The "OMG! Look what happened in DoC!" Thread

[hoplitejoe]

I was under the impression it was more of a gameplay thing rather than a history thing.

 

[Royal Tenenbaum]

Gameplay? Europe has been expanded since then. I don't think we need to limit Italy now.

 

[The Diocletian]

What does the conditional spawn do for gameplay, though?

 

[Royal Tenenbaum]

I think Leoreth felt Italy crowded up Italy. But now that isn't the case with an expanded Europe and new culture rules

 

[Leoreth]

I wanted it to remain benefitial for HRE or France to conquer Italy and that's not the case if a civ spawns on top of you.

Besides, shouting inconsistency makes for a bad argument at least as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Jusos2108]

Imo Leoreth decision is pretty good, since a unified Italian civilization in the Middle Ages doesn't seem right. This way Italy is present occasionally, but Italy can also be controlled by France or HRE, which is pretty historical.

 

[Lone Wolf]

To be fair, the distinction between "collapsed civilization" and "still existing civilization running City States" is blurry.

 

[The Diocletian]

Leoreth, your logic is sound, but what about civs like Persia, Rome, England, Spain, or Portugal? These civs are all encouraged to expand into flip areas, and dealing with this flip is part of the gameplay of that civ. Why not expand this to France or Germany? Why are they exempt?

 

[apenpaap]

Probably because of the dates involved. For their UHV, all civs you mentioned are supposed to finish, or at least finish their expansion goal, before the flips occur. And even if you don't play for UHV, they all give you time enough to enjoy that land before losing it. Not so with Italy, which you'd lose quite early in the Middle Ages, way before either French or Austrian UHV ends, and without enough time to make good use of it either.

 

[Royal Tenenbaum]

Italy rarely takes Rome and Naples, which makes for a good representation of the Lombard League, Venice, and Florence/Pisa/Milan/Genoa

 

[Leoreth]

To be fair, the distinction between "collapsed civilization" and "still existing civilization running City States" is blurry.

Yes.

Leoreth, your logic is sound, but what about civs like Persia, Rome, England, Spain, or Portugal? These civs are all encouraged to expand into flip areas, and dealing with this flip is part of the gameplay of that civ. Why not expand this to France or Germany? Why are they exempt?

As apenpaap said, because of the time differences involved. HRE and France usually don't make it to Rome by the Italian spawn and as soon as they're present they don't manage it at all.

On the other hand, Italy can't spawn later because it needs as much time as justifiable for its own UHV.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Leoreth, your logic is sound, but what about civs like Persia, Rome, England, Spain, or Portugal? These civs are all encouraged to expand into flip areas, and dealing with this flip is part of the gameplay of that civ. Why not expand this to France or Germany? Why are they exempt?

Rome and Persia are pretty much unavoidable, England suffers from it only to a very small degree, the only historical/common sense area of expansion that flips being the USA West Coast (it's free from flips with settling Canada, Australia, South Africa, conquering India, France). I agree that this happening to Spain and Portugal is problematic, that's why I am not that enthusiastic about Argentina and Brazil (of course, I can always harshen the Argentina/Brazil spawn conditions).

 

[The Diocletian]

As apenpaap said, because of the time differences involved. HRE and France usually don't make it to Rome by the Italian spawn and as soon as they're present they don't manage it at all.

On the other hand, Italy can't spawn later because it needs as much time as justifiable for its own UHV.

Hmm. Yeah, that makes sence. I can accept that.

 

[Justynian]

So, what exactly don't they like in their city?

One lonely Russian forest far from the motherland

 

[FinalLegendZero]

So, what exactly don't they like in their city?

One lonely Russian forest far from the motherland

The extra is from drafting units, and the Russian territory is from its pseudo-TC event that the AI gets when it discovers Railroad. Neither are OMG moments.

 

[Justynian]

Maybe i play to little with autoritarian systems, cause i've never noticed it before

 

[Jusos2108]

Basic Middle East:

 

[Royal Tenenbaum]

Seems about wrong.

 

[yurisusuki]

Spoiler :

Netherlands don't give a chance to England

Spoiler :

Super Portugal

But Brazil..

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

Go home Turkey

Bizantines Oh Bizantines

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

Holy Rome

 

[Atlantic Pacf.]

Spoiler :

Holy Rome

Wait, is the Sistine Chapel still being built in the 20th century?