Seven shot dead at US army base

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that there must be a llot of soldiers in the U.S. army who think that the Bible trumps the U.S. constitution. One thing I'm not sure about is whether saying something like that might be as frowned upon as saying that the Koran trumps the constitution instead. I have a feeling that it isn't.
 
Stop blaming the victims.
Good thing I'm not, huh? In case you haven't noticed, I'm "blaming" the numerous bigots in the military who think all Muslims are a menacing threat whose religion forces them to be 'jihadists', and who harass the Muslims who are in the service as a result. I'm "blaming" a system that forces the few Muslims in the military to fight in wars they personally think are wrong for obvious religious reasons. I'm "blaming" the millions of bigots in the US who are already using this tragedy as an excuse to foment even more hatred of all Muslims:


Link to video.


Link to video.

This isn't Islamophobia. It is Islamorealism.
:lol:

Of couse, none of this is intended as any sort of 'excuse' for what he did, although I'm certain you will try to spin it that way for your own obvious political agenda.
 
I think there is a lot more blaming the religion (broadly painting Muslims with the terrorist brush) than there is blaming the victim going on. Personally, I blame the shooter.
 
I'm "blaming" the numerous bigots in the military who think all Muslims are a menacing threat whose religion forces them to be 'jihadists', and who harass the Muslims who are in the service as a result. I'm "blaming" a system... I'm "blaming" the millions of bigots in the US

Sure... bigots in the military, bigots in the US and the US military system are to blame for this mass murder.

Is there anything that you will not justify in the name of Islam?


I blame the shooter. Not Islam. Not other people.

The irony is that Forma does the same thing as some people on Fox News... blaming people other than the shooter. He's behaving like the worst of Fox News personalities. There's really no difference between him and Sean Hannity on this, both using Islam as a scapegoat.
 
I think there is a lot more blaming the religion (broadly painting Muslims with the terrorist brush) than there is blaming the victim going on. Personally, I blame the shooter.
Exactly.

Is there anything that you will not justify in the name of Islam?

Of couse, none of this is intended as any sort of 'excuse' for what he did, although I'm certain you will try to spin it that way for your own obvious political agenda.
:lol:

I blame the shooter. Not Islam. Not other people.
Then why don't you start acting like it instead of apparently deliberately misinterpreting what I have written in this thread?

The irony is that Forma does the same thing as some people on Fox News... blaming people other than the shooter. He's behaving like the worst of Fox News personalities.
Even more absurd spin? Gee, why am I not surprised? :lol:
 
Spoiler :
Everyone gets harrassed. People who are incompetent and constantly crap on everyone around them get harassed more. This has nothing to do with him being muslim, and everything to do with him being an incompetent butthole.


1. Getting picked on does not justify, rationalize or otherwise excuse mass murder.

2. The guy was a crappy soldier and a crappier person.

3. Islam is not the victim here.


Rationalizing this mass murder with "Islam gets picked on" effectively rationalizes ANY action by ANY muslim in the US. I suppose that goes for Europe too... muslim criminals, regardless of what they do, are innocent (or, not really to blame) because other people forced them via not liking Islam.



Even if the harrassment was based on religion (which it was not)...

If I say: "Islam sucks. Islam is a piece of crap. It's a waste of human flesh. It's a death cult, living in the dark ages."

That doesn't mean someone gets to kill me! It does not justify or mitigate someone murdering me!

Even if I key someone's car with: "Islam is BS and its followers buffoons!"

They still cannot murder me!

GET SOME PERSPECTIVE!

How many of you people blame the Columbine students?
Well, apparently some Muslims think they can. Proof is on Al-Jazeera, the populist troublemaker of the Middle East. The guys over there have been on the raw end of the promises and hopes the US (specifically the US, no other Western nation), so they are pissed off, and the US (the American public (assuming that the majority had no idea)had no idea what the heck was going on in the ME and did not care as long as oil prices didnt go up) didnt do anything about it until a plane stuck itself into the tallest building in the world.
 
Whoa, terrorists got the raw end of the deal??

Oh Noes!!!

Al Jeezera is the victim!
 
Then why don't you start acting like it instead of apparently deliberately misinterpreting what I have written in this thread?

Look, I have always said I blame the shooter.

You and Sean Hannity are the only ones using Islam as a scapegoat.

There's no misinterpretation here:

I'm "blaming" the numerous bigots in the military... I'm "blaming" a system... I'm "blaming" the millions of bigots in the US

You're scapegoating, and you are using Islam to do it. Period.
 
You and Sean Hannity are the only ones using Islam as a scapegoat.
Have you actually read this thread at all? :lol:

There's no misinterpretation here:

This is the statement that initiated your latest rant:

I think he was obviously "religiously motivated". The real issue is whether or not he is yet another deranged person who went on an all-too-typical mass killing spree after suffering frequent harassment for his own religious beliefs. Or was he an Al-Qaida deep-cover-secret-agent who was sent in to kill a handful of soldiers on their way to serve non-critical assignments Afghanistan. Of course, the assorted conspiracy theorists and Faux News watchers prefer the latter version.
So, exactly what portion of the bolded part do you disagree?

