Greece - Antiquity Age Civilization Discussion

[Zaarin]

This is the latest I could find on the general internet referencing the study I saw in brief in one of my Archeology magazines:

Indo-European languages: new study reconciles two dominant hypotheses about their origin

Using data from over 160 languages, a new study explains where, when and how Indo-European languages spread across Europe and Asia.

theconversation.com

To summarize, this data is from a more recent study done in Germany that referenced a much wider range of linguistic samples. From this article, it appears that the tentative conclusion was that Proto-Indo-European originated about 6000 BCE in the south Caucasus/eastern Anatolia region and from there spread in all directions: west into eastern Anatolia and ultimately Greece and the Balkans, north to the Pontic Steppe from which a secondary spread took it into central Europe several thousand years later, and east into (modern) Iran and India.

From the article:

This data then underwent a Bayesian phylogenetic analysis

Yeah, this is the part I was discussing as a methodological issue that has largely contributed to the decline of support for the Anatolian hypothesis (along with mounting linguistic and genetic evidence for the Kurgan hypothesis). Bayesian analysis just isn't good linguistics (and has also led to other nonsense theories like Nostratic, Altaic, or Greenberg's notorious "Amerind." NB Greenberg was not a crackpot, just completely out of his depth when it came to American languages.)

 

[j51]

This is the latest I could find on the general internet referencing the study I saw in brief in one of my Archeology magazines:

Indo-European languages: new study reconciles two dominant hypotheses about their origin

Using data from over 160 languages, a new study explains where, when and how Indo-European languages spread across Europe and Asia.

theconversation.com

To summarize, this data is from a more recent study done in Germany that referenced a much wider range of linguistic samples. From this article, it appears that the tentative conclusion was that Proto-Indo-European originated about 6000 BCE in the south Caucasus/eastern Anatolia region and from there spread in all directions: west into eastern Anatolia and ultimately Greece and the Balkans, north to the Pontic Steppe from which a secondary spread took it into central Europe several thousand years later, and east into (modern) Iran and India.

That might be what I was thinking of. I’m not sure. I thought it was saying that Yamnaya came after Anatolian split from the rest of like a pre-proto Indo-European somewhere in or near the Caucasus. (Sorry for the edits. I’m way out of my domain with this stuff.)

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

From the article:

Yeah, this is the part I was discussing as a methodological issue that has largely contributed to the decline of support for the Anatolian hypothesis (along with mounting linguistic and genetic evidence for the Kurgan hypothesis). Bayesian analysis just isn't good linguistics (and has also led to other nonsense theories like Nostratic, Altaic, or Greenberg's notorious "Amerind." NB Greenberg was not a crackpot, just completely out of his depth when it came to American languages.)

This is the first I'd seen that they used Beysian Analysis in the study, and it bothers me, too, but their tentative conclusions seem to have been largely based on the linguistic and genetic database. Unfortunately, the basic study was done in Europe and is not readily available to me - not being a member of the academic community with a University behind me, I'd have to pay major subscription fees to get access to even on-line versions of the relevant journals.

 

[j51]

This one is most likely it. It’s cited in the article you linked, Boris. Edit: wait it’s not. No wait it is the same. It is different! (I’m on fire with stupidity today lol.) https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abm4247

 

[j51]

I’m not trying to closely read both articles and tease the differences right now. I’m way too out of it!