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Brexit Thread V - The Final Countdown?!?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by uppi, Dec 12, 2018.

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  1. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Warlord

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    ".... it is just needed"
    Which should be a reason for the EU to pay part of the payroll of those people in the army.
     
  2. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

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    As long as it doesnt ask to turn them to a goth police force in return. Or expeditionary "peace-keepers" in africa :)
     
  3. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Warlord

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    Nothing of that kind indeed.
    And certainly not a part of the army fully paid by the EU (loyalties must be clear, and in armies ranks and loyalties must even be crystal clear).

    What I favor is paying a share of the payroll never higher than 50% for all army ranks from soldier to sergeant-major (not higher ranks).
    And enough ammo, petrol, diesel etc to make sure that these people are well trained instead of reading dirty magazines near a coffee machine or doing stupid procedural stuff to "save cost".
    The total amount per country by some agreed total EU budget and distribution formula between countries. And not at peanut level. Say something like typical 20-30% of the salaries of the low ranks.

    And the same for Romania, Hungary, Slovakia, Poland, the Baltic, Finland.
     
  4. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

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    The baltic should be easy. Lithuania-estonia-latvia have literally one tank between the three of them. They share it like the three graeae did with their one tooth, eye and -iirc- ear :D
     
  5. RRRaskolnikov

    RRRaskolnikov Goldfish

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    Excuse me, that's just a best of (I can be a demaguogue too).
    You got a fair point about CFA Franc, but the rest is just paranoiac delirium (you forgot to mention the treaty was signed in Aachen, how suspucious is that)... unless you think securing gaz/oil sources for Total is a crime against humanity.

    But maybe it's a joke?
     
  6. Mega Tsunami

    Mega Tsunami Chieftain

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    So why would the Guardian, of all papers, say this.

    To understand Juncker's improbable rise, it is necessary to go back to the 2009 Lisbon Treaty. The former Luxembourg prime minister landed the job by an overwhelming majority because national leaders [Brown in our case] sleepwalked into a trap laid by federalist schemers in the European parliament and could not summon the will to do anything about it, just as they appear to have overlooked reading the fine print of the legal text that governs Europe.
    A catalogue of complacency, negligence, miscalculation and manoeuvring by national leaders over the past nine months conspired to deliver an outcome no one really wanted – Jean-Claude Juncker, Europe's accidental president.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/27/eu-democratic-bandwagon-juncker-president-wanted


    And there is nothing we can do about it. Except Leave. Something I hope we will be doing in a few months time.
     
  7. Arakhor

    Arakhor Dremora Courtier Moderator

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    You'd have to ask the man who wrote it. He died in 2016.
     
  8. Lexicus

    Lexicus Warlord

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    Maybe you can explain for me what the EU actually had to do with austerity in the UK?

    The UK has zero reason to blame the EU for austerity in the UK. Unfortunately, Greece can essentially blame austerity in Greece entirely on the EU.
     
  9. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Warlord

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    Also from that article:

    "On May 27 two days after the election, the leaders dined in Brussels to chew over their predicament. Van Rompuy was told to fix it. Merkel suppressed demands for an immediate vote on the Juncker nomination, playing for time. Cameron rolled out his big weapon – if Juncker gets it, Britain might well quit the EU. The shock-and-awe tactics did not work".

    Just imagine...
    you play in the local football team, and there is this prima donna, little Cameron, who is never on the trainings, and announces just before the match that he only plays if he is at the number 10 position.
     
  10. AdrienIer

    AdrienIer Chieftain

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    If Finland is attacked by Russia and France doesn't send help there will be huge protests (and I'll be in them).
     
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  11. Lexicus

    Lexicus Warlord

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    Why not just volunteer?
     
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  12. Broken_Erika

    Broken_Erika Nothing

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    Come on! It's the future of law enforcement!
     
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  13. Yeekim

    Yeekim Warlord

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    As if there was any other realistic solution to the situation...
     
  14. Mega Tsunami

    Mega Tsunami Chieftain

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    Speak for yourself. They worked for me. ;)
     
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  15. Yeekim

    Yeekim Warlord

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    Miscalculation, negligence, complacency, maneuvering and an entirely transparent democratic procedure ... sounds like the same stuff brought us Juncker and Brexit both.
     
  16. Arakhor

    Arakhor Dremora Courtier Moderator

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    So, you do know at least one Briton who's done more for Brexit than Juncker. Colour me flabbergasted at this sudden turn of events.
     
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  17. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Warlord

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    And not to forget Barnier as negotiator for Brexit
    Barnier was the contender for Juncker
    Perhaps Juncker as negotiator was better ? :lol:
     
  18. Lexicus

    Lexicus Warlord

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    Right, exactly. If you're economically illiterate and believe austerity to be technically necessary in some sense, then you can minimize the importance of the fact that the EU very obviously forced these national governments into policies that were rejected by the populations the national governments were supposedly serving.

    But I'm not economically illiterate, and I'm here to tell you that far from being a "realistic solution to the situation" austerity simply made "the situation" worse, as it was undoubtedly intended to do. Austerity failed on its own terms of making the government of Greece better able to pay back its debt. That is what it always does, because there is no way to pay back a debt by contracting GDP and destroying the ability to repay it.

    The "realistic solution," if anyone was actually worried about Greece repaying its debt, would be what historically has been done in every analogous situation: write off some of the value of the debt to bring the principal down to a manageable level, and draw up interest rate terms that actually allow the government in question to keep up with payments.

    But that wasn't on the table, because the real reason for austerity was not technical, it was political: namely, that in the EU the banks which were the creditors of the Greek government have political power, but the Greek people have none. The Greek 'debt crisis' was seen as an opportunity to enforce the standard neoliberal agenda on Greece, to redistribute tremendous amounts of wealth from the Greek population to the government's creditors.
     
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  19. Arakhor

    Arakhor Dremora Courtier Moderator

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    How many more times do I need to ask people to start a flaming thread about the Greek debt crisis if you must, but stop bringing it up here?!
     
  20. Lexicus

    Lexicus Warlord

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    The Greek debt crisis is patently relevant to Brexit.
     
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