GR29 - AWM vs 30 civs, Pangea

There's a settler in Seattle, so we should start expanding here again. The French will probably take Miami in the next IBT, so that means we will have to deal with them. Up till now they've ignored us.
Spoiler :
gr297neast.jpg


Lots of settler pairs coming this way. I had a mind to allow them to settle as with the German and Bab town to the South east, they've just grown to size 2. The army is on its way there to take them now. The idea of letting the AI settle these town for us is not bad, but it's annoying when they step on used tiles and get near workers. I had to kill several.
Spoiler :
gr296east.jpg

Since Adrianople was abandoned, the byzantines have come from the coast line towards Sinop. Might be a good idea to extend our line past the mountains. I've send one horseman south to scout the coastline. Since they've been dropping settlers behind our back.
Spoiler :
gr295west.jpg

 
Excellent. :thumbsup: Getting our line in the southwest anchored against the coast is a big gain.

Ye gods! Settler stacks everywhere! They're everywhere and can't be stopped! I guess this is how the people in Arizone must feel like? :mischief:

:lol:

I've got it. Things are complicated enough now that this probably won't be a quick turnaround.
 
nice :D. Let's try and get stable fronts so we can finally start expanding in all directions. You also have to hope for city limit max out to stop all those settler pairs. Quite annoying.
 
Things are going slowly in RL terms, but well in game terms. We've shaken two Immortal armies free of their defensive responsibilities, and they're out razing important enemy cities.

I'll post in time for Greebley to play on the weekend.
 
650 (1): On the western front proper we smash just two Aztec units, for lack of fast units to make safe attacks (2-0).

In the far west (Kandahar and Varna) we obliterate two Byzantine MDI (4-0).

In the east we dispose of a French elite swordsman and an Indian settler/spear team (6-0).

I change two Immortal builds about to complete to horsemen. There are too many attacks we can't make without exposing a slow unit.


660 (2): On the western front we savage two Korean swordsmen and an Aztec horseman (9-0).

In the east we tan the hide of a Japanese spearman outside Seattle (10-0).


670 (3): On the western front we club a Korean MDI/spear pair and gain a Leader/army (12-0).

We storm Hindana, the Babylonian junk city in the southeast, held by two spearmen (14-0).

We bombard and bludgeon an Indian settler/spear pair outside Newer York, and shatter a similar American team near Persian Potpourri (16-0). I see the point of letting the enemy found cities for us, but too much trouble can develop from an enemy town while it grows to size two behind our lines, when we're stretched so thin. I'd rather just keep things simple and harvest the free workers.

Around West Greebley we smite four Aztec units, two of them swordsmen (20-0).

Outside Chicagogo in the east we overrun two French units and an Egyptian swordsman, scooping up another two settlers (23-0).

We trample a German swordsman approaching Guimaraes (24-0).

In the far west we consume a pu-pu platter of a Hoplite, a Greek swordsman, a Byzantine pikeman, a Korean spearman, and two settlers (28-0).

The French commit themselves around Guimaraes in the east.

We skim a worker off Pee-wee's Playhouse, which is stuck at size six with a full food box.


690 (4): We move two Immortal armies next to Constantinople, disposing of an Inca settler/spear team en route (29-0).

Also in the far west we account for a Korean spearman, a Byz MDI, a Greek swordsman, and a Greek settler (32-0).

On the western front we bombard and batter four Aztec units adjacent to west Greebley (36-0).

We break two French swordsmen around Chicagogo in the east (38-0).

We found Altin Tepe, pushing our line beyond Chicagogo.

Farther south on the eastern front we eliminate four French archers, a German swordsman, and Indian and Egyptian settler/spear teams (45-0).


690 (5): We meet the Celts. They have fourteen cities and silks and they're slightly behind us in tech. We declare war.

We root out the first three pikemen of Constantinople's garrison, but the town remains defended (48-0).

We seize Salzburg, the German junk town in the far southeast, held by two spearmen (50-0).

We found Bunyan on the coast east of Sidon--almost a core city.

We slay eight Aztec units between Pee-wee's Playhouse and West Greebley (58-0).

We hack down a Bab Bowman landed near Lisbon (59-0).

Around Seattle we upend three Japanese horsemen (62-0).

Farther south on the eastern front we topple three French archers and a French spearman (66-0).

We mop up a final French spearman of the force sent towards Guimaraes (67-0).

BTW HTF does Pee-wee's Playhouse have a Byzantine citizen? ;)

In the east we lose a spearman occupying a mountain to a Bab MDI attacking out of the fog along roads (67-1).


700 (6): We raze Constantinople, held by just one additional pikeman (68-1).

The Aztecs haven't reinforced the attack wave we just wiped out at all. Perhaps they have another war on their hands.

On the western front we liquidate eight Korean units, including an MDI and a pikeman (76-1).

