J-man
Deity
All true but still, you could see I just started reading it and I'm new to the franchise.
(I wrote that post with a humorous twist, so it wasn't meant as an attack)
The Very-Many-Questions-Not-Worth-Their-Own-Thread Thread XLI
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All true but still, you could see I just started reading it and I'm new to the franchise.
(I wrote that post with a humorous twist, so it wasn't meant as an attack)
Tolkienophobe!
GinandTonic
Saphire w/ Schweps + Lime
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Freudian slit?
I wrote:
I don't actually think I spoiled much. There's much more I did have in my post that I deleted because it went into specifics that a new reader would not really need to know. The novel has an extensive set of appendices in the back, and I strongly recommend reading them. They will answer a lot of questions you might have.Valka D'Ur said:
I did say that Paul's story ends in Children of Dune, but I didn't (and won't) say how. It's not really a spoiler to mention this, due to the immense time jump between Children and God Emperor. There's another huge time jump between God Emperor and Heretics.
To find out how Duncan Idaho can be in all six books, you will have to read Dune Messiah.
**Duncan Idaho is my favorite character
Oh, and please do NOT believe the BS claim by Kevin J. Anderson/Brian Herbert that Paul of Dune is the 'direct' sequel to Dune. It really isn't, since it retcons and actually disavows the entirety of the events of the Dune novel (claiming it's just propaganda and never happened).
The original six books are:
Dune
Dune Messiah
Children of Dune
God Emperor of Dune
Heretics of Dune
Chapterhouse: Dune
There was supposed to be one final novel, but Frank Herbert died before he could finish it. Even so, Chapterhouse: Dune makes a logical end to the series even though there are a few plot points left unaddressed. KJA/BH's Hunters/Sandworms of Dune duology claim to be what FH was working on, but they're so badly-written, completely missing Frank Herbert's point about some of the critical characters, and are a blatant self-reference to their own inferior novels (as in you'd need to read those to understand WTH is even going on in parts of H/S) that I honestly do not recommend reading them.
Other Dune-related books I do recommend:
The Dune Encyclopedia: Compiled by Dr. Willis McNelly, who was Frank Herbert's friend. Herbert gave his blessing to this book, with the caveat that he would not be bound by it in future novels and could (as he did) change some things (the Encyclopedia was published after God Emperor, but before Heretics). This is the book that really explains the Butlerian Jihad, Fremen history, culture, and politics, the history and politics of the Imperium, the Bene Gesserit, and the Sardaukar, the ecology of various planets, and so on. Some articles are fluff - such as a story about a couple of Bene Gesserit sisters who work in their chapterhouse's laundry and one of them wins a trip for two to the planet of Gamont. What they saw and experienced on their holiday wasn't quite what they expected... One of the things I really enjoyed was the sheet music for a couple of Gurney Halleck's songs.
National Lampoon's DOON. It's a prose satire of Dune, and I found it hilarious. It's the best kind of satire - the sort that respects the source material.
Songs of Muad'Dib: This is a collection of poems written by Frank Herbert. Not all of them have to do with Dune. This one might be hard to find. I only have a copy because I ran across them in a local liquidation store (they evidently didn't sell very well, which is too bad).
Eye: This is an anthology of short stories and includes two special Dune entries: The first is Frank Herbert's retrospective of his experiences and impressions of the making of the 1984 David Lynch version of Dune (fans usually refer to it as "the Lynch movie"), and the second is a "walking tour" of Arrakeen for pilgrims who have come to pay homage to Paul Atreides, known as Muad'Dib among the Fremen. This book has some incredibly gorgeous illustrations of the palace of Arrakeen, some of the characters (ie. Irulan, Mohiam, and Duncan Idaho), and Arrakeen as seen from the desert. The in-universe time setting for this walking tour would be during Dune Messiah. The other stories in the book are not related to Dune.
Dreamer of Dune: This is Brian Herbert's biography of his father, Frank Herbert. I found it an interesting read, though of course I don't know if Brian embellished, changed, or omitted anything significant.
world's worst typist.
Zkribbler
Deity
i c whut u did thar
GinandTonic
Saphire w/ Schweps + Lime
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Well, whenever one sees an innuendo, it's best to best whip it out.
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
Why do all these hipster teas come without teabags? It's so much more annoying to make this crap.
Unfortunately this is the only type of tea I have right now, and I really wanted tea (coming down with something, no covid symptoms though).. So.. yeah.. are the people selling this crap just lazy? Put it in a teabag already, it makes it so much easier. What's next, selling butter without the packaging?
Unfortunately this is the only type of tea I have right now, and I really wanted tea (coming down with something, no covid symptoms though).. So.. yeah.. are the people selling this crap just lazy? Put it in a teabag already, it makes it so much easier. What's next, selling butter without the packaging?
Zardnaar
Deity
If you're not a Dune purist some of the new Dune books are easier and more fun to read.
It's not like Herberts originals are that good outside Dune itself.
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
@The_J I am going to just assume that it's the hipsters responsible and that they are slowly ruining everything on this planet.
I enjoyed the new Dune books. I think a lot of people set themselves up for failure by expecting Frank Herbert's prose from them or whatever. Frank Herbert's style of writing is nothing like the new books. The new books are average space opera fare at best. It's a light read, while Herbert's material was more like a heavy multilayered gears within gears sort of fare that you have to read 15 times to really grok.
