Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by Sirian, Dec 22, 2005.
Sorry, guys. It's been a crazy couple of days, but I'm back and can take it.
IT - Spend 174 to rush a grocer in Awlil. It will pay for itself in the time it would have taken to build it, plus we'll get the extra health before the city grows again.
BT - Awlil grocer - market. I realize we can't grow until the market is done anyway, and add some specialists. Agades harbor - library.
We get a Great Prophet in Timbuktu! At 20% odds (or thereabouts)!
(1) 1730 AD - Construct The Temple of Solomon in Timbuktu! It immediately adds 26 base commerce, and our nation's income is in the black! I keep the prophets in Awdag for possible multiple-head building.
BT - Steel in, start steam power. Let's hope we have coal.
Timbuktu Wall Street (look at that commerce go!) - rifleman.
Kumbi rifle - ironworks
walata something (sorry) - bank.
I consider the ironworks in Walata, but decide that Kumbi's still a bit better. The fish and the lake make all the difference. Walata will eventually have nice commerce and shields, down the road, so it will be a fine little city even without the ironworks.
(2) 1735 AD - Rush the market in Awlil for 235. Now we can grow again! I keep a couple of specialists, as we are not going to be growing too much there.
Wake galleon near Walata to send new rifle to Wadan. My priority is going to be the outlying cities first for the new units. I feel like I want another galley, too.
Now that our Hydra has a head, I really want to start sending missionaries to foreign cities without religion, too. We've got three Jewish monateries, so it wouldn't tie our hands for civics, either.
Adopt representation (for happy with draft), nationhood, theocracy. The cash-rush-for-the-colonies will have to wait 5 turns or so.
Draft in Timbuktu, Djenne, Kumbi. Swap Djenne to galleon.
Buy world maps from Peter, Kublai, and Fred (the only ones who will sell theirs). I'm trying to look for the current state of religion in the world. Also, why do we have a caravel sleeping in Russia? Send the Russian caravel home. Swap Timbuktu to missionary.
Priority for drafted rifles is SE, near our German border.
We can go to 90% science at a surplus, or 100% at a deficit. We love the hydra! We go to 100%, just for fun.
BT - Times were interesting enough. Now, Khan wants us to fight Germany with him. I go ahead and sign on. I think we're close enough to prepared that we shouldn't lose anything. Not sure that we can make any gains, but who cares about that?
Gao market - rifle. Awlil market - grenadier.
(3) 1740 AD - Turn science to 90% and upgrade some units in critical areas.
Draft in Awlil, Gao, Niani. Send a woodsman-1 rifle to stand on the woods next to our iron island.
BT - German troops show up (predictably) near Awlil. Timbuktu Jewish missionary - rifle. Niani grocer - cannon.
(4) 1745 AD - Heh, that German boat turns out to just be a caravel. No, Fred! Don't convert us to Judaism! Anything but that! Fred does also have a galley near Kumbi that we should keep an eye on.
Draft in Tekedda, Kumbi (the happiest place on Earth ), Gao. In the past 4 turns, we've gone from 5th in the number of soldiers to 2nd.
We could really use a navy. Swap Timbuktu to frigate. Also propose changing Timbuktu's name to TImbuktu to reduce the number of typos in my reports.
BT - Galley doesn't move. Fred's caravel drops out of sight.
(5) 1750 AD - Move some rifles around. Missionary sets off towards China in the west.
(6) 1755 AD - Still no word from Germany. I feel so unloved. Upgrade the idle galley in Apache. We could use one more to move units around in the SW. It won't make it in time, but it will be available in the future.
BT - Tadmekka observatory - bank.
(7) 1760 - We don't need to draft any more units. Change civics to bureaucracy and organized religion. We should stay in representation util the drafting happiness fades.
BT - Steam power - railroad. Timbuktu frigate - ironclad.
(8) 1765 - Niani is going to have some happy problems after it grows. Queue up a market after the cannon to help. There's coal by Tekedda and Kumbi. Tekedda coal will need to be hooked up.
Instead of sailing the missionary all the way to China, decide to unload the first one in Setia, then head back for another.
Fred now has two caravels in sight near Ning-hsia, but nothing else.
Gao rifle - Jewish missionary. Walata bank - market.
(9) 1770 AD - It looks like Fred will talk, but I don't know what he thinks of our phony war. I'll leave that up to our next leader. I use our frigate to sink a German caravel that has strayed into our waters- the first blood of the war. There's another caravel there, too.
Spread Judaism in Setia and see our income go up by 5. Tekedda observatory - market. Apache Hermitage - University. Wadan library- courthouse.
Fred and Caesar make peace.
(10) 1775 AD - Although our frigate is a bit wounded, Fred's caravel is at 1.9, so I attack and we win.
Khan has furs available, so we should probably work something out there. We could also end the war if we want. The draft unhappy should start to wear off in single-drafted towns starting in about two turns. When the 5 largest are feeling better, consider universal suffrage. Of course, I've spent our cash surplus, but we're also in much better shape militarily and running higher science.
See it. Probably more like tomorrow than not.
Sounds like a good round.
Obiwan Farmobi is UP NOW!
