Kozmos
Jew Detective
I'm pretty happy with EU legislation most of the time. There is still undue influence and some pretty obvious stupidities, but then I see how the rest of the world is doing and I am like, okay I can live with this.
What happened to Europe?
- Thread starter Hygro
- Start date
A major factor was that they were addicted to fuels coming from a belligerent neighbour (Russia). Their switch to a gold standard should have worked fine, but there was a major contagion placed into their system during the 2008 crisis, where you learn that not all debt leads to Schumpeterian growth.
The constant pressure from the south has been a constant thorn in trying to avoid racially unifying themes.
And we drove Winner from CFC somehow.
The constant pressure from the south has been a constant thorn in trying to avoid racially unifying themes.
And we drove Winner from CFC somehow.
FriendlyFire
Codex WMDicanious
There was a worldwide economic crash.
Obama followed Keynesian doctrine and used spending to quickly pull the U.S. out of recession.
Europe adopted Hoover-style austerity. Southern Europe fell into depressions. Northern Europe went through double- and triple-dip recessions. These nations are just starting to recover.
Inflationary economic policies are fine for the US but the price will be paid by inflation of the US dollar. The worse case would be like singapore which also did inflationary economic policies and is now at the very limit of hyper inflation and no more ammunition so to speak of if/when China bubble burst. Or Japan which has been trying stimulus but this isnt working is going to pay the price with inflation.
Germany on the other hand are huge savers, because of very low pensions everyone has to save euromonies. Plus German remembers what happens when hyper inflation happens. So Europe got Austerity
P.S PAY DEBTS !
GoodSarmatian
Jokerfied Western Male
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Expanded too much too qickly and the upkeep has become a problem.
Now we're waiting for the cottages to grow.
The saddest thing about this is that the Germany weathered the crisis so well because our government also used Keynesian stimulus programs, but then they demanded austerity from everybody else to satisfy the dept holders and score cheap political points.
Now we're waiting for the cottages to grow.
There was a worldwide economic crash.
Obama followed Keynesian doctrine and used spending to quickly pull the U.S. out of recession.
Europe adopted Hoover-style austerity. Southern Europe fell into depressions. Northern Europe went through double- and triple-dip recessions. These nations are just starting to recover.
The saddest thing about this is that the Germany weathered the crisis so well because our government also used Keynesian stimulus programs, but then they demanded austerity from everybody else to satisfy the dept holders and score cheap political points.
Bugfatty300
Buddha Squirrel
I must have missed that...
I must have missed that too.
But have you ever noticed how the water is slightly warmer than it was before?
I have noticed that, for one. It's called "Spring" and happens every year, no?
Bugfatty300
Buddha Squirrel
Mise
isle of lucy
Ditto. Says more about Hygro's perceptions of Europe than anything else.I must have missed that...
I must have missed that too.
Tahuti
Writing Deity
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Another thing I can think off is that the EU is in many respects more conservative than the US: The US has gay marriage across the country, the EU allows several member states to constitutionally limit marriage to two people of the opposite sex. Some individual EU states are relatively progressive, though most are significantly more conservative than the Reddest Red states, especially in Eastern Europe.
I think by late 2001, with the 9/11 attack and its aftermath, it was already clear for the keen observer that the wave of global optimism that dominated the 90's following the fall of the communist regimes was unfunded.
You're putting the cart before the horse there.
States allow the EU something, not the other way around.
The Europe took the peace and prosperity after the fall of communism for granted, and has been caught off guard in Ukraine and the middle east /north Africa.
Was it Monnet who said Europe would be forged in crisis.
FriendlyFire
Codex WMDicanious
Germany 87 Billion stimulus ?
You Poured some 57 Billion stimulus into Greece (euromonies not for banks, not to repay interest) And Greece economy is 2% of the EU while Germany economy is 22% of the EU.
If you want to try more stimulus again, I dont see why not Germany can afford it at the cost of inflation though
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_European_Union_stimulus_plan
Guess the AAA Nations are going to foot the bill for the Junk nations stimulus, This explains ECB purchasing Greece Bonds at 0.3% interest payable in 30 years time
BvBPL
Pour Decision Maker
Here are some possibilities:
- The initial Union, comprised of strong Western European states, looked a lot better than an expanded one including Eastern European states, much in the same way that taking California and New York as example states looks different from examining the whole of the US.
- The more laissez-faire economic and tax policies of the US allowed it to respond with more flexibility to changing economic concerns than the EU.
- The initial birth and growth of the Union paid off quick dividends rather than sustained growth.
- More porous borders following the expansion into the East allowed Eastern European citizens to move to the West, creating heavy drains on social welfare programs.
- The intangible sheen of fraternity that the EU had at the start has slowly faded in the light of Ireland and Britain’s popular movements to leave the Union.
- The higher number of better educated citizens in the US versus most of the EU has paid education dividends that the EU has not seen.
- The US has caught up to the liberal social interests initially more readily expressed in the EU as to things like gay rights.
Terxpahseyton
Nobody
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nvm..
There is no popular movement to leave in Ireland.
Can you quantify the education assertion?
The movement of people within the EU doesn't have much of an impact on social welfare programs as far as I know - people move to work, not to claim.
BvBPL
Pour Decision Maker
I was referring to the Irish vote on the EU constitution, a vote that was canceled when it was clear the citizenry would not support it.
As to education, the EU doesn't crack the top five in the OCED's rankings of tertiary education whereas the US is number four or five. The future prospect for most EU nations to catch up isn't promising either.
As to education, the EU doesn't crack the top five in the OCED's rankings of tertiary education whereas the US is number four or five. The future prospect for most EU nations to catch up isn't promising either.
GoodSarmatian
Jokerfied Western Male
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That's misleading because until about a decade ago there was no such thing as a bachelor's degree in Germany. If you went to University you got a Magister, Diplom or Staatsexamen depending on the subjuect, and those were all five year degrees.
For any job that would require a bachelor's but not a master's degree there was (and still is) a vocational training system. Future accountants first become accountant's apprentices, they don't get a trade-school-masquerading-as-a-university degree in accounting.
Mise
isle of lucy
It's also pretty unconvincing given that nearly all of the European countries there are +/- 4% of the US. And judging by the ages it looks like most countries have either caught up or surpassed the US already, so...
