[RD] Russia Invades Ukraine: War News Thread: Round 6

[Birdjaguar]

@banzay13 Moderator Action: Your post is not related to the current war or its news. This is not a thread to discuss old wars or conflicts. You can copy your post and start a new thread if you want to discuss this. Thanks.

 

[Gedemon]

normal people try to learn from history to avoid making the same mistakes again.

for example I don't trust some US media. I don't trust some French media.

but I have 100% confidence in Russian state media... I mean like in a compass pointing to the south.

 

[Kyriakos]

War news. No news yet. Everyone is waiting for the Ukrainian Armed Forces to continue their attacks this night

And let's go back again, since I keep getting asked about it. As I said, I have been watching this war since 2014. And also the war in Syria (both with ISIS and civilian), and the war in Libya and Yemen So the emotional part is closed to me. I am trying to talk to you in the language of facts (which side has what), without involving emotions. So it is useless to get me emotionally involved. I'm trying to convey to you the position from Russia's point of view, as it perceives them, basically. Or from my point of view.
Let's go back a bit, so that my assertions aren't made out of nothing.
Rakka, Mosul - I have attached images - doesn't it look like Mariupol, Bakhmut? Whose army helped take these cities?
We see the same thing in Syria (Aleppo).
How many died in the war in Syria, in Iraq, Libya, Yemen? And how many refugees? Are the numbers not much less, and somewhere even more than in Ukraine? Why was there no hysteria in the media about this (especially Yemen), do not people live there? Or maybe they are not white enough? Why count some Arabs? This alone proves how biased the media is. And they certainly should not be 100% trusted. Not even 50%, I would say.
There was a civil war in Syria, for one thing. But then what are Turkish, Iranian troops doing there? Russia (okay, Assad's government called it in), the United States (they're not even neighbors). The UN Security Council did not give the right to send troops into a sovereign country, as I recall. Isn't that a violation of international law? And there are a lot of such cases in the last 50 years. That's why it's too late to blame international law. Especially to countries that violate it themselves.
By the way, here is a good movie about Mosul https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9252468/

You don't need to be apologetic for your view. Different people express different views, and only those who are incapable of contemplating the opposing opinion will be fast to up to attack you for yours. Either way, such predates your own participation in the thread so it's not about you regardless.
That it's so common in the thread to by default downplay any russian suffering, may seem strange, but if you feel inclined to post here you'd do well to disregard it as problematic and not let it get to you.

 

[Farm Boy]

Russian suffering sucks. Doesn't mean people don't understand that exporting suffering intentionally is current policy.

It's really the only option available besides flee, serve, or die when the lowest common denominator comes to your home.

 

[Lexicus]

Name me other war, witch was without such things?

Hence why starting wars of aggression is a capital offense

 

[banzay13]

This is a link to a 40 minute documentary on the Wagner Group by the WSJ. I cannot tell if it is paywalled since I am a subscriber.

Shadow Men: Inside Wagner, Russia’s Secret War Company

The Wagner Group began as a small clandestine force but has grown in recent years into a global war cartel run by Yevgeny Prigozhin, plundering gold and diamonds while advancing the Kremlin’s strategic interests and becoming the face of the Russian assault in Ukraine. Photo illustration: Xingpei...

www.wsj.com

Already at 1:30 it's hard to watch. Immediately the clichés were put on from the start. Is that how journalism works? At the very beginning, without presenting the facts, you are already forced to think in the right direction. That's usually how propaganda works, not journalism.
But I'll try to finish watching it tomorrow.

 

[thetrooper]

Already at 1:30 it's hard to watch. Immediately the clichés were put on from the start. Is that how journalism works? At the very beginning, without presenting the facts, you are already forced to think in the right direction. That's usually how propaganda works, not journalism.
But I'll try to finish watching it tomorrow.

Evil Western propaganda, amirite?

 

[Gorbles]

That it's so common in the thread to by default downplay any russian suffering

I've seen plenty of people decrying Putin's ambitions and how they hurt Russians both domestically and abroad. This feels like straw, ya know?

People aren't going to want to empathise with an invading force, no. People aren't going to handwring over political sanctions when they're driven by the literal invasion of another country. The cause and effect here is pretty simple, and has been since Russia (as a nation state) decided to invade Ukraine.

But again, straw.

 

[red_elk]

But I'll try to finish watching it tomorrow.

Watching WSJ documentary on that topic is a waste of time IMO.
For fair and unbiased analysis, sources from neutral countries would be much more reliable.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Already at 1:30 it's hard to watch. Immediately the clichés were put on from the start. Is that how journalism works? At the very beginning, without presenting the facts, you are already forced to think in the right direction. That's usually how propaganda works, not journalism.
But I'll try to finish watching it tomorrow.