I remember reading the butlerial jihad trilogy when I was quite sick and in bed for 2 weeks.. and had my heart broken a month beforehand or so.. I knew that the books weren't going to be the same kind of novels as the old Dune books and went into the experience expecting something else.. So I wasn't disappointed.. Herbert Jr & KJA have no idea how to write dialogue, but everything else they did was passable. I found the trilogy entertaining and it basically kept me distracted for a couple weeks during that tough time. When I finished that trilogy I just kept reading, and the books seemed to get better each time they wrote a new one. The House trilogy was the worst and I almost didn't make my way through them. I expect the characters to drive any story I read, but like I said these guys suck at writing dialogue, so it just wasn't working for me.. I never finished making my way through all these books, but overall I found them entertaining enough. Like I said re-reading the originals is a completely different experience.
I enjoyed the new Dune books. I think a lot of people set themselves up for failure by expecting Frank Herbert's prose from them or whatever. Frank Herbert's style of writing is nothing like the new books. The new books are average space opera fare at best. It's a light read, while Herbert's material was more like a heavy multilayered gears within gears sort of fare that you have to read 15 times to really grok.
I remember reading the butlerial jihad trilogy when I was quite sick and in bed for 2 weeks.. and had my heart broken a month beforehand or so.. I knew that the books weren't going to be the same kind of novels as the old Dune books and went into the experience expecting something else.. So I wasn't disappointed.. Herbert Jr & KJA have no idea how to write dialogue, but everything else they did was passable. I found the trilogy entertaining and it basically kept me distracted for a couple weeks during that tough time. When I finished that trilogy I just kept reading, and the books seemed to get better each time they wrote a new one. The House trilogy was the worst and I almost didn't make my way through them. I expect the characters to drive any story I read, but like I said these guys suck at writing dialogue, so it just wasn't working for me.. I never finished making my way through all these books, but overall I found them entertaining enough. Like I said re-reading the originals is a completely different experience.
You can transport loose leaf tea and keep it fresh much easier than you can tea bags. You can get really good tea really cheap buying loose leaf online. You have to find a tool that works for you. I can recommend the two styles below at opposite ends of the spectrum.
Spoiler Really cheap and easy but you get a few tea leaves out :
Spoiler Fancy pants thing that makes it easy to make loads just right :
It was found that tea bags break down and tiny bits of microplastic get into your body (you immerse the tea bag in hot water, these bits of plastic start breaking down, the plastic is now in your tea, you drink it, and... it's not a good thing). I haven't drunk tea since reading about that because all of mine is in bags.
I've already stated the many, many reasons why I detest the non-FH stuff, and which exceptions I've made. I made the exceptions because they respected the source material. Keven J. Anderson and Brian Herbert extended their middle fingers and said "F-you" to the source material and proceeded to butcher it.
I'm surprised you wouldn't have heard about what was discovered about tea bags.Buy a tea egg
Good question though.
My first experience of these books was reading House Atreides while spending 5 weeks in the hospital back in 2001. At first it was wonderful to have new Dune material to read, but as the book went on, I noticed details that were incorrect, historical details that were just plain wrong, and a style of writing that was NOT up to what should be happening in any professionally published book (readers being reminded every 2-3 pages about what was happening, people's relationships with each other... it's like KJA/BH thought they were writing for people with extemely short-term memories who had no notion of flipping back a few pages if they forgot a detail).
And then there were the BIG contradictions. Duncan Idaho's first sword-kill in Duke Leto's service occurred on Grumman. Nowhere else. Leto was not best buddies with the ruling family of IX, certainly not to the point where his best friend becomes a cyborg and Leto shrugs it off and says it's fine. This goes against everything that's been socially and emotionally programmed into these people over the course of millennia that thinking machines (and by this time Leto's friend has become a thinking machine) are anathema and must not be tolerated). And Paul was NOT born on Kaitain, he was NOT kidnapped from Kaitain, and this whole Kaitain subplot is pointless. It's plainly stated in Dune that Paul was born on Caladan, and his first time off-planet will be the crossing to Arrakis.
I could go on, but have been seriously mulling over starting a Dune thread in A&E. What with the movie coming out, there needs to be a place to discuss it.
I would be really shocked if any of the teabags I drink have microplastics in them. The bags are all made of paper. I do not doubt that plastic tea bags exist, but I am pretty sure non-plastic teabags also exist.
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
The discrepancies irked me too, I have no idea why they had to "go there". I did not have a great time w/ the House books like I said, they were the worst of the bunch. I'm glad I read the Butlerian ones first, they're a bit better.
Aaaaanyhow, yeah, I can't wait for that Dune movie. I also hope they end up making a sequel, because IIRC it's supposed to be only the first part of the story? So I will probably go out of my way to go see it in theatres. I hate theatres these days, it's not a fun experience, but I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is or whatever
This being the questions thread, I must now again ask why moths have powdery wings kthx
Aaaaanyhow, yeah, I can't wait for that Dune movie. I also hope they end up making a sequel, because IIRC it's supposed to be only the first part of the story? So I will probably go out of my way to go see it in theatres. I hate theatres these days, it's not a fun experience, but I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is or whatever
This being the questions thread, I must now again ask why moths have powdery wings kthx
JohannaK
Heroically Clueless
yeah the DUNE movie is supposed to be one of two parts.
I'll have to wait until it comes on TV. I literally haven't set foot in a theatre since last century.
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