Ferguson

[James Stuart]

Just as relevant as yours was.



I mentioned this in another thread, but it deserves repeating given your comment here. The absolute worst police beating I ever personally saw was by the German Polizei. Just sayin.

In Germany, that's considered foreplay.

 

[James Stuart]

Source.

Ferguson police officer won't be charged in shooting death of Michael Brown

Grand jury finds that Darren Wilson, 28, did not break the law
Jurors considered range of charges including manslaughter and murder
Darren Wilson avoids charges – live updates

The police officer who shot dead an unarmed 18-year-old in Ferguson, Missouri, leading to weeks of tumult, will not face state criminal charges, it was announced on Monday.

A grand jury in St Louis County decided that Darren Wilson did not break the law when he killed Michael Brown on 9 August, after an altercation arising from the officer stopping him on the street. Some witnesses said Brown was shot after fleeing Wilson and raising his hands in an apparent surrender.

Brown’s death was followed by nights of intense clashes between police and protesters. Authorities in Ferguson are braced for more protests over the jury’s decision.

Evidence relating to the shooting was presented to grand jurors for three months. They considered potential charges against Wilson, 28, that included manslaughter and murder.

The jury’s decision was announced in a statement by Bob McCulloch, the prosecuting attorney for St Louis County, who oversaw the case.

Given the evidence JR posted, how the hell does this not even go to trial?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Source.




Given the evidence JR posted, how the hell does this not even go to trial?

Total lack of interest by the prosecutor.

 

[James Stuart]

More news. That is a live feed, so it will be updating as the story develops. There are reports of shots being fired, rioters being confronted with tear gas, and both the governor and Obama - and the kid's family - are calling for calm. If I were Commodore or anyone else in the area, I'd either lay low or get the hell out of there.

 

[Berzerker]

Given the evidence JR posted, how the hell does this not even go to trial?

the photo doesn't show us how close Brown was to Wilson when the fatal shots were fired, but I'm fairly sure that prosecutor said Brown had moved back toward Wilson because his blood was found 25 ft in the other direction. That does suggest Brown ran at the cop.

 

[Commodore]

35 feet (police lie) vs. 148 feet (documented distance) - self defense in altercation vs. unjustified killing

http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/11/us/missouri-ferguson-michael-brown-what-we-know/index.html

Did you not hear the prosecutor's announcement? He explained that there was a brief foot pursuit which would explain why the body was 148 feet from the car. Also the physical evidence presented to the grand jury clearly corroborated officer Wilson's version of events and directly contradicted and disproved eyewitness accounts stating Michael Brown was attempting to surrender.

Face it, counselor, the evidence has clearly shown that officer Wilson was justified in his use of lethal force against a violent thug who obviously had no intention of surrendering to police for the crime he committed. And don't try to come back with this being some sort of conspiracy to protect the cops because not a single piece of evidence or testimony was withheld and the grand jury was made up of 12 everyday citizens like you and me, not some shadowy mooks on the Ferguson PD's payroll.

And the actions of the protestors that we are currently witnessing shows that they really don't give a damn about Michael Brown or law enforcement reform. How does looting a liquor store and burning down black-owned businesses send the message that you want change? The Brown family asked protestors to observe a 4-and-a-half minute moment of silence after the announcement, yet as soon as the announcement was made, violence broke out. These protestors aren't freedom fighters or social justice advocates, they are street thugs using this incident as an excuse to act like the lawless animals they are. I also think the police are showing an extraordinary amount of restraint as well considering there have been numerous instances of gunfire directed at the police tonight. If I were the commander on the ground right now, as soon as the first instance of gunfire occurred I would have had the National Guard on the streets and instituted an immediate curfew. And the police didn't declare the protest unlawful and start clearing the streets until a police vehicle was vandalized. They tolerated the bottles and rocks being thrown at them, but once that happened the police gave the order to disperse, and rightfully so.

EDIT: The entirety of the grand jury's hearings as well as all the evidence they saw and testimony they heard has been made publicly available, so I say that trumps the speculation and fact-twisting of some CNN reporters.

 

[JollyRoger]

Once you hit the foot pursuit phase, you lose the self defense claim based on whatever happened in or near the vehicle.