The WSJ (Wall Street Journal) is a very conservative business oriented paper. They are a very competent paper for news even if their editorial page is way to far to the right for me.

 

[Zardnaar]

The WSJ (Wall Street Journal) is a very conservative business oriented paper. They are a very competent paper for news even if their editorial page is way to far to the right for me.

It's a financial focused paper.

Bit to right Wong for my interests but there's not a lot wrong with their articles outside the businesses/financial type slant.

 

[Gorbles]

Watching WSJ documentary on that topic is a waste of time IMO.
For fair and unbiased analysis, sources from neutral countries would be much more reliable.

If you're not going to define what countries you, as a regular Russian poster, consider "neutral", this is also a waste of time, in my opinion.

I do miss your "people should be allowed to post sources and others can make up their own minds" stance though. Genuinely. I wonder what happened to change it.

 

[Birdjaguar]

PM me or start a new thread on world media if you want to discuss it.

 

[Lexicus]

That it's so common in the thread to by default downplay any russian suffering, may seem strange, but if you feel inclined to post here you'd do well to disregard it as problematic and not let it get to you.

Well on the one hand we have posters some of whom have had to flee their homes due to the war, making callous statements about Russian suffering. On the other hand we have posters carrying water for the authors of that Russian suffering: none other than Putin and his lieutenants. I know which one I think is worse.

(This is of course leaving aside that Ukraine has suffered incomparably more than Russia; the perversity of this whole affair is illustrated perhaps best by the unspoken assumption that Putin's interests are synonymous with Russia's as they clearly are not. Indeed, it is to be hoped that Putin will pay for his crimes against Russia and the Russians just as he will hopefully pay for his crimes against Ukraine).

 

[Verbose]

Well on the one hand we have posters some of whom have had to flee their homes due to the war, making callous statements about Russian suffering. On the other hand we have posters carrying water for the authors of that Russian suffering: none other than Putin and his lieutenants. I know which one I think is worse.

(This is of course leaving aside that Ukraine has suffered incomparably more than Russia; the perversity of this whole affair is illustrated perhaps best by the unspoken assumption that Putin's interests are synonymous with Russia's as they clearly are not. Indeed, it is to be hoped that Putin will pay for his crimes against Russia and the Russians just as he will hopefully pay for his crimes against Ukraine).

Best outcome would be for Russia to put Putin properly on trial for what he has done. That's however apparently even more remote than fx the ICJ getting the opportunity at this juncture.

 

[Verbose]

War news. No news yet. Everyone is waiting for the Ukrainian Armed Forces to continue their attacks this night

And let's go back again, since I keep getting asked about it. As I said, I have been watching this war since 2014. And also the war in Syria (both with ISIS and civilian), and the war in Libya and Yemen So the emotional part is closed to me. I am trying to talk to you in the language of facts (which side has what), without involving emotions. So it is useless to get me emotionally involved. I'm trying to convey to you the position from Russia's point of view, as it perceives them, basically. Or from my point of view.
Let's go back a bit, so that my assertions aren't made out of nothing.
Rakka, Mosul - I have attached images - doesn't it look like Mariupol, Bakhmut? Whose army helped take these cities?
We see the same thing in Syria (Aleppo).
How many died in the war in Syria, in Iraq, Libya, Yemen? And how many refugees? Are the numbers not much less, and somewhere even more than in Ukraine? Why was there no hysteria in the media about this (especially Yemen), do not people live there? Or maybe they are not white enough? Why count some Arabs? This alone proves how biased the media is. And they certainly should not be 100% trusted. Not even 50%, I would say.
There was a civil war in Syria, for one thing. But then what are Turkish, Iranian troops doing there? Russia (okay, Assad's government called it in), the United States (they're not even neighbors). The UN Security Council did not give the right to send troops into a sovereign country, as I recall. Isn't that a violation of international law? And there are a lot of such cases in the last 50 years. That's why it's too late to blame international law. Especially to countries that violate it themselves.
By the way, here is a good movie about Mosul https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9252468/

Your lot – the Russian side – did to Syria what it is now doing to Ukraine. And is in the process of doing something similar in Libya, Mali, various parts of Africa.

Except you don't connect the dots and you just don't get it, because you have got your head rammed so far up your Russian backside the pain of the but-hurt of being Russian blinds you to what Russia has become, and what Russia does in the world.

 

[Akka]

Bold of you to assume it's from ignorance and not deliberate support.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Moderator Action: Let's chill for a bit. I, or some other mod, will open this back up on Sunday evening or Monday morning.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Moderator Action: We are discussing this in staff. Collect your news and links. The topic will return.