Some pics would be nice!!!
I'll see what I can do, but it may fall to Sirian.
Didn't have energy to play last night. Will play in a few, and see how far I get with that.
 1775 AD - Things look good. We could use a few rifles, but nothing urgent. We're at war with Fred, but he'll talk. There's not a lot of reason to keep fighting him, either. He'll pay us 50 gold for peace, so I take it.
Another SG, another turn around being the He Kept Us Out Of War player.
 1780 AD - Niani Cannon->Market.
Various workers with nothing to do are fortified places.
 1785 AD - Timbuktu Ironclad->Monastary, Gao Missionary->Monastary, Awlil Gren->Observatory.
Now I have an ironclad, ho ho ho.
We have ten million people.
IBT - Qin wants Liberalism. Gut feeling says no, and I decline.
 1790 AD - Tadmekka Bank->Grocer.
We have this random caravel in the middle of nowhere. I'm sure it's doing something important, but, uh...
 1795 AD - Timbuktu Monastary->Monastary.
I like the chain of ships it takes to get missionaries to Rome.
 1800 AD - Railroad comes in, start on Assembly Line.
 1802 AD - Timbuktu Monastary->Monastary.
I have, I assure you, been workin' on the railroad.
IBT - Khan wants to trade Fur for Crab. Sure thing, buddy.
 1804 AD - Walata Market->Monastary, Agades Library->Bank.
*insert Blazing Saddles opening railroad scene here, just because*
IBT - Qin wants us to convert to Buddhism, and I decline.
 1806 AD - Timbuktu Monastary->Monastary, Gao Monastary->Temple, Djenne Galleon->Monastary.
IBT - Apparently I've annoyed Qin overly much, because he cancels Open Borders.
 1808 AD - Niani Market->Monastary.
 1810 AD - Timbuktu Monastary->Courthouse, Tekkeda Market->Monastary.
You know, I even mentioned the caravel in my report, although I didn't use screenshots.
Someone had parked the caravel over in Russia, and put it to sleep. I noticed it in the military advisor, and decided to send it home where it could pick up missionaries and take them to other cities (say, in China) to imrpove our income.
But, long gotos aren't considered polite during a SG, and they're particularly bad news when you're at war with an AI whose territory you must cross on the way home. We're headed home through England, but we had to go through a bit of German territory on the way. So, I didn't leave it on goto, but left it awake so that you could see it.
The Caravel was the way to get our Merchant past Qin's closed borders to Moscow. I found an alternate solution in getting those borders opened, but it seems our gains with Qin have dried up.
In round after round, the ships I've inherited have tended not to make sense. I'm sure others are feeling the same. If there is one place with the most anarchy in our game plan, it's what to be doing with the ships. They were exploring at one point, but buying a map ended that, and since, they seem to be moving around just to be moving. I know that I've had to move several from wherever they were to where I need them.
I left that one caravel in Russian waters despite its mission being completed because it was our only ship in the region. The idea of carrying a Merchant or Missionary all the way to a destination on board ship is obsolete. Ferry them to one of the main land masses and then use roads.
Anyway, the ships are a minor issue at this point. We have enough to spare a couple to confusion.
Oh, and multiturn Goto's being SG faux pas... I'm not really on board with that notion. I use goto a LOT, and I use it in SGs, and I pass on my rounds with Goto orders. Now either these have always made sense to the next player, or I've chosen wisely in where I tend to do this (not abusing it, etc), or people have not felt enough annoyance to complain. Whatever the cause, I'm kosher with Goto orders spanning in to my turn. Civ4 is much more of a momentum game than Civ3 was, and people just have to get used to that. You can't simply rewire all the build orders you inherit. Changing tacks is a big deal, and if you do it, it has to be because circumstances in the game change. Your opportunity to make a difference usually lies in the choices you pass on to the next player. It's a more interdependent, team-centric type of gameplay. Goto orders were hated in Civ3, including by me, but this is a new era.
IT 1810AD: Most things are looking good. We are about to arrive at Factory/Infantry tech. Probably a little too much goodness in one spot there, on the tech tree, but this is just me thinking out loud. Nothing to see here, move along little dogie.
We have a pair of workers at Apache building NDSRs. Those must be reassigned to useful duty. They'll need to come back, post-Biology, for that now-infamous Obiwan Farmobi duty, but that's then and this is now.
These are going to be Dry Farms(TM) some day, the green dots. Nothing else useful to do with this land. No hope of irrigation, but no other way to get any food up there. Something is better than nothing. The Yellow dot is a slightly matured cottage that the Cows may be able to feed, when the city starts to top out on whatever population it's going to have.
I move the sleeping galleon on the IT, then on my first turn, load up those slacking workers and haul them in to the port, where they can be unloaded without burning a second turn in transit. (One wasted turn on ship is better than two!)
I see some "mysterious mining" activities on the outskirts of our territories.
FYI, mines can only pop resources IF WORKED BY A CITY POPULATION POINT, so those mines outside of city radii are purely decorative in nature.
1812AD: We discover Assembly Line, start SciMeth. I could trade a tech to Germany for it, but I opt not to do that.