You should really get over your all-too-frequent habit of apparently deliberately misinterpreting whatever I write. As usual, your strawman has no clothes. :lol:
 
Whoa, terrorists got the raw end of the deal??

Oh Noes!!!

Al Jeezera is the victim!

Anti-American terrorists werent in existence until about 50 years ago - when the ME's dictatorship got backed by the US; this line of discontent and harsh living conditions among the ME produced these terrorists.
Ok, based on your previous posts, I assuming that you dont like playing the blame game; but what can one do when the majority of the ME is playing the blame game, thus encouraging the terrorists?
 
You bolded the wrong part, Forma...

after suffering frequent harassment for his own religious beliefs

That's the BS.

That's the scapegoating.

That's Sean Hannity.

It becomes all the more clear with this:

I'm "blaming" the numerous bigots in the military... I'm "blaming" a system... I'm "blaming" the millions of bigots in the US

You are VERY clearly scapegoating, there is no doubt about it. Perhaps you can get a job on Fox News.


Ok, based on your previous posts, I assuming that you dont like playing the blame game; but what can one do when the majority of the ME is playing the blame game, thus encouraging the terrorists?
We have options:

1. Engage in our own scapegoating and blame Islam (ala Hannity).

2. Blame the individual.

3. Accept Al Jeezera's scapegoating as reality (ala Forma).


Personally, I'm going with option 2. It's the only rational option.
 
You bolded the wrong part, Forma...



That's the BS.

That's the scapegoating.

That's Sean Hannity.

It becomes all the more clear with this:



You are VERY clearly scapegoating, there is no doubt about it. Perhaps you can get a job on Fox News.



We have choices:

1. Engage in our own scapegoating and blame Islam (ala Hannity).

2. Blame the individual.

3. Accept Al Jeezera's scapegoating as reality (ala Forma).

All three are going to piss off the Muslims and make American soldiers' job in Iraq harder.
 
You bolded the wrong part, Forma...
No, I didn't. I quoted the salient portion which shows I apparently agree with your own opinion. Ironic, isn't it? :lol:

That's the BS.
That's no "BS". That is what is known as a "fact". You do know what those are, right?

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/nidal-malik-hasan-wanted-army-family/story?id=9008184

Fort Hood shooting suspect, Major Nidal Malik Hasan, wanted out of the Army after being constantly harassed by others in the military and was called a "camel jockey," his family said.

Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan is a psychiatrist who treated soldiers back from war.As Hasan was about to be deployed to Iraq, he was suffering from some of the same stresses that he was trained as an Army psychiatrist to treat.

Although the 39-year-old had just been promoted to major in May, his family says he had hired a lawyer to help him get out of the Armed Forces.

"Apparently became very disgruntled in the mission in Iraq and Afghanistan and voiced that to a lot of his colleagues," said Rep. Michael McCaul (R-TX).

He also voiced it to the world in an Internet posting, where he compared suicide bombers to GI's who save their colleagues by throwing themselves on a grenade.

"Just keep in mind mass killers pretty much know they want to die and they tend to take as many people with them as they can in a shooting," said former FBI agent and ABC News consultant Brad Garrett, who also believes Hasan didn't want to survive the Ft. Hood shooting.

"It is one of those things where he went and wanted to kill a lot of people and commit suicide maybe in his own mind that he's saving peoples' lives," said Garrett. "As illogical as that sounds, in his mind, that would be quite logical."

Hasan is an American citizen of Palestinian descent and after the 9/11 attacks, his cousin says he was the target of constant harassment from others in the military. His tormentors called him a "camel jockey," said his cousin, Nader Hasan. He wanted out of the Army, so he paid back his military student loans and hired an attorney.

While the bullying irritated Hasan, Nader Hasan believes his upcoming deployment is what set him off. The cousin said, "My mom is his mom… and we didn't know he was being deployed until we heard it on the news today."


Hasan went to college at Virginia Tech and studied medicine at the military's medical school.

A Silver Spring, MD neighbor told ABC News she was interviewed Thursday by the FBI about Hasan.
"He's a quiet man, he looked like a nice person to me, so since I have been living here I never heard a noise in that house," said Vivian Tchangan, who added that Hasan wrote "Allah" on his door.

A devout Muslim, Hasan described himself as reserved and funny in an application for a Muslim marriage matchmaking program run by Imam Faizul Khan or the Islamic Society of Washington Area.

Khan told ABC News Hasan was looking for an equally devout wife. He said, "He wants someone who prays everyday, who adheres to the Quran, who is a good muslim woman."

