Norman - Exploration Age Civilization Discussion

[Nic@Melbourne]

Seems like one of the most popular based on the chat length

 

[Evolena]

One of their starting bias is Iron. I wonder if that means they could be unlocked by having 3 Iron resources (Mongolia mode)?

 

[Siptah]

One of their starting bias is Iron. I wonder if that means they could be unlocked by having 3 Iron resources (Mongolia mode)?

Horse = Mongols
Camels = Abbasid
Iron = Nornans
Navigable rivers = Songhai

Please, not! That would be, oh, so boring. But sadly, I would say chances are high that this is exactly what happens in the game.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Inconsistency is something that bothers me in this kind of naming situation, Civ 7 is using at least 3 types of patterns, country name (classical use of Greece, Rome, Egypt, Aksum, etc), people or period names (Shawnee, Khmer, Mississipian, Abbasid, etc) and compound names (a mixture of the 2 above giving Maurya India, Han China, etc). Obviously not all civs have the option of using the name of a country, but it is preferable to the others. "Norman" strangely deviates from the pattern by not going with Normandy, but on the other hand it is more obvious that it also encompasses Norman England and perhaps Norman Sicily as well.

I'd much rather them ditch the first one and just name them for the people like past civ games: Greeks, Romans, Egyptians, Aksumites etc.
Interesting enough all the YouTube videos like to mention them as the "Normans," which I like the best. Obviously calling them Normandy doesn't work especially when their associated wonder is located in current London.
As for the compound ones, I don't mind it as much, especially as they might be doing that to show the different stages of said modern nations to make them familiar. I don't know if using the term "Han Chinese" or Mauryan Indian" would be preferable though?

Navigable rivers = Songhai

Isn't it already known that you just have to play the game as Amina to unlock them?

 

[Leucarum]

Horse = Mongols
Camels = Abbasid
Iron = Nornans
Navigable rivers = Songhai

Please, not! That would be, oh, so boring. But sadly, I would say chances are high that this is exactly what happens in the game.

Boring but also possibly a little out of the player's control depending on spawn...

 

[Siptah]

Isn't it already known that you just have to play the game as Amina to unlock them?

I assume that there are ways to unlock each civ regardless of leader and previous civ.

Boring but also possibly a little out of the player's control depending on spawn...

Unless you can trade for the resources (which, obviously, wouldn't work for terrain based unlocks).

 

[Leucarum]

I assume that there are ways to unlock each civ regardless of leader and previous civ.


Unless you can trade for the resources (which, obviously, wouldn't work for terrain based unlocks).

yeah, trading eases some spawn problems, but I'd hope it's more like "build 4 libraries" or " have only a single city" that are very plannable

 

[Krikkit1]

Horse = Mongols
Camels = Abbasid
Iron = Nornans
Navigable rivers = Songhai

Please, not! That would be, oh, so boring. But sadly, I would say chances are high that this is exactly what happens in the game.

I could see it being a little more complex
ie Mongols 3 horses
Normans Iron and Coastal settlement with 3 walls
Abbasids Camels and a 30 pop city or 5 Altars

 

[Siptah]

I could see it being a little more complex
ie Mongols 3 horses
Normans Iron and Coastal settlement with 3 walls
Abbasids Camels and a 30 pop city or 5 Altars

I hope FXS sees this more akin to your ideas than my fears.

 

[Leucarum]

This at least should be easily modded...

 

[stealth_nsk]

One of their starting bias is Iron. I wonder if that means they could be unlocked by having 3 Iron resources (Mongolia mode)?

I don't think starting bias are linked to unlock conditions. Based on civ focus, I'd expect Normans to be unlocked with building enough walls and/or fortifications.

 

[Krikkit1]

I don't think starting bias are linked to unlock conditions. Based on civ focus, I'd expect Normans to be unlocked with building enough walls and/or fortifications.

