2020 US Election (Part One)

[onejayhawk]

I don't think Ronald Reagan suffering from Alzheimer's disease should be the main or foremost of the objections to his being president.

True. Love him or hate him, he was one of the greatest leaders in US history. Why focus on the last few months when his health started to fail.

J

 

[caketastydelish]

"He was one of the greatest leaders in US history" isn't indisputable like a fact, this is your opinion.

 

[Berzerker]

Ronald Reagan stole our weapons and sold them to terrorists and gave the money to other terrorists

 

[Camikaze]

Moderator Action: This thread isn't about Ronald Reagan. Return to the topic of 2020 election please. If you wish to discuss Ronald Reagan, please feel free to create a separate thread for that purpose.

 

[AmazonQueen]

I don't think someone suffering from Alzheimer's disease should be allowed to be the President. Or if they develop the disease while in office they should be forced to resign and the let vice president or whoever the next up would be that is mentally stable enough to do the job.

FDR being in a wheelchair is different because that didn't affect his decision-making abilities.

Alzheimer's is a degenerative disease that takes time to have effects on someone. A blanket ban on its sufferers from political office regardless of the progression of the disease in their case would be most unfair.

 

[Zardnaar]

Alzheimer's is a degenerative disease that takes time to have effects on someone. A blanket ban on its sufferers from political office regardless of the progression of the disease in their case would be most unfair.

If it was me I would stand down and spend time with family etc.

 

[AmazonQueen]

If it was me I would stand down and spend time with family etc.

Having known people with Alzheimer's and seen a rapid deteriation in their mental state after they retired I'm not convinced that's the best thing for them to do.
It isn't a disease that affects everybody the same and at equal rates but it does seem that staying mentally active is an important part of fighting it.

 

[Zardnaar]

Having known people with Alzheimer's and seen a rapid deteriation in their mental state after they retired I'm not convinced that's the best thing for them to do.
It isn't a disease that affects everybody the same and at equal rates but it does seem that staying mentally active is an important part of fighting it.

PoTUS is a bit of an important job. If you start having signs it's time to go IMHO. That's why they wrote the 25th amendment.

 

[Kyriakos]

Having known people with Alzheimer's and seen a rapid deteriation in their mental state after they retired I'm not convinced that's the best thing for them to do.
It isn't a disease that affects everybody the same and at equal rates but it does seem that staying mentally active is an important part of fighting it.

Certainly. Yet a president should at least be reasonably healthy and not suffering from dementia.

 

[Zardnaar]

Interesting article. Warren picking up momentum in early states.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...945ae5db8fb_story.html?utm_term=.9fdd25c65d21

 

[AmazonQueen]

PoTUS is a bit of an important job. If you start having signs it's time to go IMHO. That's why they wrote the 25th amendment.

Certainly. Yet a president should at least be reasonably healthy and not suffering from dementia.

A president has regular health checkups.
If their health reaches a point where it impacts their ability to do the job then ofc they should resign or be removed from office but a diagnosis of Alzheimer's does not indicate that. A person who is diagnosed with Alzheimers will probably already have been suffering a slight degree of mental impairment for years. Of those diagnosed there seems to be a 10-15% chance per year of developing dementia.

 

[Socrates99]

All the Alzheimer's junk is completely irrelevant. My 96 year old grandma was mentally as sharp as ever right up until her last year. Bernie frequently has to prove his mental capability by deftly knocking down attacks from the right and the establishment. Watch his Fox town hall to see what I mean. The guy is showing zero signs of mental decay.

 

[onejayhawk]

"He was one of the greatest leaders in US history" isn't indisputable like a fact, this is your opinion.

It is an educated opinion.

Reagan's list of accomplishments is lengthy--tax reform, banking and monetary reform coordinated with other nations, ending the Cold War which led to the break up of USSR and unification of Germany, economic expansion, job growth, improved relations with GB and other countries. Some consider his ability to generate optimism to be his greatest achievement. Historians routinely consider him one of the most influential Presidents in history. There were, of course, problems. Ballooning deficits early in his term, a major scandal, failed to deal with the already existing immigration and border issues, etc. These are all facts.