According to military records, Hasan worked as a psychiatrist at the Walter Reed military hospital for six years until this July. Congressman McCaul says Hasan had a poor performance evaluation at Walter Reed, which resulted in his transfer to Ft. Hood and "while there received a lot of advanced training in weapons, shooting classes."
Or do you think his family and friends are lying?

It becomes all the more clear with this.
What do you think the quotes mean? Does the word 'sarcasm' ring any bells?

That's the scapegoating.

That's Sean Hannity.
If anybody is the "Sean Hannity" in your obviously misdirected rant (yet again mind you) it is you. :lol:

You are VERY clearly scapegoating, there is no doubt about it. Perhaps you can get a job on Fox News.
Sorry, I don't have the desire to deliberately misintrepret others to further my own political agenda as you apparently do. Perhaps you should take your own advice. After all, you own opinions and penchant for coming up with strawmen like this would actually make you the suitable candidate, not me. :lol:
 
I think he was obviously "religiously motivated". The real issue is whether or not he is yet another deranged person who went on an all-too-typical mass killing spree after suffering frequent harassment for his own religious beliefs. Or was he an Al-Qaida deep-cover-secret-agent who was sent in to kill a handful of soldiers on their way to serve non-critical assignments Afghanistan. Of course, the assorted conspiracy theorists and Faux News watchers prefer the latter version.
Whereas assorted diversicrats and Communist News Network watchers prefer both of the above so that they can blithely ignore third and other options such as "independent Al-Qaida-like operative going on a personal jihad". :p

No big surprise there. It just makes sense to you, right? After all, don't they all do that?
Not sure what your point is or if you're being sarcastic. I'll spell out mine: proportionately more Islamists than non-Islamists shout "Allahu Akbar", so this is indirect evidence that he did indeed shout "Allahu Akbar".
 
Oh, sweet irony. Aren't you the one who claims that this may very well have been an al-Qaida plot? Care to retract that statement yet, or do you want to wait until the Army officially debunks it any month now? :lol:

No, I claimed nothing of the sort. I merely said it shouldnt be absurd to at least suspect it as a possibility. Again, your comprehension is more than a bit lacking.

That's no "BS". That is what is known as a "fact". You do know what those are, right?

Apparently you dont. Its what his family is claiming, but isnt found to be factual or not. Unless, of course, your ability to determine fact is so out of whack that any claim his family may make during this should be considered 'fact'...:rolleyes:

It has been my experience that the miltary has an extremely low tolerance for harassment, and have taken very careful and extensive precautions in creating programs to find and punish severely such harassment.

I find his families claims simply unsupportable in the light of my own personal experience in how the military deals with that stuff.

Or do you think his family and friends are lying?

I dont think what they are saying is fact. Its actually 2nd or 3rd hand information, most likely given to them by the nutcase himself. We know Hassan lied to his family about other things (alcohol and strip clubs) so he may very well have lied to them about this as well.

His families comments are absolutely not 'fact' like you purport them to be. And you trying to sell it as 'fact' is frankly laughable.
 
Whereas assorted diversicrats and Communist News Network watchers prefer both of the above so that they can blithely ignore third and other options such as "independent Al-Qaida-like operative going on a personal jihad". :p
In other words, he was yet another religious fanatic who went off the deep end, much in the same way fundamentalist Christians have a habit of doing? :p

Spoiler :
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eric-rudolph.jpg






Not sure what your point is or if you're being sarcastic. I'll spell out mine: proportionately more Islamists than non-Islamists shout "Allahu Akbar", so this is indirect evidence that he did indeed shout "Allahu Akbar".
Too bad there is no such thing as "indirect evidence". Either he said it or he didn't. And it now appears he didn't.

I know it's a blow to the conspiracy theorists who want to speculate that "they hate our freedom" so much that there going to be far more terrorist attacks, despite the fact that it still hasn't happened 8 years later. But, hopefully, someday they will get over it and find some new conspiracy worthy of their continual speculation. Perhaps the next time it won't involve a few thousand Muslims located halfway around the globe, so there will actually be some sense in all the rampant fearmongering.

No, I claimed nothing of the sort. I merely said it shouldnt be absurd to at least suspect it as a possibility.
That is your opinion. I merely disagree for the reasons which I have already elaborated numerous times. YMMV.

Again, your comprehension is more than a bit lacking..
Again, you have actually shown your own is. :lol:
 
In other words, he was yet another religious fanatic who went off the deep end, much in the same way fundamentalist Christians have a habit of doing?

No, dude. He was a normal muslim who was forced into a murderous rampage by bigots in the US military, bigots in the US public and a bigoted system.

Right?

I'm "blaming" the numerous bigots in the military... I'm "blaming" a system... I'm "blaming" the millions of bigots in the US
 
We cannot trust our military servicemen.
 
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