I don't condone the burning and looting, but that does not necessarily represent the majority of protesters.

EDIT: The evidence has just been released, so it will take some time to pour over. The fact that it was released does not mean it is clean so far as a no bill goes.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Did you not hear the prosecutor's announcement? He explained that there was a brief foot pursuit which would explain why the body was 148 feet from the car. Also the physical evidence presented to the grand jury clearly corroborated officer Wilson's version of events and directly contradicted and disproved eyewitness accounts stating Michael Brown was attempting to surrender.

Face it, counselor, the evidence has clearly shown that officer Wilson was justified in his use of lethal force against a violent thug who obviously had no intention of surrendering to police for the crime he committed. And don't try to come back with this being some sort of conspiracy to protect the cops because not a single piece of evidence or testimony was withheld and the grand jury was made up of 12 everyday citizens like you and me, not some shadowy mooks on the Ferguson PD's payroll.

And the actions of the protestors that we are currently witnessing shows that they really don't give a damn about Michael Brown or law enforcement reform. How does looting a liquor store and burning down black-owned businesses send the message that you want change? The Brown family asked protestors to observe a 4-and-a-half minute moment of silence after the announcement, yet as soon as the announcement was made, violence broke out. These protestors aren't freedom fighters or social justice advocates, they are street thugs using this incident as an excuse to act like the lawless animals they are. I also think the police are showing an extraordinary amount of restraint as well considering there have been numerous instances of gunfire directed at the police tonight. If I were the commander on the ground right now, as soon as the first instance of gunfire occurred I would have had the National Guard on the streets and instituted an immediate curfew. And the police didn't declare the protest unlawful and start clearing the streets until a police vehicle was vandalized. They tolerated the bottles and rocks being thrown at them, but once that happened the police gave the order to disperse, and rightfully so.

EDIT: The entirety of the grand jury's hearings as well as all the evidence they saw and testimony they heard has been made publicly available, so I say that trumps the speculation and fact-twisting of some CNN reporters.

Bottom line, the prosecutor went in front of a grand jury, and since the accused was a cop he pretended to be a defense attorney. Usually grand juries indict, because a grand jury usually only sees the prosecution's case. Unsurprisingly, when no prosecution case was presented they didn't indict. This was exactly what the people of Ferguson, and the rest of St Louis county, expected from their prosecutor, and this is the result.

 

[Commodore]

Once you hit the foot pursuit phase, you lose the self defense claim based on whatever happened in or near the vehicle.

Not if the criminal you are pursuing turns around and charges back at you with hostile intent. Which Michael Brown did as shown by the physical evidence; which, as the prosecutor so eloquently put it, is not prone to bias.

 

[JollyRoger]

Physical evidence can certainly be interpreted in different ways.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Not if the criminal you are pursuing turns around and charges back at you with hostile intent. Which Michael Brown did as shown by the physical evidence; which, as the prosecutor so eloquently put it, is not prone to bias.

If a prosecutor claims that his job is something other than to present the evidence in such a fashion that it creates a bias towards conviction he is either lying or has a genuine total failure to understand his job.

 

[Commodore]

Bottom line, the prosecutor went in front of a grand jury, and since the accused was a cop he pretended to be a defense attorney. Usually grand juries indict, because a grand jury usually only sees the prosecution's case. Unsurprisingly, when no prosecution case was presented they didn't indict. This was exactly what the people of Ferguson, and the rest of St Louis county, expected from their prosecutor, and this is the result.

No he did not act as a defense attorney. I encourage you to look up his announcement of the grand jury's decision. In that announcement he explained exactly how the entire process went down, and the charges he recommended the grand jury to consider (as any prosecutor is supposed to for a grand jury hearing). He also gives a "minute-by minute" account of how the incident occurred according to the physical evidence gathered.

 

[JollyRoger]

His announcement looked like the closing argument for a defense attorney.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

No he did not act as a defense attorney. I encourage you to look up his announcement of the grand jury's decision. In that announcement he explained exactly how the entire process went down, and the charges he recommended the grand jury to consider (as any prosecutor is supposed to for a grand jury hearing). He also gives a "minute-by minute" account of how the incident occurred according to the physical evidence gathered.

He also points out how the physical evidence presented corroborated officer Wilson's testimony.