In the east we rout six French, one Babylonian, and two Japanese units, mostly around Altin Tepe in the centre of the front. We lose an Immortal (85-2).

We redline and repel an attacking Japanese horseman outside Altin Tepe.

West Greebley completes its barracks.


710 (7): Our two-army strike force in the Byzantine lands moves next to Caesarea, harrowing an Aztec settler/spear pair on the way (86-2).

We auto-raze New Bombay, founded in the southeast two turns ago. It already had a garrison of two spearmen and an archer (89-2).

We slice and dice a Byz archer advancing on Antalya in the tundra (90-2).

On the western front we expunge just one Inca, one Aztec, and two Korean units (94-2).

The eastern front is quiet too with few targets visible, and our armies heal. We pick off the redlined Japanese horseman, and a Japanese settler/spear pair outside Lisbon (96-2).


720 (8): We take and briefly hold Caesarea, since it’s going to be hard to get slaves from razing back to our lines now (garrison of two pikemen and an archer; 99-2).

On the western front we pulverize a Korean stack of four, a Korean settler/spear team, a Byz MDI, and a Carthaginian settler/warrior pair (106-2).

The Chinese appear, unsurprisingly enough in the form of a settler/spear team. They have dyes, gems, and fifteen cities, one of them Iroquois-founded. They’re still in the AA, lacking Currency. We declare war.

The east is again fairly quiet, as we mop up four isolated enemies of four nationalities, and a Bab settler (110-2).

A German stack of eight approaches in the east.


730 (9): The Fourth Immortal Army winkles out two spearmen at French-held Miami, but the town remains garrisoned (112-2).

On the central eastern front we bombard and spit a stack of three French swordsmen, and gain our second Leader/army of the round, on our twenty-ninth elite victory (115-2).

The settler tsunami brings us another new enemy, Rome. Caesar has dyes and twenty-one cities, all native. He’s even with us in technology. We declare war.

Also in the east we swat a German spearman and a Japanese settler/spear team (117-2).

In the west we bullyrag a stack of four Aztec swordsmen, another Aztec swordsman, a Hoplite, and a Korean pikeman (124-2).

Our two-Immortal strike force moves next to Smyrna, the new Byzantine capital.


740 (10): We storm Miami, held by two remaining French spearmen (126-2).

We extirpate three pikemen in Smyrna, but the town remains garrisoned (129-2).

In the east we liquidate nine enemy units, predominantly German, and two settlers (138-2).

In the west we eradicate four enemies (142-2).

Five Indian horsemen move next to Altin Tepe. Stacks of fast units are a new problem.


750 (11): We found Charsadda between Guimaraes and Miami, and then replace Miami with Ura Tyube to avoid unpleasant situations involving flip risk to armies, giving us a coherent line along the eastern front.

We seize and soon abandon Smyrna, held by a remaining garrison of two spearmen (144-2).

In the west the takeout menu features two Numidians, a Carthaginian warrior, two Aztec spearmen, three Korean MDI, a Byz MDI, and four settlers (153-2). We gain our third Leader/army of the round outside Pee-wee’s Playhouse.

In the east we dispense with eleven enemy units, five of them German, and a settler (164-2).

Bah—we’ll probably lose an Immortal on the IT, since I didn’t see that a tundra road tile was in fog and could contain an enemy unit.

I don’t see any of their units, but the Maya are on the diplo list, so we declare war. They have sixteen cities (one Egyptian) and no luxuries, and they’re behind us by Engineering.

Ho-hum, the Russians join the settler jamboree. They have wines and fifteen cities, and they’re even with us in tech. There are workers in their capital, so they might be at war. They are now, as we declare. :lol:

Forty-one elite victories this round generated three Great Leaders—almost normal expectation, which is good for this game.
 
We have solid lines on both fronts now, and we’re holding them without difficulty. We have one pair of armies operating in the Byzantine core, and if our luck is decent we should be able to send another pair beyond our lines during the next round.

In the longer view, though, we now have eighteen enemies, with just one crippled (America) and another seriously damaged (the Byzantines). That’s cause for concern.

Since we’re still in the settler frenzy, the other enemy civs are filling in the Byzantine core as fast as we demolish it, but the junk towns they’re founding will never hurt us.

The attack at Nicaea shouldn’t go in next turn—one army needs to heal and the other is on the wrong side of the river.

The Great Library gave us no techs this round. The Koreans have evidently had a monopoly on Invention for quite a while.

Our new Ninth Army is sitting empty in Pee-wee’s Playhouse. Possibly we should start leaving every other army empty for knights, starting with this one, but it’s a close call and whatever you decide is fine. This section of our front does have the lowest ratio of armies to enemy units now.

