You do know how the US government works right? It's not as though the president can just wave a magic wand and make all of his policies law. Unlike most other nations in this world, the US was actually specifically designed to have a weak executive branch so one person could not wield too much political power. So even if Hugo Chavez himself became president of the US, he would not be able to do what he did in Venezuela unless he had the full support of both Congress and the Supreme Court (which he would not).
Why Bernie Sanders should be president
- Thread starter Lawn_Donuts
- Start date
You do know how the US government works right? It's not as though the president can just wave a magic wand and make all of his policies law. Unlike most other nations in this world, the US was actually specifically designed to have a weak executive branch so one person could not wield too much political power. So even if Hugo Chavez himself became president of the US, he would not be able to do what he did in Venezuela unless he had the full support of both Congress and the Supreme Court (which he would not).
Minority Americans haven't really turned out to vote for a Socialist/Green Party type in like, 60 years. Their base is unquestionably educated white people.
metalhead
Angry Bartender
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- 8,031
Black voters tend to be conservative and religious, more so than the average member of the Democratic party. I too get annoyed by people who say patronizing, borderline racist things like "black people will vote for Bernie when they get to know him, because minimum wage!" As if voting behavior of any large demographic group can be boiled down to a single issue like that.
The evidence typically offered, usually from people in academia, is that the black people they know like Bernie Sanders, as if a candidate that appeals to black people in the academic world automatically translates to support from black people everywhere. Not everyone who gets to know Bernie Sanders and his agenda is going to vote for him, and there are plenty of valid reasons for not doing so. I find the line of the Bernie supporters to be curious, as if he's spouting universal truth that everyone will agree with, if only they could hear it.
The evidence typically offered, usually from people in academia, is that the black people they know like Bernie Sanders, as if a candidate that appeals to black people in the academic world automatically translates to support from black people everywhere. Not everyone who gets to know Bernie Sanders and his agenda is going to vote for him, and there are plenty of valid reasons for not doing so. I find the line of the Bernie supporters to be curious, as if he's spouting universal truth that everyone will agree with, if only they could hear it.
onejayhawk
Afflicted with reason
Claiming the pollsters are not stupid will get you in hot water. Respect for the profession has plummeted after miscalling a string of elections: USA, Great Britain, Israel, etc.
J
_random_
Jewel Runner
Jesse Jackson stands out as an exception here.
As I said it's not perfect, but pollsters (when looked in aggregate) do tend to get most outcomes right.
There are also degrees of imperfection. They might be wrong, but not by a colossal amount. So if they say 90% of likely voters already know Sanders, there's no way the real number is closer to 30%.
onejayhawk
Afflicted with reason
In Iowa and New Hampshire, 90% of those who intend to vote is probably correct.
J
J
The Republicans have 6 seats in states won by Obama in 2012 up for 2016 and seats in red-turing-blue states like North Carolina and Arizona. So, in the case the Republicans nominate somebody bad enough to lose to Sanders, you had better believe there is going to be serious down the ballot damage.
If you actually compare King's stances to the GOP's, it's ludicrous to say he'd bolt. And you can't throw away five seats that are pretty much underwater either. 2014 Shows this very clearly. Natalie Tennant here in WV and candidates like her ran away from the President and got slaughtered anyway. The 5 Red state Dem seats are up in 2018, while the Democrats can soften the blow of a midterm year by picking up Nevada and perhaps Arizona.
Establishment Democrats in safe states, they can and will reject parts of his agenda to be sure, but his signature plans (Public Health Insurance and $15 Minimum Wage) are not something they'd be able to oppose if they wanted to avoid getting primaried in the midterms. They are in the leadership because they know which way the wind is blowing, and if Single Payer and a Living Wage are popular enough to get Bernie elected, they're going to have to work with the President from their side of the aisle.
Sanders isn't ignorant of how Washington works. He's been there since 1991. If he can, he will compromise and make sacrifices to get through his main reforms relatively intact.
Archbob
Ancient CFC Guardian
I've always thought the issue with Obama is he did not know how to take advantage when the wind was blowing his way.
Bridog7
Little Monster
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onejayhawk
Afflicted with reason
New poll in NH has Bernie with a big lead. Unfortunately, they did not poll Iowa. The last poll was before Christmas.
J
J
caketastydelish
Deity
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I don't think anyone (even on the Bernie side) is saying Bernie has this for sure. Only some people are saying he doesn't remotely have a chance, and they are wrong.
_random_
Jewel Runner
It's been 100% accurate in predicting the winning party, but its mock election of 1988 made Bob Dole president rather than George Bush. Also, this is only the fifth time they've done this, and this was their electoral map:
Although as unlikely as that is, their 2012 map was even further off:
Let me reiterate that I think a Sanders win is possible, but I also think this is exceptionally lousy evidence to cite, unless somebody wants a concrete example of the youth vote being pro-Sanders.
Maybe, but I don't think that's certain, and it's not certain that ballot damage would be enough to sustain a legislative coalition to support Sanders. It wasn't enough for Obama, after all, and he road a wave with far more legislators more closely aligned to his vision.
Who said anything about him bolting? You can remain an independent, caucus with Democrats to keep your seniority, and not vote for things like a +$15 min wage or free college tuition. His record as Gov of Maine wouldn't suggest he's anything close to a Bernie.
Right, so most of the likely legislature.
When was the last time progressives ever did this successfully at scale?
You're not putting your money on the Republicans losing Utah but winning Illinois?
Archbob
Ancient CFC Guardian
How is the GOP gonna win Illinois? What kind of magic pixie dust do they have? I think Sanders would beat trump, I'm not sure about against Bush though. Bush isn't getting the nomination anyways, so it is irrelevent.
Over 90% of blacks who vote will vote against the Republican candidate. The Republicans do not want their votes, and they know it.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
That is likely true but not necessarily, depending on the candidate. Mike Huckabee or Rand Paul could probably pull a sizable minority of the black vote, in the very unlikely event that either of them gets the nomination.
