Learning Diety: Hateshput Re-roll

[Revent]

that 14 cities Korea blob is worrying. Will be interesting to see how you deal with it.

Boudica will dea with that and hopefully they kill each others stack

Ah good now I can post my shadow now that you hit the 50BC mark. First of all nice job so far @Revent. Your game looks promising so far. Anyway here is where I am at in 50BC:

Spoiler :

Early tech path was AH>mining>BW>writing, skipping fishing until a bit later. Once horses popped in my capitol, I sent my warrior over to Augustus to steal a worker, then continued with a chariot rush. I was able to camp a chariot near his copper before he had a chance to hook it up then I eventually was able to take all of his cities. By the time I got to his capitol, he had finished both stonehenge and the mids for me which was very nice of him. I actually kept most of his cities unlike you and by the end of the war my economy was more in the hole than you were. I think at worst I was at like -20 gpt at 0% research. I was resorting to things like working coastal tiles without a lighthouse and even working priests instead of 0 commerce tiles.

Anyway thanks to the mids I was able to keep chugging along with my research. I went aesth after writing to trade for alpha, which turned out to be a mistake since no one on my continent seemed to want to research alpha, then I finally self-teched fishing to get my seafood online. Around this time I popped a great engineer from Rome (thanks again Augustus) so I detoured to Lit before going for currency (I was still trying to hold out for the alpha trade). After Lit I teched Math>currency then I broke down and self-teched Alpha, finishing it in 75BC. So here I am at 50BC with 9 cities. I just picked up sailing and I'm building a galley to settle to island to my NW. I have 3 settlers already built and ready to claim my island. I used an engineer to build the GL and I have 2 scientists on hold for bulbing. I decided to skip the academy since I am at 0% research and my beakers are spread out throughout my empire.

Pictures:

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

Thanks! I'm not sure how the other continent is going though, so this game could go either way! Yeah, that is the reason why I researched Alpha myself' because I was not sure of the chance of an AI researching it for me! Not sure about my research either to be honest. I think when it comes time to war, I might switch over to Vassalage, Theocracy and Slavery. That's 9XP Cuirs out of the bag and if I settle a GG in my HE city, that's 11XP!

It's not a particularly easy game this one I think.

I think I might go for a double front war here. Not sure if it's wise, but attacking Boudica and Wang Kon at the same time might be the only way to go if I want to keep my military advantage.

 

[Revent]

T117-T141

1 Turn from Lib, I'm pretty sure that I've won the race to it. Now I have to go towards MT which may take some time, have to tech Gunpowder, Aesthetics, Lit and Music

However, for that, I am already building forges, barracks and stables in most of my cities so that when the time comes to whip, I will do it like crazy

Spoiler :

 

[Mylene]

Looks like you could have teched Aest + Compass, and bulb Lib ~~
Almost always a good play.

 

[ABigCivFan]

3 seafood spot at the top of the NW island. it should have been the first island city ever settled. It can be a great GP farm and or Globe Theater cav whipping factory.

 

[Gumbolt]

Looks like a curs rush may still be possible. Will you be able to take out the 2 large Ai on your continent and still tech to astronomy and conquer the other AI? Curs date 900-1000ad? You need aesth/lit/music/Nationalism/gunpowder and MT. I would not risk liberalism by waiting. I have seen it go at 400AD or earlier on Deity. 300 beakers difference really between MT and nationalism.

I think you can bulb astronomy with GS as long as you don't have engineering. The issue will be how advanced the other continent is. You have another 5 Ai over there to beat down. You may be able to get a UN or AP victory but the bonuses the AI get for each age are huge.

The issue with domination will be your science rate. You have very few cottages. Your capital is producing 50-60 beakers a turn at 50-60%. I am not sure a uni here is really helping you. Move capital at some point?

I am a bit confused why you have a spare settler on the ice island yet a 3 food GP farm spot is left unsettled. I would of settled that island first. Then considered the barren islands. When the extra trade routes go these will be weak cities.