We have four settlers. The one SE of Johnny Quest can found where it stands next turn; this area seems safe. The two in Varna and Altin Tepe have their movement to call attention to them. The settler in Bactra should definitely move before we hit Enter, but I’ve left the choice to you since there are various options. Since we’re at thirty-nine cites (counting the upcoming foundation) and nine armies, we do want to get one more city down soon.

We have a one-turn roading stack on the hill W of Kandahar. We can use it next turn or just pull the workers back, depending on what’s tactically convenient. It’ll depend on how our enemies move.

There are roading stacks under the army and the independent Immortal next to Charsadda, too.

If the mining project next to Horse Town has to be abandoned because enemy units approach, that’s fine. I started the job because these workers had nothing else to do last turn.

Arbela will complete the FP in four turns. Other than that we have a minor infra drive going—one aqueduct and one courthouse.

We’re building some settlers in towns that will otherwise get stuck at size six with full food boxes, in addition to the capital’s operating as a four-turn settler pump.

Some of our walls builds will probably be unnecessary by the time they reach nineteen shields, so keep an eye on them.

It would be good to get an MP unit into Guimaraes, since it’s on a river and shouldn’t be stuck at no surplus food. Icky Twerp is stuck at no growth too, though it’s not on a river.
 
The Byzantine wastes (with Tolosa instantly founded on the ruins of Constantinople):

GR29-750ADi.jpg


New in the east:

GR29-750ADii.jpg


Excuse the thick bands of white--I have no idea what happened there. :confused:
 
great progress :goodjob:

I do agree that the high number of enemies is really a concern. Do we know whether east or west is less busy?
 
Wow, nice few rounds. I'm kind of baffled by the tech pace. I'm pretty sure I forgot about the scientist for 1 or 3 turns when I was up and we're still already 25 turns towards invention.
 
Wow, nice few rounds. I'm kind of baffled by the tech pace. I'm pretty sure I forgot about the scientist for 1 or 3 turns when I was up and we're still already 25 turns towards invention.

The very high tech costs can really effect Monarchy games, though 25+ turns without invention is probably higher than usual. If this wasn't an AW game the tech pace would be boring, but for AW it allows us to make progress without the techs flying by.

In any case I got it.
 
I do agree that the high number of enemies is really a concern. Do we know whether east or west is less busy?

Seven enemies are in the west, ten in the east (including Japan, despite the location of Sapporo), and we don't know about the Maya.

When we won GR12 as the Hittites, also AWM pangaea, we started on a peninsula at the end of the landmass. In addition to the immediate tactical advantages, that meant that some enemies had to cross the whole world to find us. Here we're seeing the converse case--we're in the middle of the map, no one has to traverse more than half the world to reach us, and we're accumulating enemies quickly.
 
Note - I wrote this first part without noticing ThERat's question. Guess I wanted to know too. :)

I check our borders to see who is where.

To the West:
Korea, Aztec, Greece, Inca, Carthage, Byzantine, Celts, (and a Japanese town)

To the North:
America, Babylon, China, Germany, India, Maya, France, Japan, Egypt, Rome, and Russia.

Couldn't figure out Russia until I saw their settler in 770 AD. Rome I could figure out because we have 2 Roman Workers to the North, though the kill wasn't listed and Celts had settled a town.

Two are dead: Portugal and Ottomans. 10 are unmet.

As expected from our place on the map, North has more Civs than West.

I would like to explore the coast a bit if we can. I change one build to Galley to try it out.

For the Army, I am unsure if we should wait for Chivalry or fill it with Immortals.

Looking at Culture the Byzantine are behind us. We can keep towns if it we wish. Keeping a short border though makes most not keepable.

Killed 3 Pikes in Nicaea, but we need to heal. Spear is now on top instead of Pike.

IBT: We lose an Immortal (nearly win vs the MDI) and have an Incense pillaged on the Border (1 of 3). New stack of 5 Aztec sword appear.

760: Build Snow on the tundra borders.

IBT: We get Chivalry

770 AD: Attacked Atlanta to kill 3 Spear. West border is fairly complex with a lot of units (including the Aztec swords) and North is more quiet. Aztecs also have Horsemen.

I raised the Lux rate. We are short on MP's but I want to build Knights to fill the first Army rather than Pikes for MP duty.

IBT: We finally learn Invention from the Byzantines and Koreans (The West definitely seems more technically advanced) an start a min run on Gunpowder. A regular immortal completes. I think we missed spotting that for the last 40 turns.

780 AD: Kill final Spear in Atlanta. Also kill the two Spear in Houston. I captured both of them for now. It takes 8 hp to kill a Spear with our Army next to Nicaea. Other Army heals to keep at least one Army at high hp. Build Antioch near some deer.

IBT: Greeks also have Horses. Our FP completes.

