quit it after 100 pages or so. The problem was that he switched through the main characters and none of them became familiar enough to be interesting by that time. In TV that works since the passages are usually shorter, but in novel it would have been better if he'd stayed with one character long enough to make his/her story interesting enough.

I'm guessing you have the attention span of a Yorkie, the first half of the book is basically introducing you to the World of Ice and Fire through the character's point of view. Once you are done with the intros, it is more interesting. The way the books are written, makes them really easy and quick to read. What I like about this style, is that there are a lot of stopping points, since when I actually have time to read, I'm always interrupted during that time.

So I was rewatching part of the series and was wondering what would have happened if Tyrion's plan with the wildfire didn't go off as planned and Stannis was able to take the city. Its not like the war would have ended, instead the Lannisters and Tyrells would have been the ones beginning a protracted siege.

What do you all think Stannis would have done next (had he won the battle of the blackwater)? He didn't want to ally himself with Rob under Rob's terms, he had minimal/next to no diplomatic prowess, and would have been in a city already low on resources. I think he would have eventually had to have abandoned King's landing by sea and the war would continue. With Myrcella outside of his reach, there would have been no way for the war to end it seems

In times like that, sacking a capital is a major accomplishment that could turn the tide of a war. Who knows how much Lannister gold and arms they would have captured. And with Kings Landing being such a large city, who knows how much of a bigger army Stannis could have conscripted from the populace.

He probably would have gone straight for Lannisport and Casterly Rock to secure the gold mines so he can in turn finance the rest of his military campaign. Which would be heading to the North to unseat the Boltons.

^I doubt the Tyrells would still ally with the Lans if KL fell.

Btw, prior to the foundation of KL (i assume by the first Targaryen), which city was the regional capital there? (i mean including the territories now crown-lands)

This should help.


Link to video.

 

[Cynovolans]

You should; they're great. Especially "Sandkings" and "The Way of Cross and Dragon" (both award winners back in the day). His earlier novels are pretty sweet too (at least the ones I've read). One legit criticism of ASOIAF is excessive bloat and sprawl; his shorter works do not suffer from this.

Thanks for the recommendations. I think I'll get his Dreamsong compilation since these stories are included in it.

 

[Snerk]

This should help.


Link to video.

Great video.

 

[MacAttack]

Great video.

I know! it is great. It is one of several. I caution if you have not watched/read the series as a spoiler alert.

 

[Arwon]

I think you're talking about two different skills - Martin certainly is very good at coming up with a good story of working out what to write about, but you could argue that his writing in itself isn't all that good. Put another way, the main attraction of the book series is what is said, rather than how it is said - compare that with Ulysses, as an extreme example of a book where the content matters for almost nothing and the manner of putting it across is everything. Martin might well not do a very good job of narrating somebody else's story, compared with the original author. To my mind that would certainly be a factor in explaining why his work is attractive for a television show - it doesn't depend on being a book, because the actual words that he uses are comparatively unimportant.

I think there's a number of great writers whose prose is fairly sparse and utilitarian.

 

[Snerk]

I know! it is great. It is one of several. I caution if you have not watched/read the series as a spoiler alert.

Will start A Dance with Dragons after I finish my current book. Partly because there's a bunch of videos I want to watch that contain ADWD spoilers that I don't want to hear just yet.

These videos are also great:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLn6yDpEottdhisSEKJE3Sv5fpYQuej0Ju

 

[GoodSarmatian]

So I was rewatching part of the series and was wondering what would have happened if Tyrion's plan with the wildfire didn't go off as planned and Stannis was able to take the city. Its not like the war would have ended, instead the Lannisters and Tyrells would have been the ones beginning a protracted siege.

Would they ? I think Stannis would have been smart enough to take Joffrey and Cercei hostage which could have been enough to convince the Lannisters and Tyrell's (whose claim to the throne now rests on an arranged marriage between Joffrey and Margery) to lay off for the time being.

I think there's a number of great writers whose prose is fairly sparse and utilitarian.

Most science-fiction actually, and that's what I like about it. I don't want the plot to stop because someone feels the need to show off his extensive knowledge of adjectives while describing a hill on a tree for two pages.

 

[Atticus]

I'm guessing you have the attention span of a Yorkie, the first half of the book is basically introducing you to the World of Ice and Fire through the character's point of view. Once you are done with the intros, it is more interesting.

It might be, but a book that doesn't give any reason to read on in hundred pages is imo failed, no matter how good the rest of it is.

It wasn't the only thing I quit reading though, for example I came under the impression that it will contain plenty of fantastic coincidences, due to the Stark matching puppies. Now I've come to realize that wasn't what the book was going at.

 

[Kyriakos]

^AFAIK Grimartin had other original plans for his series, and then it got hugely bloated. Currently he likely is not very happy with writing any more of it. Which is certain to make the final book(s) worse than anything before them.

Besides, it is not like any writer can keep on working on the same book for so many years if he at least is not reclusive/literary-centered, such as Proust. And ASOIAF is not exactly In Search of Time Lost anyway

(nor is Martin Gustave Flaubert).

PS: Writing a good script is not close to writing a good book. It is not even that similar. In the movie/tv you already have set forms for your beings/environment. In a book your main work is to make those mean something, often in less direct ways than description of form.

 

[Birdjaguar]

^AFAIK Grimartin had other original plans for his series, and then it got hugely bloated. Currently he likely is not very happy with writing any more of it. Which is certain to make the final book(s) worse than anything before them.

So how far along in actually reading the books are you?

 

[MacAttack]

Will start A Dance with Dragons after I finish my current book. Partly because there's a bunch of videos I want to watch that contain ADWD spoilers that I don't want to hear just yet.

These videos are also great:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLn6yDpEottdhisSEKJE3Sv5fpYQuej0Ju

I tried sharing those videos here but got slammed for that because of the narrator's voice.