It's an interesting conversation, because reducing meat eating within the current context (especially if you go as far as dismantling all the factory farm/bad practices that currently exist on the supply-side) will simply see it become an unaffordable upper-class luxury instead. So the question could become why do you hate poor people?
Clown Car V: 2020 version!
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How would you draw the line?
I have worked a little bit in welsh mountain sheep production. It probably burns far more in fossil fuels than the equivalent factory farm, but I think I could justify its existence easier than the factory farms I have worked on to the british public.
Pleasure vs survival.
Especially hedonistic pleasure vs survival. We all tell ourselves that we 'need' these little luxuries in order to 'recharge'. Some of that is true. Some of that is lying to ourselves.
But if you're deriving pleasure off of somebody else's pain, then you know there's a problem. Insofar as someone will not tamp down their needs, it's an issue.
Especially hedonistic pleasure vs survival. We all tell ourselves that we 'need' these little luxuries in order to 'recharge'. Some of that is true. Some of that is lying to ourselves.
But if you're deriving pleasure off of somebody else's pain, then you know there's a problem. Insofar as someone will not tamp down their needs, it's an issue.
Careful... people would lose their minds. I mean the internet would come for you. There is a NETFLIX documentary about someone who was trolling people by posting videos of him being cruel to cats and people were literally ready to murder him, devoting their lives to hunting him down like a dog, pun intended.
Conversations like this always make me think about how Michael Vick went to jail for dog abuse, and was visciously and unironically condemned by people who eat burgers and chicken wings by the truckload.
I think the cognitive dissonance is going to be very strong with folks if you try to draw the paralles between the treatment of farm/food animals versus "pets"...
Like George Carlin said... "So at best, the sanctity of life is kind of a selective thing. We get to choose which forms of life we feel are sacred, and we get to kill the rest. Pretty neat deal, huh? You know how we got it? We made the whole effing thing up!"
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FriendlyFire
Codex WMDicanious
The cheap available meat/ fat /sugar prices are the results of government subsidies
Rather then dismantle the meat production it would be better to address the subsidies, meat prices would increase and people would consume less. The US is paying farmers to produce as much as possible right now and this is the result
hobbsyoyo
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...and export it
In a time of national crisis and shortage, they are helping producers export our food while simultaneously maiming the workers who produce it by removing safeguards.
If that wasn't bad enough, just think about how Mitch McConnell has withheld stimulus votes and threatened shutdowns to provide litigation protections for those same ruthless producers. For months.
I leave my interior Christmas lights on 24-7. My exterior lights stay on all night. I'm using too much electricity. I'm sorry-ish, environment-wise when I think about it. I'm not turning my lights off. I like Christmas lights and my time to enjoy them with my wife and kids is finite.
America's finest. Will Trump grant them a pardon?
6 Suspects Indicted In Alleged Conspiracy To Kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer
December 17, 20203:32 PM ET
MARK KATKOV
A federal grand jury has charged six men with conspiring to kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer. The suspects are (from top left) Kaleb Franks, Brandon Caserta and Adam Fox, and (from bottom left) Daniel Harris, Barry Croft and Ty Garbin.
Kent County, Mich., Sheriff via AP
A federal grand jury has indicted six men on a charge of conspiring to kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer, a crime that upon conviction can bring a sentence of life in prison.
In a statement, U.S. Attorney Andrew Birge announced that the indictment was handed up on Wednesday. The men were previously charged by criminal complaint at the time of their arrest in October.
NATIONAL
Militia Members Plotted To Kidnap Michigan Gov. Whitmer, FBI Says
Adam Fox, Brandon Caserta, Ty Garbin, Kaleb Franks and Daniel Harris, all of Michigan, and Barry Croft of Delaware, allegedly began to plan the kidnapping last summer, conducting surveillance of Whitmer's rural vacation home and practicing the use of firearms and explosives, according to the indictment.
6 Suspects Indicted In Alleged Conspiracy To Kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer
December 17, 20203:32 PM ET
MARK KATKOV
Spoiler for large image :
A federal grand jury has charged six men with conspiring to kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer. The suspects are (from top left) Kaleb Franks, Brandon Caserta and Adam Fox, and (from bottom left) Daniel Harris, Barry Croft and Ty Garbin.
Kent County, Mich., Sheriff via AP
A federal grand jury has indicted six men on a charge of conspiring to kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer, a crime that upon conviction can bring a sentence of life in prison.
In a statement, U.S. Attorney Andrew Birge announced that the indictment was handed up on Wednesday. The men were previously charged by criminal complaint at the time of their arrest in October.
NATIONAL
Militia Members Plotted To Kidnap Michigan Gov. Whitmer, FBI Says
Adam Fox, Brandon Caserta, Ty Garbin, Kaleb Franks and Daniel Harris, all of Michigan, and Barry Croft of Delaware, allegedly began to plan the kidnapping last summer, conducting surveillance of Whitmer's rural vacation home and practicing the use of firearms and explosives, according to the indictment.
The drama never ends in the US.
Sooner or later you'll have another pornstar attack the potus - Biden this time. Cause precedents don't matter if the hate is strong enough; after all, the country is worth less than the presidential office.
Sooner or later you'll have another pornstar attack the potus - Biden this time. Cause precedents don't matter if the hate is strong enough; after all, the country is worth less than the presidential office.
I think it's a bit odd to describe the paying off of a porn star by the POTUS as a porn star "attacking" the POTUS
I think it's a bit odd to describe the paying off of a porn star by the POTUS as a porn star "attacking" the POTUS
I am describing the dem side rallying behind the pornstar, against the potus. Trump may be trash, but the position of president is also harmed
And I doubt this will go unnoticed from the gop side, so will be usable in turn.
I seriously hope you aren't comparing Lewinsky to a pornstar. She was obviously the victim, no?
No, I wouldn't. Ever heard of abusing one's own position of power?
Afaik that's almost as bad as fighting over proxy issues.
And we don't even know what JFK was doing in there. To say nothing of Buchanan, and I'm not even going near LBJ or Warren Harding.
Kyr is making a deeper point, since the Clinton affair was materially 'worse' than Trump's behaviour with the pornstars. We can call Lewinsky 'consenting', and in some ways she was. But not sufficiently so to let it be considered acceptable. Neither was the treatment she was subjected to later.
Trump's sexual assault of Natasha Stoynoff is a better comparison than him thinking wealth bought him sex with pornstars.
But yeah, Clinton literally degraded the office of the Presidency with his actions. The voters didn't mind hiring someone who thought he had 'seduced' pornstars, but that behaviour occurred before the mantle was taken on.
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