2020 US Election (Part One)

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RE: "Biden did not say he would veto M4A"

Are you guys dense? Try reading between the lines sometime. This is just the absolute thinnest veneer of plausible deniability politician speak.

I was watching Sanders' town hall on FOX News and despite his persuasive abilities compared to some of the other Democrats he's really a one-note guy and takes every question back to one of two signature policies.

edit: I noticed too that his speech mannerisms remind me more and more of Larry David playing George Steinbrenner on Seinfeld. If Sanders would start talking about anything else besides politics, I might be inclined to vote for him.

I, too, hate it when my politicians, uhh, talk about politics.
 
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You don't beat anyone. It just gets tiresome for the other person, so they don't bother anymore.
A bit like Trump actually.
They are both boomers. I actually noticed that even the boomers who decry Trump every five minutes are in many ways behaving like Trump themselves: throwing tantrums, pettily attacking others, and, most importantly, completely lacking any self-awareness.

I am also seeing some boomers on Twitter saying that they will block anyone who brings up Biden's dementia... so they are going to just pretend like it's not there, surround themselves with their echo chamber where everyone agrees with them, and then be shocked when Trump wins and continue posting "orange man man" for another four years.
 
This is just another affirmation that Bernie has lost. It is also an affirmation to me that he did so well in 2016 not because of his views but because he was the only opposition to Clinton that got off the ground, and we SocDems/prog went wild with the chance. But that does not mean sniping for the presidency every four years. A whooping 40+ percent of 28 percent of this electorate is, evidently, very progressive.

It's time to get tactical, condense support bases and locales, keep churning out Reps and Senators, keep Red State Progs from disappearing, and augment the CPC in Congress just to keep pressing the issue. Bernie, for his lot, has no chance in this race and should return to Congress ASAP and work with Justice Dems and Our Revolution to, at least, not be reversed in any seats. Lest we want to end up like the Greens?
 
They are both boomers. I actually noticed that even the boomers who decry Trump every five minutes are in many ways behaving like Trump themselves: throwing tantrums, pettily attacking others, and, most importantly, completely lacking any self-awareness.

I am also seeing some boomers on Twitter saying that they will block anyone who brings up Biden's dementia... so they are going to just pretend like it's not there, surround themselves with their echo chamber where everyone agrees with them, and then be shocked when Trump wins and continue posting "orange man man" for another four years.

You realize that presenting blanket, uniform, unflattering stereotypes of generational age groups to make such slanderous and false attacks is no different than doing so based on race, ethnicity, nationality, gender/gender identity, sexual orientation, or social class. It's exactly the same phenomenon.
 
Wasn't he also instrumental in getting the ACA passed in the first place?

Thats gonna hurt him vs Trump... The 'revolt' against Obama that gave the GOP Congress was in reaction to a tax on people without insurance.

True. Everyone liked the benefits, but as usual USians want the benefits without paying for them.

I dont think the people paying the penalty were getting benefits. The penalty was meant to pay for the poor and to incentivize the uninsured deemed wealthy enough to buy insurance. The mandate hit mostly the middle-lower middle class who were forgoing insurance, it didn't give them coverage, just a tax bill.

Trying to tone police valid criticism of Biden by saying it will hurt him in the general is idiocy. That's what primaries are for. Vetting these candidates. Trump and the GOP are going to be way nastier than Bernie Bros. Biden supported wars that Trump slammed Hillary for. Biden supported trade deals that Trump slammed Hillary for. Biden has a sleazy brother and failson who've profited off of his career even before becoming VP. Biden's repeatedly talked about reducing entitlements. Biden's supported terrible bank legislation and deregulation. He authored a rotten to its core crime bill.

Dont even need to point out his brain rot to show hes a terrible candidate. The only reason it's a factor is because it makes him WORSE than Hillary. At least she was sharp enough to form rebuttals. I have no faith in Biden to be able to pull that off.

And Biden probably wont change federal marijuana policy either, not that Trump appears to care. But Biden is a hardcore drug warrior and I doubt he would have tried to get the First Step Act thru Congress. The only good thing I can see about Biden is he apparently advised Obama against Libya and Syria and was over ridden.
 
And Biden probably wont change federal marijuana policy either, not that Trump appears to care. But Biden is a hardcore drug warrior and I doubt he would have tried to get the First Step Act thru Congress. The only good thing I can see about Biden is he apparently advised Obama against Libya and Syria and was over ridden.