 

[Shaandore]

@Revent:

You are doing a great job on deity, you are a fast learner. (I wish I could progress so fast...)

I only have a technical advice: please switch on resource bubbles before taking screenshots. They help a lot when I don't have time to open the saves.

 

[Revent]

3 seafood spot at the top of the NW island. it should have been the first island city ever settled. It can be a great GP farm and or Globe Theater cav whipping factory.

I just discovered that area pretty recently! I think I'm going to use it for GT.

@Revent:

You are doing a great job on deity, you are a fast learner. (I wish I could progress so fast...)

I only have a technical advice: please switch on resource bubbles before taking screenshots. They help a lot when I don't have time to open the saves.

Thanks!

Oh sorry, I just felt that in a large map, it would be a bit cluttered.

Looks like a curs rush may still be possible. Will you be able to take out the 2 large Ai on your continent and still tech to astronomy and conquer the other AI? Curs date 900-1000ad? You need aesth/lit/music/Nationalism/gunpowder and MT. I would not risk liberalism by waiting. I have seen it go at 400AD or earlier on Deity. 300 beakers difference really between MT and nationalism.

I think you can bulb astronomy with GS as long as you don't have engineering. The issue will be how advanced the other continent is. You have another 5 Ai over there to beat down. You may be able to get a UN or AP victory but the bonuses the AI get for each age are huge.

The issue with domination will be your science rate. You have very few cottages. Your capital is producing 50-60 beakers a turn at 50-60%. I am not sure a uni here is really helping you. Move capital at some point?

I am a bit confused why you have a spare settler on the ice island yet a 3 food GP farm spot is left unsettled. I would of settled that island first. Then considered the barren islands. When the extra trade routes go these will be weak cities.

Lib->Nationalism, Aesthetics and Music is easy to tech. No one on the continent even has Music That continent I think is pretty advanced though but at the same time, maybe lots of wars? Maybe one civ or two civs may be running away. I think I'm going to beeline to the UN. Use Caste to generate GM's which I think bulb that route and hopefully try to be the first to it. Then use diplomacy to win if possible. Shame I can't AP cheese

Yes definitely need to move capital, not enough beakers being produced, barely any riverside land on this continent so not very helpful.

Do you think a 2 front war with both Boudica and Wang Kon is possible?

Looks like you could have teched Aest + Compass, and bulb Lib ~~
Almost always a good play.

Oh right, I never actually knew that! Thanks though! That honestly would have made life a lot easier

 

[Mylene]

Do you think a 2 front war with both Boudica and Wang Kon is possible?

No benefit in doing that
You would send them both into unit spam mode, Wang is protective and Boudi has good war traits..dun underestimate the amount of units you need on Deity

 

[Revent]

No benefit in doing that
You would send them both into unit spam mode, Wang is protective and Boudi has good war traits..dun underestimate the amount of units you need on Deity

Hmm...which would you personally suggest then?

Also, how on earth do you manage to upgrade all those cuirs to cavs in your games? I just never find myself with enough gold after all the wars.

 

[Mylene]

Well, i stop building everything that's not needed in favor of wealth.
Keeping an eye on selling techs and resources also important, often there is someone behind who will buy music, theology..it's just 80g per upgrade i think, really not that bad.

In Doshin's game i did not upgrade them all before declaring Giggles, that mostly happened after i took some cities and with 100% gold slider it's no biggie really.
There's only 1 rule on Deity: Never try doing 2 same thingies at once, you aim for Cavs and domination? Forget about everything that brings no gold or Rifling *now*

About your war target...get an army, and we can talk about that

 

[pigswill]

Its worth noting that Bod and Wang have been at war since 100ad and are already in unit spam mode, even though Bod has taken two of Wang's cities their power difference is minimal. Bod is friendly with you so allying with Bod vs Wang is probably your only option, whether you can capture enough Korean cities not to be overwhelmed by Bod may become the issue

 

[Revent]

Well, i stop building everything that's not needed in favor of wealth.
Keeping an eye on selling techs and resources also important, often there is someone behind who will buy music, theology..it's just 80g per upgrade i think, really not that bad.

