Alternate History Thread IV: The Sequel

[Dachs]

Uh, NK, Anglo-Spanish brawls happen reasonably often, and there's no inherent reason in the Unenlightenment map that they oughtn't happen even more frequently.

Thlayli: Now, now, there are plenty of stupid things done by OTL rulers that's well within tolerance. Konstantinos IX comes to mind. You just have to be realistic.

 

[Thlayli]

As long as the stupidity is in character that's fine.

Continuing the Diplomatic Standing for Tver: (Golden Horde: +70, Chernigov: -100, Poland: -60, France: +90, etc.) I like this idea, and it helps players to avoid ridiculous NAP barrages.

 

[Dachs]

But see, even Konstantinos' stupidity wasn't in character. He permanently demobilized 50,000 of his most experienced troops in return for eternal cash payments from them and their descendants for no reason whatsoever and it flew.

 

[North King]

Uh, NK, Anglo-Spanish brawls happen reasonably often, and there's no inherent reason in the Unenlightenment map that they oughtn't happen even more frequently.

No. In NESes, Spain is usually very weak. Even when it should be strong, moderators think it should be weak. So it very rarely defines an NES. Usually it is England, France, or Germany that makes things happen, and the Arcadia timeline looks like it will be the exact same way.

 

[Dachs]

No. In NESes, Spain is usually very weak. Even when it should be strong, moderators think it should be weak. So it very rarely defines an NES. Usually it is England, France, or Germany that makes things happen, and the Arcadia timeline looks like it will be the exact same way.

But I wasn't talking about what usually happens in NESes. In my opinion, the Unenlightenment map has two big strikes against it: relative bipolarity and the fact that it's already been done. Bipolar worlds in general are too common anyway. I could hardly care less about a given country being given short shrift; hell, I don't even really have a problem with the Greeks barely existing.

 

[Shadowbound]

Ooooooooh...

I think that in Arcadia, I asked Silver for Tver. I'd like to keep on that horse, though I might look at Bengal once you have stats up. For Unenlightenment, I'd try China, though I want to see stats of course.

EDIT: For the debate with Bipolar vs Multipolar, I prefer the Unenlightenment Anglo-Spanish world. Arcadia, though freer, has less of a context for your actions. If you try to model the difficulties in keeping large empires happy, then that gives smaller nations more room to work.

 

[Ninja Dude]

So, can somebody tell me where to find these timelines/discussions? It sounds interesting, I just need to know what's going on.

 

[North King]

But I wasn't talking about what usually happens in NESes.

But I was.

Bipolar worlds in general are too common anyway.

I agree, but there's a difference between tripolar or quadrupolar, and hexapolar, which is what seems to be the case in Arcadia... Unipolar worlds are underdone.

I could hardly care less about a given country being given short shrift; hell, I don't even really have a problem with the Greeks barely existing.

Not what I meant. I don't care about certain nations getting the worse end of things. I care about getting different nations than the usual. A France-Britain-Germany dynamic happens EVERY NES. Shouldn't we have something different?

 

[Dachs]

So, can somebody tell me where to find these timelines/discussions? It sounds interesting, I just need to know what's going on.

In previous threads - two development threads for silver2039's NESes, and the third Alternate History thread (maybe even some stuff earlier in this thread). Azale says he's collecting them all into a readable mass; for a comparatively unreadable one in the interim, see here.

I agree, but there's a difference between tripolar or quadrupolar, and hexapolar, which is what seems to be the case in Arcadia...

Which is bad how? The Great Powers were five, after all.

Unipolar worlds are underdone.

Not what I meant. I don't care about certain nations getting the worse end of things. I care about getting different nations than the usual. A France-Britain-Germany dynamic happens EVERY NES. Shouldn't we have something different?

In what NESes has a France-Britain-Germany dynamic recurred? It doesn't actually seem all that popular to me. I certainly can't remember those three being the leading players in the last few das NESes, for example, and DisNES II was more oriented around several different poles eek: like this one!) all over the world.

Further, I don't really see this world as France-Britain-Germany anyway, because France is seriously weakened and definitely at a backseat to, say, Portugal, especially outside Europe; further, there are other players clearly equal to France within Europe itself, like Tver' and Chernigov.

 

[Ninja Dude]

Thanks Dachs, I'm thinking of joining as Xin Ming or Qing. If one of those are too major, just give me the other.