We pop a new leader at TImbuktu and it's a merchant. Perfect! If I can get Fred to reopen his borders, I can get this leader to Moscow on my round, using the Caravel parked in the Russian bay to ferry him past the blockade that is Qin's closed borders.
Er... Woops. There is a glitch in the plan. MY SHIP HAS DISAPPEARED.
And it is now THIRTEEN TURNS AWAY, doing goodness knows what (Lots of and , it would seem.)
Alrighty, then. Scrap that plan! Who needs cash anyway. We passed on the chance to beeline to Kremlin, and we're not even IN UniSuff any more, and our bankroll that I left at the end of my last round is gone, too. So the "buy our way through the end game" plan was apparently voted down by the team. ... Alrighty then. On to Plan B.
OK, so I didn't spell out exactly what that ship was doing there. You have now experienced a Sulla Moment(TM). There are always those moves that seem obvious to me, that leave normal, sane human beings scratching their heads, and which items fall in to this category, I am notoriously bad at predicting, so... There are always those times when I have put together a plan or an opportunity, and well...
Sulla hates following me in an SG. I was lucky to talk him in to following me in RB1. (I think he'd rather have gone ahead of me there instead. ... No, seriously.)
OK, so... On with the show.
I fire the offending ship captain, make the crew walk the plank, and sink the boat. That Caravel has been disbanded.
If it's of no particular use, then we can do without it.
PLAN B: Save the merchant for a golden age. (Who knows. Fred may not have wanted to open up his border to us, anyway.)
Speaking of which, I take a close look at everybody we do have open borders with. These include +2 apiece from Khan, Julius, and Peter, and our relations are otherwise not the best with any of these turkeys. OK, then. Can't afford to close the border! However, running Representation, plus all these towns with Forge and Organized State Religion, we can pull 3spt in every town, plus three beakers per turn, plus some GP points, by switching to Mercantilism. The loss in trade route income will be mostly made up by the gain in research from Representation, and we get our factories built a lot sooner.
I make the change to Mercantilism, and I reorder all our towns.
Factories are going up everywhere now. Except the western 2-tile fish island, which isn't worth spending the time on a factory and coal plant.
The Cathedral at our Priest town was... an interesting choice. Not sure why we're building one that didn't get production bonus, though. We could have gotten the ability to make a fifth priest from ANY Cathedral-type building. It is nearly done, though, so I keep going with it. Probably worth it to build the Buddhist shrine even at this late date.
1818AD: Discover SciMeth, learn that Russia already got the free leader at Physics, start research in to Biology.
I know in the original plan for Walata, I mentioned that we should keep ONLY the two forests on the hills, and all else had to be farmed to get enough food to work all the tiles, even post-Biology. I guess that plan wasn't emphasized, or reminded, or whatever, but we had one forest left to remove.
I take care of it.
1830AD: Discover Biology, start Medicine. (This is the most Health-poor situation I've been in in a long time. Need Hospitals, or maybe even (GASP!) to use Environmentalism civic.)
All useful railroads have been built or the last couple under construction. Next player up has to do some Dry Farms(TM) and play Obiwan Farmobi at Apache.
Unless there is a war, next round will be kind of dull: building factories, etc.
We should consider Pentagon at Kumbi. Statue of Liberty may also be more attractive now that we've abandoned the UniSuff/Kremlin approach in favor of Representation/Mercantilism.
Jaffa is UP NOW.
Thanks for saying that Sirian. It's been needed I think.
Heh, well that was me on the caravel *and* the bankroll this round. I was actually worried about the war for the first few turns (when we had nothing and I didn't realize Germany didn't either) and I got a bit upgrade-happy.
Anyway, I think we got through the war unscathed!
Just for the record, I don't hate following Sirian in Succession Games - more accurate to say, I feel "pressured" at times to follow his logic. Way back in RBE1 (Civ3 SG, that is) I couldn't figure out why Sirian had placed one of his dots in the spot where he did, as it narrowly missed an incense resource. So I moved one of Sirian's dots on my turn! That brought this little response from Sirian:
And then we had another debate over the placement of a city called Ergili. So much discussion over the placing of a terrible little junk city which would never amount to anything! Anyway, don't feel bad if you mere mortals can't always follow the intended moves of the master.
Better safe than sorry. We don't have a ton of cottages anyway, and it's interesting to be running Mercantilism without having closed our borders. I have not found that to be a right combination ever before, but it's what has been passed on to Jaffa. It's Organized Religion that is making it worthwhile, though we may be nearing the end of the line with that after Factories are around, as a 20% boost (over base plus Forge) is significant, but a 12% boost (over Forge/Factory/Power) is much less so, making Free Religion or Theocracy more attractive (or even some Pacificism).
As for Sulla hating to follow me in an SG... OK, we'll rewire the wording on that one. Let's try this phrasing: "Sulla [insert substitute verb for "hates" here] to follow me in an SG."
Pressure? What pressure? It's not like I expect you to read my mind. Right?
Lurker's comment: Really? That's too bad -- now my workers are going to need even more things to do in the game instead of wandering around building mines on tiles.
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