This is actually one issue where I'm prepared to give Biden a pass. If Jeff Sessions didn't put a stop to legal weed in the states, I highly doubt anyone appointed by Biden will.
 
This is just another affirmation that Bernie has lost. It is also an affirmation to me that he did so well in 2016 not because of his views but because he was the only opposition to Clinton that got off the ground, and we SocDems/prog went wild with the chance. But that does not mean sniping for the presidency every four years. A whooping 40+ percent of 28 percent of this electorate is, evidently, very progressive.
I wonder, how much of this may be due to the Democratic electorate not realizing how right-wing the Democratic Party has become? We all know the polls showing the electorate strongly in favor of "progressive" plans, so it seems a bit suspect to assume the electorate would then "knowingly" choose center or right of center politicians.

This is actually one issue where I'm prepared to give Biden a pass. If Jeff Sessions didn't put a stop to legal weed in the states, I highly doubt anyone appointed by Biden will.
Personally, I've actually become less enthusiastic about weed legalization over the last few years. Nobody is making you smoke it. Felony, or heck, even misdemeanor, is too much of a penalty though. Unless you are clearly doing drug trafficking with it, I would make it like a small speeding ticket in terms of severity.
 
I wonder, how much of this may be due to the Democratic electorate not realizing how right-wing the Democratic Party has become? We all know the polls showing the electorate strongly in favor of "progressive" plans, so it seems a bit suspect to assume the electorate would then "knowingly" choose center or right of center politicians.


Personally, I've actually become less enthusiastic about weed legalization over the last few years. Nobody is making you smoke it. Felony, or heck, even misdemeanor, is too much of a penalty though. Unless you are clearly doing drug trafficking with it, I would make it like a small speeding ticket in terms of severity.

Beating Trump seems to be the main goal.
 
Stupid people voting stupidly for nothing. Or in other words f*******%%^^^€<%^><<>|!{^*}k.

so old stupid senile racist bigot corporate ******* versus . . . Oh.
 
I'm not following turnout much but Biden is kicking butt in Michigan and 4 years ago Sanders cleaned Hillary's clock there, that suggests Biden will do better than Hillary in swing states.

I posted a video where he literally says he would veto any medicate for all bill. Not sure what your own issue with replying to what Biden said is, but it is pretty tiresome to act as you do. Biden claims he'd veto it to protect the healthcare you already have, to which it can be noted that millions in the Us do not have any healthcare.

I thought he was gonna argue against M4A to protect people who are happy with their current insurance but he launched into the cost instead.

9:40 into this one is the question and answer.


Yeah, he's not being too clear on that, I hope he'll flesh out his opposition better. But I am suspicious he's just playing word games because he's a corporate Democrat in the pocket of the insurance industry. What I dont understand is if M4A would cost 32-35 trillion over 10 years and we're already paying about 3.5 trillion a year for health care now it sounds like we'd cover the uninsured at no extra cost by eliminating the middle man.

I like the fact we'd eliminate any disadvantage American business faces by providing coverage for employees in addition to covering everyone - win win in my book. One of the problems I have with extrapolating M4A from Medicare as it exists now is the program's already subsidized by the market for other people. Non-recipients pay more to help cover costs for older, retired folk and then proponents tout Medicare's success without acknowledging that success is bought by people in the private market.

If it's between Trump and Biden, then Trump is the lesser evil. At least he will have only 4 years left, whereas Biden might potentially get 8 and do far more damage.

I cant see Biden running for re-election or undoing trade deals Trump negotiated and he's not much of a warmonger, so Biden's a relatively safe person for the WH even if his brain is running on fumes. And if he takes Klobuchar as his VP she'd be the fav for 2024... and she's not someone that concerns me.

That 35 trillion number is the one Biden keeps using. Not sure where he got it but even Fox News was using the 32 trillion figure a few months ago. Biden is essentially pushing a Republican talking point to undermine someone actually running on the left.

Does this mean the cost of M4A would be an additional 32-35 trillion on top of what we pay now? I was under the impression the cost of Sanders' program would be in place of current costs.

This is actually one issue where I'm prepared to give Biden a pass. If Jeff Sessions didn't put a stop to legal weed in the states, I highly doubt anyone appointed by Biden will.

Yeah, I dont see Biden reversing course on 'state's rights' when it comes to medical or even recreational pot, but the federal prohibition inhibits the ability of people to supplant the black market with a fully legal market.