In Doshin's game i did not upgrade them all before declaring Giggles, that mostly happened after i took some cities and with 100% gold slider it's no biggie really.
There's only 1 rule on Deity: Never try doing 2 same thingies at once, you aim for Cavs and domination? Forget about everything that brings no gold or Rifling *now*

About your war target...get an army, and we can talk about that

Okay, so I tried playing this on, but Wang Kon got to Rifling before I could even get to MT! I'm not sure, maybe I'm not generating the right great people or something, but it is pretty damn hard for me in my current state to get to MT ASAP. I lose Lib next turn as well so it's not that I can bulb MT. My economy sucks really badly because I didn't build enough cottages. Honestly see no way out of this to be honest.

Hope it's not too much to ask, but do you think it's winnable at this position? I honestly don't think I could do it and would love if someone could show me. This is so frustrating!

Its worth noting that Bod and Wang have been at war since 100ad and are already in unit spam mode, even though Bod has taken two of Wang's cities their power difference is minimal. Bod is friendly with you so allying with Bod vs Wang is probably your only option, whether you can capture enough Korean cities not to be overwhelmed by Bod may become the issue

Wang Kon is such a good techer actually and he never trades anything! argh, it's so frustrating lol

 

[Gumbolt]

I noticed that you would lose lib next turn but it is random as I retested and on second attempt you got liberalism. Your GS would of bulbed compass. Perhaps you missed out here by skipping compass and not bulbing lib. Every turn counts on deity.

I wonder how much you missed the NE/HE for GP generation / military? I noticed that Rome could of been running 2-3 more scientists if it used the fish. 30-50 GPP a turn is not huge. Mylene was spot on about use of great people.

I do think the main reason you are suffering is lack of an economy to match the other AI. If you had aesth and lit earlier these would of been great trading chips and helped with military and more great scientists.

I am not sure on curs date for deity. I would of said 100-300ad is possible. Pends on the start. With a specialist economy you could of used mids. Which was one of the reasons to leave AC alive so you could capture wonders.

Be interesting to get Mylenes view. I would upload your last save.

 

[Mylene]

Yip i was worried that will happen, Deity gets brutal at around that point you posted your last save
Why i tried to put your attention on GP, often an optimal bulb and tech strategy is the only thingy that will save you.

That being said, continents can be very hard cos of few trading partners.
Hard map imo, rushing early gave you land but from what i can see you did not make enuf use of it, and settled cities too late.
Think it's lost tbh, probably for me too.

 

[Revent]

Yip i was worried that will happen, Deity gets brutal at around that point you posted your last save
Why i tried to put your attention on GP, often an optimal bulb and tech strategy is the only thingy that will save you.

That being said, continents can be very hard cos of few trading partners.
Hard map imo, rushing early gave you land but from what i can see you did not make enuf use of it, and settled cities too late.
Think it's lost tbh, probably for me too.

Ah I see. I think Pangea would be a better game, right?
Okay, bearing the optimal bulb path in mind next time Thanks for that! At the very least, how many GP's do you suggest a person have by the time they're at Lib? (assume non Phil leader)

I have a couple of GS's lying around because I didn't want to bulb compass. Do you think they could help in any way? I think it was 3 or 4.

I noticed that you would lose lib next turn but it is random as I retested and on second attempt you got liberalism. Your GS would of bulbed compass. Perhaps you missed out here by skipping compass and not bulbing lib. Every turn counts on deity.

I wonder how much you missed the NE/HE for GP generation / military? I noticed that Rome could of been running 2-3 more scientists if it used the fish. 30-50 GPP a turn is not huge. Mylene was spot on about use of great people.