Here's a challenge for you...check out what percentage of cases this guy has presented to a grand jury in which he called on the accused to testify.

 

[Commodore]

His announcement looked like the closing argument for a defense attorney.

Because he was trying to provide answers as to how the process worked to illustrate that the right decision was made. But they showed footage of the protestors listening to the announcement side-by-side with the footage of the prosecutor making the announcement and as soon as he said there would be no indictment, the protestors immediately stopped listening and proceeded to act like the thugs they are by attacking police and destroying/looting businesses.

If anything this prosecutor recognized the sensitive nature of this announcement and was trying to be as transparent as he could in the hopes of assuaging some of the anger. But, as I have stated before (I can't remember if it was here or somewhere else) these protestors thugs refuse to listen to reason and evidence and just wanted officer Wilson's blood; and now that they won't get it, they are throwing their tantrum and harming the livelihoods of people who have nothing to do with the situation. But hey, who cares as long as they get that bottle of OE from the liquor store or those pills from the Walgreen's they looted, right? Hell they even looted and burned down a Little Caesar's and an O'Reilly Auto Parts.

 

[James Stuart]

Physical evidence can certainly be interpreted in different ways.

Which is why Quincy should still be on prime time.

 

[Commodore]

He also points out how the physical evidence presented corroborated officer Wilson's testimony.

Here's a challenge for you...check out what percentage of cases this guy has presented to a grand jury in which he called on the accused to testify.

He didn't call on the accused to testify. As far as I understand it, Wilson volunteered his testimony and was not called to testify by the prosecutor or the grand jury.

You seem to be making a lot of assumptions about this case that simply are not true.

 

[JollyRoger]

Because he was trying to provide answers as to how the process worked to illustrate that the right decision was made. But they showed footage of the protestors listening to the announcement side-by-side with the footage of the prosecutor making the announcement and as soon as he said there would be no indictment, the protestors immediately stopped listening and proceeded to act like the thugs they are by attacking police and destroying/looting businesses.

If anything this prosecutor recognized the sensitive nature of this announcement and was trying to be as transparent as he could in the hopes of assuaging some of the anger. But, as I have stated before (I can't remember if it was here or somewhere else) these protestors thugs refuse to listen to reason and evidence and just wanted officer Wilson's blood; and now that they won't get it, they are throwing their tantrum and harming the livelihoods of people who have nothing to do with the situation. But hey, who cares as long as they get that bottle of OE from the liquor store or those pills from the Walgreen's they looted, right? Hell they even looted and burned down a Little Caesar's and an O'Reilly Auto Parts.

You act like all the protesters are looting and rioting.

If the prosecutor recognize the sensitive nature of the announcement, he wouldn't have made his long winded closing argument at 8:30 pm and he wouldn't have spent 20 minutes trolling before making the announcement.

 

[MobBoss]

Total lack of interest by the prosecutor.

I don't think so. The grand jury examined hundreds of hours of evidence, including eyewitness testimony and forensics. They had access to stuff that no one else has seen.

Do you really, and I mean really, think this particular prosecutor slow rolled this thing given the national exposure it has? Given the federal interest in this case?

Really?



I think that blaming the prosecutor is a total cop out claim. I would think this incident was examined from every facet possible by the people on that grand jury because they fully knew what the stakes were.....and at the end of it all it came down to the simple fact that there was conflicting eyewitness testimony, but solid forensic evidence which corroborated the officers story more than it did the eyewitness accounts saying otherwise.

Bottom line, the prosecutor went in front of a grand jury, and since the accused was a cop he pretended to be a defense attorney. Usually grand juries indict, because a grand jury usually only sees the prosecution's case. Unsurprisingly, when no prosecution case was presented they didn't indict. This was exactly what the people of Ferguson, and the rest of St Louis county, expected from their prosecutor, and this is the result.

Were you in the courtroom?

No.

The only bottom line here is you are simply making crap up at this moment.

That is all. The truth of the matter is this Grand Jury based its decision on the totality of the evidence that could be presented in a case and decided not to indict the officer. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[JollyRoger]

I don't think so. The grand jury examined hundreds of hours of evidence, including eyewitness testimony and forensics.

Every accused should get such a grand jury effort by the prosecution.