Personally, I've actually become less enthusiastic about weed legalization over the last few years. Nobody is making you smoke it. Felony, or heck, even misdemeanor, is too much of a penalty though. Unless you are clearly doing drug trafficking with it, I would make it like a small speeding ticket in terms of severity.

You want to punish 'trafficking'? People need to be able to legally sell pot, anything short of legalization means we still have a drug war and a gateway to prison primarily for poor, black and brown people. If a state legalizes recreational use but still outlaws selling except for 'licensed dealers' while taxing the hell out of it the black market will still exist.

edit: all drugs need to be legalized, cocaine, meth, heroin... These are the prime sources of revenue for the cartels wreaking havoc in Latin America.
 
I, too, hate it when my politicians, uhh, talk about politics.
In an apolitical sense, I like Sanders as a charismatic figure. I just disagree with him on most issues.

Looks like Biden pulled off a win in Michigan. Looks like Joementum is unstoppable? Or maybe I just wanted to say “Joementum.”
 
The nominee, until now uncertain, has been positively Bidentified.

Will the Democrats strengthen their House lead in our Bidennial elections?
 
They are both boomers. I actually noticed that even the boomers who decry Trump every five minutes are in many ways behaving like Trump themselves: throwing tantrums, pettily attacking others, and, most importantly, completely lacking any self-awareness.

I am also seeing some boomers on Twitter saying that they will block anyone who brings up Biden's dementia... so they are going to just pretend like it's not there, surround themselves with their echo chamber where everyone agrees with them, and then be shocked when Trump wins and continue posting "orange man man" for another four years.
I'm not sure who your "They" is, but....

There are several parts to the Biden is losing his mind story.
  • When supporters of the 88 year old guy say the 86 year old guy is to old and gone to be president, well, there is something wrong there.
  • We can anticipate 7 more months of "Biden is senile" every day from Trump who also not all there.
  • More repetitions will not change anyone's mind.
  • Discussion of Biden's and Trump's mental state are fair game even on CFC
  • Most American's will tune the issue.
My personal objection to K's comments has been pretty clear. It involves several parts:
  • He does not actually want to discuss anything
  • He has been posting his anti Biden stuff to fan divisiveness among democrats as his entertainment
  • He claims to love Bernie, but doesn't enter into support Bernie discussions
  • We (US) do not need more drive by bomb throwers whose sole goal is to be disruptive. We can do that on our own thank you.
If he were a US voter with skin in the game I'd give him a pass, but he is not. He has been a useless agitator in our political discussions. The problem isn't that he is anti Biden; The problem is that he has been trying to stir up conflict between democrats.

This is an important election and the less outside interference the better.
 
Personally, I've actually become less enthusiastic about weed legalization over the last few years. Nobody is making you smoke it. Felony, or heck, even misdemeanor, is too much of a penalty though. Unless you are clearly doing drug trafficking with it, I would make it like a small speeding ticket in terms of severity.

Just treat it like alcohol, it's not that hard. in most places in the US you do get a ticket if you're drinking on the street, I'm fine with getting a ticket for smoking on the street.
 
I'd rather have no tickets for smoking OR drinking on the street. land of the free my ass.

although I can actually understand it more for smoking, at least smoking has secondhand smoke as a negative factor - what's drinking? oldschool puritan morality? drinking is a sin and nobody should see you do it in public? public drunkenness is fine, that can stay ticketed/illegal but open container for a legal adult is loads of bull. change my mind? I don't even drink except at home so no dog in this fight it just doesn't make sense to me.
 
If it's between Trump and Biden, then Trump is the lesser evil. At least he will have only 4 years left, whereas Biden might potentially get 8 and do far more damage.
How are you comparing the damage already done by Trump and the imagined damage that Biden might do?

Please list what you see as Trump's damage and what you see coming from Biden.

Also, It is unlikely that Biden will get through his first four years, let alone run again in 2024. His VP is likely to be the incumbent in 2024 and then have the chance of an 8 year run giving the Dems 12 year in total.
 
The nominee, until now uncertain, has been positively Bidentified.

Heh, I wonder what Biden's strategy will be in the chair vs. chair debate with no audience on Sunday.
2 hours of sitting and letting the CNN moderators carry him to victory?

Sanders has 120 minutes to turn it around or it is over.

538 has Biden's nomination at 99% or something right now.
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2020-primary-forecast/
 
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