I do think the main reason you are suffering is lack of an economy to match the other AI. If you had aesth and lit earlier these would of been great trading chips and helped with military and more great scientists.

I am not sure on curs date for deity. I would of said 100-300ad is possible. Pends on the start. With a specialist economy you could of used mids. Which was one of the reasons to leave AC alive so you could capture wonders.

Be interesting to get Mylenes view. I would upload your last save.

Maybe you changed something; ie moving a worker to one place instead of another and that resulted in a different result? Something to do along with the lines of chaos theory.

Yes, definitely skipping compass was a bad idea! I never knew Lib would be next, I thought it'd be optics->astro->PP-or something along those lines.

I think the NE was really needed although I may have lost at max 2 GP's I think because the points for a GP increases as well. HE, I built whilst teching towards MT and was pushing out Cuirs every other turn. Yes, Aesth would've been nicer, but a bit hard because I've noticed Wang Kon tends to go for it actually so I decided for Alpha with only 2 AI.

I don't save much Well not anymore at least. It makes it a lot less tempting for me to reload if something goes wrong in a turn.

 

[Gumbolt]

No you needed compass and aesthetics on your save to bulb lib. By the time you had teched those you could of bulbed lib. 2 extra GS would of made a big difference. You need to know your bulbing paths!!! How many turns had you spent researching liberalism???

This is why many players go down the aesthetics research route as you need it for curs.

I think I just clicked enter both times.

 

[Mylene]

You want GS before and for Lib, if you still have 1 or 2 then mostly good for PP and a 2nd GA..but only optional now. In your situation, you could have bulbed paper too or switch to great merchant points in 1 city.
Philo, 2x Edu and 1x Lib + Academy if i have 1 strong city, so an average of 5 would be good. 1 or 2 GM if you can are great.
More are always good thou, Paper is not that cheap on Deity. Why i rate PHI so high, Fin i.e. does not even come close imo.

Compass and Lib bulb is a trick i learned late, but can be very good cos Compass sells too usually

 

[Revent]

No you needed compass and aesthetics on your save to bulb lib. By the time you had teched those you could of bulbed lib. 2 extra GS would of made a big difference. You need to know your bulbing paths!!! How many turns had you spent researching liberalism???

This is why many players go down the aesthetics research route as you need it for curs.

I think I just clicked enter both times.

Ooh okay, well those GS's were lying around doing nothing as a result of my stupidity /not knowing the bulb path

I teched all of it myself!

Hmm..that's strange, I don't have new random seed on reload ticked either, so dunno why it would do that.

 

[Gumbolt]

The key is getting the 5-6 great people super early. I think a 1000ad curs date for deity is slow. I am guessing you need to start 300-500ad. Although more trading partners help for this.

Yeah if you had 2 GS sitting doing nothing you wasted 10-11 turns for nothing. Self teching lib on deity sounds a bad plan. I liked Mylenes bulbing compass and lib idea.

 

[Revent]

You want GS before and for Lib, if you still have 1 or 2 then mostly good for PP and a 2nd GA..but only optional now. In your situation, you could have bulbed paper too or switch to great merchant points in 1 city.
Philo, 2x Edu and 1x Lib + Academy if i have 1 strong city, so an average of 5 would be good. 1 or 2 GM if you can are great.
More are always good thou, Paper is not that cheap on Deity. Why i rate PHI so high, Fin i.e. does not even come close imo.

Compass and Lib bulb is a trick i learned late, but can be very good cos Compass sells too usually

I think I generated quite a lot more than that in my game by the time I got to Rifling I generated a GM, a GP, and lots of GS's in total.

I was able to tech paper pretty quickly actually, so that wasn't that bad 2 Edu, 1 Lib and 1 for maybe Astro on continent maps if I can?

The key is getting the 5-6 great people super early. I think a 1000ad curs date for deity is slow. I am guessing you need to start 300-500ad. A;though more trading partners help for this.

Definitely, going to go for Pangea next game!