 

[North King]

Which is bad how? The Great Powers were five, after all.

Truth. Six is pushing it, though, especially as they dominate completely different regions.

In what NESes has a France-Britain-Germany dynamic recurred? It doesn't actually seem all that popular to me. I certainly can't remember those three being the leading players in the last few das NESes, for example, and DisNES II was more oriented around several different poles eek: like this one!) all over the world.

Really? I suppose that VI and VII might not have been around that, but V and previous ones are often oriented around that.

Further, I don't really see this world as France-Britain-Germany anyway, because France is seriously weakened and definitely at a backseat to, say, Portugal, especially outside Europe; further, there are other players clearly equal to France within Europe itself, like Tver' and Chernigov.

Fair enough, but I think you'll find France will reintegrate with the world.

 

[Thlayli]

Ninja, I would most likely approve you for the Xin Ming, if you like. I need a Christophobic, mass-murdering, calculating villain to play Japan...it's a shame that silver's gone.

Shadow, I'll give tentative approval for Tver unless someone with more playing experience wants it. You should be fine for that or Bengal, though.

NK, if you're interested in shaking up the traditional power dynamic, join as Egypt, Flanders or the Second Malinese Empire or something of that nature. Or act from the shadows. It's all in good fun.

 

[Ninja Dude]

Thanks Thlayli, Xin Ming it is. I can't wait for a coherent timeline.

 

[~Darkening~]

....Japan? Sure, I'm not that Christophobic, but I'm certainly the latter two. A tentative request, depending on when it might be starting. And yes, I still remember your folly, Thlayli . 'Tis just my idiocy that just seems to shine through these days.

 

[Thlayli]

You picked a fairly useless backwater nation in TNESI. Sorry that Europe was exploding at the time, if not I would have paid more attention.

And, I'll consider your application for Japan. Projected start date is late May, if individuals tasked with the mapping and TLing portions of this project are able to deliver in a timely fashion. I will begin working on statistics soon, and a preview thread will be up in a few weeks.

 

[~Darkening~]

You Say:

Posted by Thlayli
You picked a fairly useless backwater nation in TNESI. Sorry that Europe was exploding at the time, if not I would have paid more attention.

I Hear:

Posted by Thlayli
Excuse excuse excuse excuse rwaaaaaah excuse excuse masskillingsofheriticsandeverythingelsethatcouldbefun excuse excuse excuse muskyteer excuse excuse excuse excuse honor excuse excuse excuse religiouswaaaaar.

 

[Thlayli]

If you're going to be angsty and annoying, you can at least do it in WWW. This thread is for posts of import.

 

[Kraznaya]

Filling in the major nations with players who are reasonably skilled ought to be Item One.

Admittedly, it is easier to mod a Guess-the-PoD map when you were the one who came up with the PoD and the map. (Ahhh, NES2 VI.) So yeah at least a kind of outline would be great, even if you lost your notes (I think you made mention of stuff to that effect sometime earlier). Hell, we'll help you . And if you're worried about not wanting to put in the work on something that's going to fail, I'll kill Thlayli if he doesn't actually go through with this, so it's all good.

What Dachs said.

If anyone knows the whereabouts of the following: Panda, LittleBoots, Perfectionist, dis, and Josef, who are either MIA or have left the forum, please drag them back here. I want them in.

Anyone else belatedly notice how disturbing this is?

Yes there is. France, Arcadia, Portugal, Germany, Japan, and maybe more can be counted as major powers. This means you'll have a lot of trouble getting everyone to play in character, you'll stretch the good players over too many nations, wars will be confused, nothing one player does will be related to another, and so on...

The competition is fine, but the NES is going to be so unfocused that no one will care about what happens except in their immediate surroundings.

Actually, I just had a lot of fun imagining areas of import to Arcadia and the fascinatingly complex web of power distribution in each. And you can bet I will be watching the webs of power, so each to his own I guess...

Reading through pages eight and nine of the aborted SINES, one thing I would like cleared up is the status of Argentina. If it's an Arcadian protectorate, how does it have a competing claim to the inheritance of the Empire affect the nature of the "protectorate?" If it doesn't, why is it independent? Actually, this goes for New Albion vis-a-vis Australia and Arcadia as well.

 

[Azale]

After some consideration, I would prefer Japan over Chernigov, but would be happy with either

 

[Yui108]

Are people claiming spots for a game with no stats or anything besides a map and a timeline yet?