Interesting article. Warren picking up momentum in early states.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...945ae5db8fb_story.html?utm_term=.9fdd25c65d21

This does seem to be the case. The newest Iowa poll shows here in statistical tie with Bernie and Mayor Pete. The same poll in March had her 16 pints back. A month ago all three were 7%+ ahead of her in the polling average. Since Biden is doing what any rational person would expect Biden to do, there is a genuine opportunity.

The first debate is less than two weeks. We will see what that shows.

J

Moderator Action: This post has been infracted for ignoring a moderator warning. On the last page, there was a clear moderator warning to leave the discussion of Ronald Reagan out of this thread. This warning was made because it is clearly a topic liable to cause a substantial derailment. Please ensure you pay attention to moderator warnings in future.
-Camikaze
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Narz]

Major new poll out. The Des Moines Register publishes the gold standard* of all political polls.

Biden has dropped back to the pack while Warren, Buttigieg and Bernie are neck and neck. This must be encouraging for Warren, because she had been a distant 4th in previous polls.
http://cdn.cnn.com/cnn/2019/images/06/07/top2_ia_saturday.pdf

It is important to note that this is a poll of politically active Democrats.

* Since Nate Silver gives this pollster his A+ rating, does that make it the silver standard?

J

I'd be happy to vote for Warren if I had to. I will sit out if Biden wins the primary.

Warren excites younger people/progressives in a way Hillary never did. As does Beto.

I don't see Beto exciting anyone intelligent. He's got as much substance as a Ms. America contender.

Bernie Sanders is too old to be the President; it doesn't matter how perfect he would have been in the past. I think it's worth noting that the average lifespan in America is 80 years old. Not saying he will die as soon as his first term is over, and I think he'll live to be 84, but someone at that age should not be making these kinds of decisions that would impact the whole country.

Lol, who cares about average? Rich people live way longer. Also, anyone can die any day. Just make sure he chooses a good vice.

Reagan had Alzheimer's during his second term. Was it really appropriate for someone like that to hold the highest office of the land? I frankly have a feeling a lot of entry-level jobs wouldn't even want you if you have those kinds of problems.

Trump has dementia right now. Anyway, I'm for Yang who's only 5 years older than me (44).

I've never heard of Buttigieg before but with a name like that it could hurt that person's electability (I am not completely joking... and especially if Trump is who you're running against. I can almost guarantee he would milk that all day and a not insignificant amount of people would eat it right up).

Yeah if I grew up gay with that last name you better believe I'd change it before age 13.

 

[Kyriakos]

All the Alzheimer's junk is completely irrelevant. My 96 year old grandma was mentally as sharp as ever right up until her last year. Bernie frequently has to prove his mental capability by deftly knocking down attacks from the right and the establishment. Watch his Fox town hall to see what I mean. The guy is showing zero signs of mental decay.

Bernie obviously isn't suffering from some mental illness, but the same cannot be said for (eg) Trump, Hillary or Biden.

 

[rah]

For Biden it really hasn't been a recent drop off. He's been like that for quite a while.

But I'd still vote for him over the Dumpster.

 

[Kyriakos]

For Biden it really hasn't been a recent drop off. He's been like that for quite a while.

But I'd still vote for him over the Dumpster.

As long as he doesn't become potus and THEN turns into something like the late Mccain, it wouldn't be that harmful.
But can you image Mccain as potus, if he was like he ended up being?

 

[Socrates99]

I'm not even sure Biden's losing it. I think he just uses age as an excuse for doing dumb stuff.

 

[rah]

Can't lose what you never had.

 

[metalhead]

Can't lose what you never had.

It amazes me that Joe Biden has run two previous disorganized, gaffe-filled, nonsensical presidential campaigns, and yet people are expressing surprise at how inept his campaign is. We should have been expecting this from day one.