Starting Bias should be part of unlock conditions. Especially if it is something specific like a a resource. (But it shouldn't be the only part of the unlock... unless it is massively important like I imagine Mongol-Horses / Inca-Mountains would be)

If starting as Abbasid guarantees you Camels than gameplay unlocking Abbasid should require Camels (in addition to other things)

Probably for Resources, Coast, Nav. River, and maybe some less normal Terrains (Desert/Tundra/Mountain)

 

[stealth_nsk]

Starting Bias should be part of unlock conditions. Especially if it is something specific like a a resource. (But it shouldn't be the only part of the unlock... unless it is massively important like I imagine Mongol-Horses / Inca-Mountains would be)

If starting as Abbasid guarantees you Camels than gameplay unlocking Abbasid should require Camels (in addition to other things)

Probably for Resources, Coast, Nav. River, and maybe some less normal Terrains (Desert/Tundra/Mountain)

Starting bias should match unlock conditions only if they are tied to the large part of the gameplay. For example, Mongols are heavy focused on cavalry, so it makes sense to have horses in both unlock and start. On the other hand, have no significant connection to iron. So I don't see any reason to use it for unlock.

P.S. I also don't see the reason to make iron part of Normans' starting bias, but starting biases are not always linked to civ specifics, so it's ok.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Starting bias should match unlock conditions only if they are tied to the large part of the gameplay. For example, Mongols are heavy focused on cavalry, so it makes sense to have horses in both unlock and start. On the other hand, have no significant connection to iron. So I don't see any reason to use it for unlock.

P.S. I also don't see the reason to make iron part of Normans' starting bias, but starting biases are not always linked to civ specifics, so it's ok.

While it's not a core component of their gameplay, Iron has an empire-wide combat strength bonus that stacks, so starting near multiple Iron tiles would be advantageous for warmongers.

It's the same for Horses. Mongolia doesn't *need* horses anymore than anyone else, but the Horse resource bonus helps them and it's Firaxis's way of saying, "Go forth and lay waste to your enemies!"

Similarly, Camels are a bonus resource that helps you accumulate more resources. Abbasids will have an Advanced Start with a trade advantage.

 

[stealth_nsk]

While it's not a core component of their gameplay, Iron has an empire-wide combat strength bonus that stacks, so starting near multiple Iron tiles would be advantageous for warmongers.

Yeah, but Normans seem to be more focused on defense than on traditional warmongering.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

P.S. I also don't see the reason to make iron part of Normans' starting bias, but starting biases are not always linked to civ specifics, so it's ok.

While it's not a core component of their gameplay, Iron has an empire-wide combat strength bonus that stacks, so starting near multiple Iron tiles would be advantageous for warmongers.

As far as resources go, are some required for units like the Chevaler needing iron?
It could also be a precursor for those wanting to go into a hypothetical Modern Age Britian civ?

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Yeah, but Normans seem to be more focused on defense than on traditional warmongering.

I wouldn't say so. Yeah, the buildings are defensive, but everything else says offense.

It looks designed to play like how the Normans really operated. Take land and build a Motte and Bailey there to secure it.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

As far as resources go, are some required for units like the Chevaler needing iron?
It could also be a precursor for those wanting to go into a hypothetical Modern Age Britian civ?

There's no indication that units have a resource requirement in Civ 7 that we have seen so far. Maybe in the Modern?

 

[Siptah]

There's no indication that units have a resource requirement in Civ 7 that we have seen so far. Maybe in the Modern?

I thought they said that requirements don‘t exist anymore in one of the early videos.

 

[stealth_nsk]

I wouldn't say so. Yeah, the buildings are defensive, but everything else says offense.

It looks designed to play like how the Normans really operated. Take land and build a Motte and Bailey there to secure it.

We need to see how other exploration conquest civs look like. Normans have unique ability and a civic to increase Chevaler combat strength, plus reduced maintenance for cavalry and additional Chevalers from unique district. On the other hand, the rest of the features are either not related to military or totally defensive. We may see more aggressive civs with unique commanders and military buildings.