790 AD: We have more culture than the Americans and are short on Settlers. I am going to keep the American cities. Build another city, Nile between Atlanta and Altin Tepe. It is kind of tight but it keeps Atlanta safer - er.. actually across the river would have been much better, but it is too late now. In fact its placement was due to two things:
1) Stupidity
2) Nothing else.

800 AD: We finally take out Nicaea. On the Northern front, we are dealing with new Babylonians showing up near Houston. Manage to get a Leader for our 10th Army.

IBT: Build our first Knight. Saw Celts and Carthage fight with Carthage losing a Settler.

810 AD: Attack Incan Ica and have to cover with other Army. The western Spears are doing way more damage than average. We really would like the area near Ica as it has Wine.

IBT: Another civ sending lots of units - France has a stack of 5 Sword, 5 Spear, and an Archer, with some other Horsemen stacks.

820 AD: Ica is Destroyed. Making way for Settling Wines. Fill the first of 2 Armies
Captured Babylon city of Tell Wilaya to the North.

IBT: France units immediately turn and head for Tell Willaya. Greece is also showing up with a lot of units.

830 AD: Move army out of Tell Willaya and abandon it. Build a town To Wines to get closer to the Wine. Its location isn't ideal but is limited by a Celt town location.

IBT: France is back to heading toward us.

840 AD: Fight defensively for the most part. Some Armies are healing.
We get a leader which becomes our 11th Army. Two Armies are waiting for Knights to fill.

IBT: Our town gets attacked and the RNG isn't good. We lose a Pike and an Immortal.

850 AD: More killing. There are a lot of enemies. I do attack Tolosa.

Notes:
Some more initial rushes are coming. Japan is showing up with a bunch of units, and I see the initial German rush not that far away.

Moved a MP out of Pasadena and didn't adjust - I still do this after so many AW games. Sigh.

We have 3 unfilled Armies. Do we want to speed up filling these? I will post a suggestion/discussion in another post.

Maneuvering units is still tricky. I think we can improve our front lines.

GR29_AD850b.jpg


GR29_AD850a.jpg


GR29_AD850.jpg
 
We have 3 unfilled Armies and a good bit of cash. I think it is worth upgrading all our Horses to Knights and filling some Armies. We are a bit hard pressed at the moment and I think we need to get out there and start razing cities again. For that we need more Armies.

I also spotted my first enemy Knights on the final turn from Babylon. None have reached our borders yet.

I was also wondering if we made a mistake by leaving unfilled land. We met enemies much faster because of it. At the time though we didn't know we wouldn't hit the city limit however, so I am not suprised we didn't think of this issue.
 
Excellent work. :thumbsup:

We have seven horsemen, of which one is an unasterisked elite and another is deep in the tundra on lookout duty. I think upgrading the other five to knights for 600 gold would be fine.

Oops, we're at peace with the Mongols, so we'll need to correct that. They're still in the AA, with twelve cities and silks.

I was also wondering if we made a mistake by leaving unfilled land. We met enemies much faster because of it. At the time though we didn't know we wouldn't hit the city limit however, so I am not suprised we didn't think of this issue.

I don't see what we could have done differently even if we had thought of it. We settled land as quickly as we could; the cities we razed or abandoned we couldn't have held; and not attacking when we're free to attack isn't a serious option in these games.
 
I was also wondering if we made a mistake by leaving unfilled land. We met enemies much faster because of it. At the time though we didn't know we wouldn't hit the city limit however, so I am not suprised we didn't think of this issue.

Don't think we could have filled all that tundra without being off a lot worse than we are now. Though perhaps we should have at least claimed all the bonusses. But even then, we don't know if there's some hidden oil that is drawing all those settlers.
 
I agree that it would have been better to fill the land but I don't think that would have been possible.

We simply have a bad starting location. Anyway, great progress, let's hope we can get to cavalry faster.
 
Roster:

Greebley - Just Played
Commando Bob - UP
ThERat - On Deck
Daeron
Northern Pike
 
Ya the large amount of Tundra to our south was a problem in that regard. If we had left the tundra towns alive, the would produce little - the question I don't know is whether that would have been sufficient to stop the settlers. If they did we might know 4-6 less civs. It might be a net gain for us. Not sure though that the tundra would have been entirely filled, and there would be the risk of having to deal with all the civs we met AND have towns to the south. It might be worth considering for a similar game - simply ignore the tundra area entirely. Only clear it out when we feel we can deal with additional civs.

So it complete speculation, but might be interesting to consider.
Another thing that could be considered would be to keep towns even though it slows you down somewhat - the slower pace is made up by needing less settlers and meeting less civs.

Edit: I think I forgot to check diplomacy for the last few turns. I didn't spot the Mongol units, it is probably a settler pair that looks like some other civ. I don't think we could have met them more than 3 turns ago. I will try to do better.

Agree with NP's upgrade plan for the Horses.
 
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